Wounds.
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As well as the plaintain already mentioned, one VERY old method of dealing with minor cuts is to use lichen as a pad (apperently it has an anti-septic effect?) and cover the wound with cobwebs. We all know how sticky those things are. Cobwebs were the original band-aid, so even if your are caught out without a FAK, you can still treat basic injuries in the wild.
I use Histoacryl tissue adhesive in casualty quite a lot, especially for children. It smells like superglue, but it's blue. It certainly does not replace sutures - large wounds, or those over joints are often best sutured.
You put it on the wound surface, not into the wound itself.
The trial evidence shows that the rate of wound breakdown is slightly higher with tissue adhesive compared to suturing.
Other good options for wound closure include Leukostrips/steristrips and, for scalp wounds, tying the hair on each side of the wound together.
Of course, the most important point about incised wounds is proper assessment to exclude injury to important structures (ie tendons, vessels and nerves) and proper cleansing. That matters more than how you close the wound.
You put it on the wound surface, not into the wound itself.
The trial evidence shows that the rate of wound breakdown is slightly higher with tissue adhesive compared to suturing.
Other good options for wound closure include Leukostrips/steristrips and, for scalp wounds, tying the hair on each side of the wound together.
Of course, the most important point about incised wounds is proper assessment to exclude injury to important structures (ie tendons, vessels and nerves) and proper cleansing. That matters more than how you close the wound.
Well I stand by to be flamed here but .....
While I 100% agree that a first aid kit is only common sense if you're setting out to do some serious cutting or heading more than a couple of hours out, I definately see it as a convenience not a necessity on anything under a day.
Look at it like this: all that really matters on a day trip is being able to stop significant bleeding until you can get expert help. And be able to summon help if you break something along the way and get immobilised.
Plasters, antiseptics, etc just aren't that important. The only thing in a first aid kit that's likely to make a difference in a real emergency is something the size of a battlefield dressing or superglue - otherwise use the shirt ! (though the pocket lining trick is truly inspired).
My reasoning ? I carry a knife 18 hours a day 364 days out of 365, and use it almost every day. I don't and never will carry a first aid kit for more than a tiny fraction of this time. I also take far more cuts - invariably small, sometimes deep - off my spyderco pocketknives and chisels than I do off my woodlore.
I have a tendency to faint at needles and a few minutes after cutting myself, so my personal recipe is suck and spit, let the thing bleed to try and clean it out, then get direct pressure on, elevate the hand and lie down before I fall down. On a little cut, patching comes later, if it was a big cut I'd be hollering and ripping my shirt without a second's thought !
Here's to living dangerously :-D
While I 100% agree that a first aid kit is only common sense if you're setting out to do some serious cutting or heading more than a couple of hours out, I definately see it as a convenience not a necessity on anything under a day.
Look at it like this: all that really matters on a day trip is being able to stop significant bleeding until you can get expert help. And be able to summon help if you break something along the way and get immobilised.
Plasters, antiseptics, etc just aren't that important. The only thing in a first aid kit that's likely to make a difference in a real emergency is something the size of a battlefield dressing or superglue - otherwise use the shirt ! (though the pocket lining trick is truly inspired).
My reasoning ? I carry a knife 18 hours a day 364 days out of 365, and use it almost every day. I don't and never will carry a first aid kit for more than a tiny fraction of this time. I also take far more cuts - invariably small, sometimes deep - off my spyderco pocketknives and chisels than I do off my woodlore.
I have a tendency to faint at needles and a few minutes after cutting myself, so my personal recipe is suck and spit, let the thing bleed to try and clean it out, then get direct pressure on, elevate the hand and lie down before I fall down. On a little cut, patching comes later, if it was a big cut I'd be hollering and ripping my shirt without a second's thought !
Here's to living dangerously :-D
I think it depends who you're with - I don't carry much of anything when out and about on my own, but if I've got small kiddies in tow (happening more and more as they get bigger, thankfully!) then I stock up, especially on antiseptic wipes and plasters. They always graze, cut, and otherwise injure themselves, and a quick wipe and a plaster makes them feel better! They then forget all about it and get into the next scrape...
i agree with alick,i dont carry a first aid kit with me because i dont intend to get cut or injured,and i work with sharp edges all the time.familiarity and understanding of knives and axes go a long long way towards prevention of accidents.
if i carried everything i would need "just in case" something happened, id need a pack of donkeys with me.
as the guy from fantastic four says...flame on... :-D
and who can forget that line from predator..i aint got time to bleed...
if i carried everything i would need "just in case" something happened, id need a pack of donkeys with me.
as the guy from fantastic four says...flame on... :-D
and who can forget that line from predator..i aint got time to bleed...
the naughty boy said:i agree with alick,i dont carry a first aid kit with me because i dont intend to get cut or injured
. . . and who can forget that line from predator..i aint got time to bleed...
