Stave makin :) and a bit of tillering.

[dwardo]

So mine here looks like its over 90 degrees from tip too string? Thus the tips shouldn't flex anywhere near that much?I'll have another go take my time a bit more thanks for the info mate

When you see short bows with long draw lengths they tend to have recurved tips to help with string angle. Drawing out to the ear and tall guys with long arms are better off with a much longer bow.
If you dont already have them then try and get copies of the "Bowyers bibles" They will answer questions you had not even pondered yet.

Main thing is to just keep making bows and enjoying it. My first couple of bows did nawt besides keep me warm as i burnt the broken bits.

 

[Alreetmiowdmuka]

Is that your usual anchor point?
Looks a long way back to me but I'm a corner of the mouth kinda guy. Have met others who draw to their ear so I know some do, just mentioned it as the bow wouldn't look so maxed out with a shorter draw length.

Nice haul Dwardo.
I'll be helping my dad bring down an ash at the bottom of the garden in the next wee while. Hard to see the trunk at the moment as it's crowded by the hawthorn hedge but I'm hoping there'll be a few staves there. One or two of the branches look promising too.

I 'm a total novice too the making and shooting of bows.ive read that you should find a place ie the corner of you mouth and always draw too their but my brain keeps telling me too draw further back n try too stare down the arrow shaft for aim.

 

[Alreetmiowdmuka]

When you see short bows with long draw lengths they tend to have recurved tips to help with string angle. Drawing out to the ear and tall guys with long arms are better off with a much longer bow.
If you dont already have them then try and get copies of the "Bowyers bibles" They will answer questions you had not even pondered yet.

Main thing is to just keep making bows and enjoying it. My first couple of bows did nawt besides keep me warm as i burnt the broken bits.

Bowyers bibles are going on the Christmas list.. Gonna try a few sapling bows I think before I go anywhere near a stave.a sincere thanks for your advice n time ps can yer post any pics of some finished bows just too wet mi appetite like

 

[Grooveski]

I 'm a total novice too the making and shooting of bows.ive read that you should find a place ie the corner of you mouth and always draw too their but my brain keeps telling me too draw further back n try too stare down the arrow shaft for aim.

It's hard to say "don't do something" in archery because so much is down to the individual and where you feel comfortable.
You need an anchor point of some description. Whether it's corner of mouth, cheekbone, breastplate, ear...
...with my target bow I slip my thumb under my chin and draw until the string touches the tip of my nose.
....I've a pal who short-draws. His anchor is the back of his wrist against his chin.
It's all good and everyone has to find their own style.

There are a couple of drawbacks to overdrawing(or what I'd think of as overdrawing).

First is the pain factor. The more body parts you draw the string past the more chances there are of it hitting one of them on it's way back. Nipple and nose are the two favorites and neither is much fun.

Secondly it limits your further options of style. After your first nipple catch you'll likely never try to cant the bow again.
Canting the bow does a few things. It clears the sight picture of the top limb, stops the arrow trying to fall off your hand while you're drawing and perhaps most importantly(although it's a subtle thing) it staightens up the apparent angle of the arrow.
The arrow's down the bottom of your sight picture right under your dominant eye with the nock and point lined up to the target. With the right arrows it practically removes the side-side part of the aim from your thought leaving you just the distance judgement to consider. If you then find the bow's point-on distance(where the point obscures the target in your sight picture) you're a lot of the way towards getting to grips with that particular bow.

[Edit] Thirdly the tension involved when releasing is different from that while you're drawing the bow. It's not done through the arms but rather by kind of squeezing your shoulderblades together. It's not to say you won't be able to do this while overdrawing but there is a comfortable range and for most folk it coincides with an anchor around the mouth or cheek.

 

[dwardo]

Bowyers bibles are going on the Christmas list.. Gonna try a few sapling bows I think before I go anywhere near a stave.a sincere thanks for your advice n time ps can yer post any pics of some finished bows just too wet mi appetite like

To be honest wood is wood so what ever you manage to get hold of just get stuck in
I had no idea of archers paradox when i first started playing and used alloy tube for shafts. Had no idea where or how to draw properly.
For pictures of bows just have a search about on here for others bows too.

 

[Alreetmiowdmuka]

It's hard to say "don't do something" in archery because so much is down to the individual and where you feel comfortable.
You need an anchor point of some description. Whether it's corner of mouth, cheekbone, breastplate, ear...
...with my target bow I slip my thumb under my chin and draw until the string touches the tip of my nose.
....I've a pal who short-draws. His anchor is the back of his wrist against his chin.
It's all good and everyone has to find their own style.

There are a couple of drawbacks to overdrawing(or what I'd think of as overdrawing).

First is the pain factor. The more body parts you draw the string past the more chances there are of it hitting one of them on it's way back. Nipple and nose are the two favorites and neither is much fun.

Secondly it limits your further options of style. After your first nipple catch you'll likely never try to cant the bow again.
Canting the bow does a few things. It clears the sight picture of the top limb, stops the arrow trying to fall off your hand while you're drawing and perhaps most importantly(although it's a subtle thing) it staightens up the apparent angle of the arrow.
The arrow's down the bottom of your sight picture right under your dominant eye with the nock and point lined up to the target. With the right arrows it practically removes the side-side part of the aim from your thought leaving you just the distance judgement to consider. If you then find the bow's point-on distance(where the point obscures the target in your sight picture) you're a lot of the way towards getting to grips with that particular bow.