And the Murphy's are a band of optimists. :roll:
Let's hope your never unfortunate enough to see how wonderful hind sight is!
But as we're quoting movies - Obi Wan Kenobi, "Who's more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows the fool?"
But as we're quoting movies - Obi Wan Kenobi, "Who's more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows the fool?"
I believe that people should carry first aid kits when in the wilds, you may not use it on yourself, but you may have to use it on others.
I have dealt with injuries that have happened to other people more often than I have done with myself, "parang rash" and an axe wound that a friend recieved when limbing a tree after the storms in 1987 could not of been dealt with without a comprehensive first aid kit.
Murphy's law states that all that can go wrong will.
So by carrying a first aid kit you narrow the list of things that can go wrong, good health.
I have dealt with injuries that have happened to other people more often than I have done with myself, "parang rash" and an axe wound that a friend recieved when limbing a tree after the storms in 1987 could not of been dealt with without a comprehensive first aid kit.
Murphy's law states that all that can go wrong will.
So by carrying a first aid kit you narrow the list of things that can go wrong, good health.
aww well,intention is cause.
hey tahawk,have you ever had a nasty cut?
sometimes it goes with a pessimistic attitude toward life.
ever noticed how bright happy people are rarely ill or have accidents?well im in that band. :-D
its also true that the more attention you put on something ,the more likely it is to happen.
im not stopping anyone carrying a first aid kit,im fact there are some who i think it would be disastrous for them not to carry one!
i,ll let you know if it happens and you can all have a good laugh and make yourselves right at my expensive chaps,but dont hold your breath
[ps murphys law was made up by some people to explain their own screw ups and is little more than an excuse for irresponsibility ]
try catching an envelope droped between your finger and thumb by someone else..if you can catch it ,then well done...if you cant -carry a first aid kit.
good point leon about others though and justification indeed for the need to carry a kit .
also heres a tip...you,ve seen someone who has been cut trying to keep the injury away from everything? try gently touching things with the injured area,it brings the body back into communication with the injured area and helps the healing process.some people find the original pain flashes up then recedes rapidly and completly dissapears. :-D
hey tahawk,have you ever had a nasty cut?
sometimes it goes with a pessimistic attitude toward life.
ever noticed how bright happy people are rarely ill or have accidents?well im in that band. :-D
its also true that the more attention you put on something ,the more likely it is to happen.
im not stopping anyone carrying a first aid kit,im fact there are some who i think it would be disastrous for them not to carry one!
i,ll let you know if it happens and you can all have a good laugh and make yourselves right at my expensive chaps,but dont hold your breath
[ps murphys law was made up by some people to explain their own screw ups and is little more than an excuse for irresponsibility
]try catching an envelope droped between your finger and thumb by someone else..if you can catch it ,then well done...if you cant -carry a first aid kit.
good point leon about others though and justification indeed for the need to carry a kit .
also heres a tip...you,ve seen someone who has been cut trying to keep the injury away from everything? try gently touching things with the injured area,it brings the body back into communication with the injured area and helps the healing process.some people find the original pain flashes up then recedes rapidly and completly dissapears. :-D
I really find it hard to believe that people with self professed experience using cutting tools would choose not to carry a first aid kit. Naughty boy: (i dont carry a first aid kit with me because i dont intend to get cut or injured,and i work with sharp edges all the time.familiarity and understanding of knives and axes go a long long way towards prevention of accidents.) Of course NO ONEintends to get cut or injured but accidents can happen even to the most experienced woodsman. I agree with Leon-1
If you pack any type of cutting tool, then you pack your first aid kit too.
What if you go out in the morning planning a day out in the woods, you cut yourself quite deeply. Many plants carry bacteria noticeably Blackthorn. The wound will need to be disinfected, dressed, and you can carry on with your day. A small FAK with some small dressings/plasters antiseptic cream is no weight at all to carry, and rather than being something someone with a pessimistic attitude would carry, I believe it would be carried by someone who was switched on with common sense.
Just my view on this
If you pack any type of cutting tool, then you pack your first aid kit too.
What if you go out in the morning planning a day out in the woods, you cut yourself quite deeply. Many plants carry bacteria noticeably Blackthorn. The wound will need to be disinfected, dressed, and you can carry on with your day. A small FAK with some small dressings/plasters antiseptic cream is no weight at all to carry, and rather than being something someone with a pessimistic attitude would carry, I believe it would be carried by someone who was switched on with common sense.
Just my view on this
falling rain said:
Quite right - blackthorn is not to be messed with because it is covered in an algae that turns septic easily. I knew someone who lost a finger due to it because the infection got so bad it had to be amputated ... all for a thorn! Carry a needle and tweezers with you for removal of thorns.
I agree, although I'm no fan of antiseptic creams and much prefer wipes or liquids.
Ultimately though, whether you carry a kit or not is none of my business, I ain't your mama! I do and have been glad of it (as have others who didn't have a kit with them). But that's just me ...
Wow, this thread has evolved (devolved?) a lot since I checked it last.
Naughtydude said:
:shock:
You're joking right?
I've seen plenty of bright happy people have accidents......bad and life changing accidents. I could certainly tell some examples if you'd like?
While I agree that a positive mental attitude will go a long way to prevent an illness, I can't see how it prevents accidents? :?:
Look, it's pretty simple. I'll respect anyone's opinion that they don't need a FAK with them in the woods. Even more, knowledge will carry you much farther than any first aid kit will. Those that carry neither in the woods often become statistics. Going on a long trip in the woods without a FAK is like going boating without a lifejacket. Sure you'll probably not need it, but if you do, you'll probably need it bad!
I often go to some pretty remote places, first aid may often be the only aid that a member of my party may recieve for days, and at very worst weeks. If someone is gong on a walk in the back yard, sure I don't see the need for a FAK if you can just walk home and call 112. I'd tailor the FAK around the activity.
Naughtydude said:
:shock:
You're joking right?
I've seen plenty of bright happy people have accidents......bad and life changing accidents. I could certainly tell some examples if you'd like?
While I agree that a positive mental attitude will go a long way to prevent an illness, I can't see how it prevents accidents? :?:
Look, it's pretty simple. I'll respect anyone's opinion that they don't need a FAK with them in the woods. Even more, knowledge will carry you much farther than any first aid kit will. Those that carry neither in the woods often become statistics. Going on a long trip in the woods without a FAK is like going boating without a lifejacket. Sure you'll probably not need it, but if you do, you'll probably need it bad!
I often go to some pretty remote places, first aid may often be the only aid that a member of my party may recieve for days, and at very worst weeks. If someone is gong on a walk in the back yard, sure I don't see the need for a FAK if you can just walk home and call 112. I'd tailor the FAK around the activity.
oooh i say ,calm down people,
seems my comments carried quite a bit of impact. :-D perhaps some recognise themselves in those comments but hey,its a free country and i gotta refer you to my signature
although im touched by your concern :rolmao:
wayne,you cant have my kit unless you have a FAK m8
still trying to work out the fuel analogy :shock:
obviously if i did get a bad cut or axe wound im sure i could fashion something out of paracord and bogroll,two items i always carry,i also carry some ducktape and an army scrim scarf.there is a small tube of superglue in my survival tin too !
so whadda ya know...i have a first aid kit and didnt even know it.it just dosent contain elastoplast in nice paper wrappers.........
isnt bushcraft about survival and resourcefulness in the field with whats around you?.I.Q is measured by your ability to pose,percieve and resolve problems toward survival. :-D
seems my comments carried quite a bit of impact. :-D perhaps some recognise themselves in those comments but hey,its a free country and i gotta refer you to my signature
although im touched by your concern :rolmao:
wayne,you cant have my kit unless you have a FAK m8
still trying to work out the fuel analogy :shock:
obviously if i did get a bad cut or axe wound im sure i could fashion something out of paracord and bogroll,two items i always carry,i also carry some ducktape and an army scrim scarf.there is a small tube of superglue in my survival tin too !
so whadda ya know...i have a first aid kit and didnt even know it.it just dosent contain elastoplast in nice paper wrappers.........
isnt bushcraft about survival and resourcefulness in the field with whats around you?.I.Q is measured by your ability to pose,percieve and resolve problems toward survival. :-D
the better your knowledge of bushcraft the less you have to carry
"carry less by knowing more"
however this does not include medical equipment!!!!!!!!!!
in the case of medical equipment the more you know the more carry
the argument that your so skilled with edged tools you dont need a medical kit is utter :***:
I met a man yesterday who makes roof beams for listed buildings by hand right from felling the oak to the finnished beam all with an axe
this is a rare skill in this country and there are not many people around who can walk into the woods with a felling axe and leave with a huge oak beam for a church roof
yet even with all his skill with an axe he always has a medical kit to hand
I respect your right to risk your life and limb if you choose too, but if you want to say this in a post i suggest you strongly recommend that no one else take your advice
"carry less by knowing more"
however this does not include medical equipment!!!!!!!!!!
in the case of medical equipment the more you know the more carry
the argument that your so skilled with edged tools you dont need a medical kit is utter :***:
I met a man yesterday who makes roof beams for listed buildings by hand right from felling the oak to the finnished beam all with an axe
this is a rare skill in this country and there are not many people around who can walk into the woods with a felling axe and leave with a huge oak beam for a church roof
yet even with all his skill with an axe he always has a medical kit to hand
I respect your right to risk your life and limb if you choose too, but if you want to say this in a post i suggest you strongly recommend that no one else take your advice
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