[Edit] Thirdly the tension involved when releasing is different from that while you're drawing the bow. It's not done through the arms but rather by kind of squeezing your shoulderblades together. It's not to say you won't be able to do this while overdrawing but there is a comfortable range and for most folk it coincides with an anchor around the mouth or cheek.

Arr I see doing it in that way will bring the draw length right down which would in turn decrease the angle of the string in the tips ie what dwardo has described thus lowering the stack.wow! Lots too think about their thanks a billion

 

[dwardo]

Ayup,

This is a wych elm bow that was the deflexed half of the last one I made. Its been half tillered for an age but its been a while since I have been fighting fit so in the corner it stayed. The deflexed half of a small diameter sapling tends to want for different things when trying to become a bow.
I heated in some deflex in the inners to match up the limbs and flipped the tips short and quite sharp.
It has taken about an inch of set so far and is a heavy 60lbs at 25 inches so far. I intend to heat treat it once more maybe and then finish it up. It seems to bend a little more in the mid top limb but it feels right in the hand. I had a more pleasing to the eye tiller on the board but just wrong in the hand?
PS if all this is jibberish please just ask for definitions .

Deflex with tips popped up.

Braced

Drawn.

 

[Cromm]

Nice work.

 

[dwardo]

Nearly there, now the elbow is complying again.

Tiller is close to finished and its pulling about 68lbs at 26 inches. Couple of little corrections needed but close. Also need to correct string alignment again! as my vise broke Luckily not my grandads one.

How i correct the string angle at the handle.

Nearly there full draw. You can almost hear my shoulder pop Probably about 25 inches here as its hard to get into lock and get a shot at the same time.

 

[yarrow]

Now that's the kind of draw weight I think you really start to see what a all wood bows can do. I bet that spits an arrow out, I can't see your fingers in the pic but I bet you could only manage about three or four shot out of that bad boy before your fingers started bleeding, even with a glove my 70lb bow hurts my finger tips after a couple of shots.

 

[dwardo]

Now that's the kind of draw weight I think you really start to see what a all wood bows can do. I bet that spits an arrow out, I can't see your fingers in the pic but I bet you could only manage about three or four shot out of that bad boy before your fingers started bleeding, even with a glove my 70lb bow hurts my finger tips after a couple of shots.

Ayup boss. Some of the same wych elm here waiting for you
Yeah its tough on the fingers but for me much tougher on the lats traps n shoulder muscles. Not had many arrows through this yet as the string alignment was at the right edge of the handle making spine a disaster especially give the weight. It has however had lots of time on the board where its only taking about an inch of set from the original deflex. Blasted it again today and moved the alignment over to just left of center. Much better results than when the vice snapped lol.
I have been recording the bounce back after moving with heat and it is pretty much half of the amount moved to the millimetre. This one with heat was moved just over 15mm and kept about 8.
This wych elm really is great stuff especially with heat and trapping if not already trapped due to a high crown. There is nawt of this thing and it would be well over 70lb at 28. Talking of the weight I desperately need to start evening up muscle balance as my right lat is twice the size of my left and its starting to look odd not to mention the consequences.

 

[Alreetmiowdmuka]

Looks a beast yer obviously very skilled.can I ask do you always reflex the tips that much.do yer have a standard angle yer use on every bow or is that something you'd way up while tillering pal

 

[dwardo]

Looks a beast yer obviously very skilled.can I ask do you always reflex the tips that much.do yer have a standard angle yer use on every bow or is that something you'd way up while tillering pal

There are loads of reflex and deflex combos to try with varying degrees of angle and length, thats half the fun
I have a couple of forms to apply the re-curves some more extreme than others. The idea of the shorter recurves or "static" none bending recurves at the tips is to act as a kind of lever making the draw of the bow smoother and easier and also to avoid stacking especially on shorter bows. The problem with static re-curves is making them as light as possible without them bending. The more mass you have at the tips the slower the arrow will be. Think bullwhip, no good having a load of weigh at the tips.

 

[Ivan...]

I really must broaden my search criteria! There is so much that i miss, because i don't trawl like i should, i think after a while we have favourite headings and threads that we visit.

Lovely posting Dwardo, from now on i will spend a little more time having a look around.

Atb.

Ivan...

PS, usually busy posting my own rubbish and ramblings!

 

[dwardo]

PS, usually busy posting my own rubbish and ramblings!

As do we all, thats what makes this place great.

 

[Alreetmiowdmuka]

Yep you de man dwardo

 

[dwardo]

Few sneak pictures. Almost done just need to fit a little arrow shelf insert and make a new string but,, I cant do this until I can tune the bow and I cant do this until my shot elbow heals. Wont be shooting this thing for a while which is a shame as its a rocket launcher at this weight. Gives me time to do some other crafty things other than bowyery

 

[Clouston98]

That is amazing and completely brilliant! I want one, and have now got to spend time persuading myself I don't need one! Even though I secretly do.

I will have to go on a bow making course someday!

 

[Everything Mac]

Just give it to me mate. I'll look after it.

looks cracking as always big man. Hope the elbow is healing!
Andy

 

[yarrow]

Nice job on the finishing mate, love the colour & the makers stamp on the handle just tops it off. I have just finished a little boo backed laburnum, I should post some pictures before I sell it. Hope that elbow sorts itself out soon.