I'm not taking any sides on this but just as an observation:
Hmmm....
Geoff
Hmmm....
Geoff
Why Prepare?
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I'm not taking any sides on this but just as an observation:
Hmmm....
Geoff
Not got anything planned for teatime Geoff,as it is sausage tonight
Bernie
Not got anything planned for teatime Geoff,as it is sausage tonight
Bernie
I'll see if I can find some piccies for you! Sausages with hair in?
But hang on! We're hijacking the thread!Geoff
I'll see if I can find some piccies for you! Sausages with hair in?
Geoff
Well it needs a bit of light-heartedness don't you think,i'm having tea around 6
Bernie
Well it needs a bit of light-heartedness don't you think,i'm having tea around 6
Bernie
I'll see what I can find for you. My daughter is training to be a midwife so I could see if she has anything interesting.
Geoff
NATURAL DISASTERS (I wouldn't call them all disasters, but still)
 Avalanche
 Drought – Water rationing (shortages, but not as far as rationing - yet)
 Flood
 Fire (brushfire) (been around it but it didn't get close enough to evacuate)
 Heatwave
 Landslide – Mudslide
 Snow – Snowstorm – Blizzard – Whiteout
LAW, TERRORISM and WAR
 Biological Warfare/Terrorism (apparently this is a present danger – I'm not convinced and unprepared for this eventuality)
 Chemical Warfare/Terrorism (ditto)
 Crime – Gang War (happens around here – not enough to impact me but it is a risk in some areas)
 Terrorism – Assassinations – Bombings – Threats (since the IRA and now Al Quaida it's always a present threat, but not one I bat an eyelid over. If a bomb doesn't get me personally I'll be ok)
ECONOMIC & DOMESTIC
 Commodity Shortages – Food, Fuel, Medical Supplies, Water Rationing, etc
 Industrial Action – Strikes – Work to rule
 Job Loss – Loss of Income
 Power Shortages – Blackouts, Power Breakage
 Transport Problems – Aircraft, Boats, Rail, Road – Bad weather, strikes, accidents
 Vehicle Breakdown
HEALTH RELATED
 Trauma – Severe Wounds – Fractures
All things I've actually come across, been threatened by or are a reasonable thing to prepare for.
With the exception of the chemical and biological terrorism bits (unlikely to say the least) which need very specific approaches, the rest are a very large area of overlap.
I find “none” an answer given to make a point rather than an honest one. Never had someone break a leg or cut themselves badly? Never had a car break down or been stranded by public transport? (Last train is cancelled, last bus decides not to stop to pick you up and so on).
Never going to have to face it?
I find that very hard to believe.
I refer again to my comment on the other threads...
If you don't like it – don't read the survival threads. It isn't like they are cunningly named. I've yet to see a thread title about whittling a spoon or making nettle cordage that's actually been about preparing for a zombie apocalypse or full scale nuclear war.
To say some of you are overreacting to a subject that quite clearly interests enough forum members for a discussion to take place – would be understating it immensely.
Again, just don't read the threads. It's honestly that simple.
 Avalanche
 Drought – Water rationing (shortages, but not as far as rationing - yet)
 Flood
 Fire (brushfire) (been around it but it didn't get close enough to evacuate)
 Heatwave
 Landslide – Mudslide
 Snow – Snowstorm – Blizzard – Whiteout
LAW, TERRORISM and WAR
 Biological Warfare/Terrorism (apparently this is a present danger – I'm not convinced and unprepared for this eventuality)
 Chemical Warfare/Terrorism (ditto)
 Crime – Gang War (happens around here – not enough to impact me but it is a risk in some areas)
 Terrorism – Assassinations – Bombings – Threats (since the IRA and now Al Quaida it's always a present threat, but not one I bat an eyelid over. If a bomb doesn't get me personally I'll be ok)
ECONOMIC & DOMESTIC
 Commodity Shortages – Food, Fuel, Medical Supplies, Water Rationing, etc
 Industrial Action – Strikes – Work to rule
 Job Loss – Loss of Income
 Power Shortages – Blackouts, Power Breakage
 Transport Problems – Aircraft, Boats, Rail, Road – Bad weather, strikes, accidents
 Vehicle Breakdown
HEALTH RELATED
 Trauma – Severe Wounds – Fractures
All things I've actually come across, been threatened by or are a reasonable thing to prepare for.
With the exception of the chemical and biological terrorism bits (unlikely to say the least) which need very specific approaches, the rest are a very large area of overlap.
I find “none” an answer given to make a point rather than an honest one. Never had someone break a leg or cut themselves badly? Never had a car break down or been stranded by public transport? (Last train is cancelled, last bus decides not to stop to pick you up and so on).
Never going to have to face it?
I find that very hard to believe.
I refer again to my comment on the other threads...
If you don't like it – don't read the survival threads. It isn't like they are cunningly named. I've yet to see a thread title about whittling a spoon or making nettle cordage that's actually been about preparing for a zombie apocalypse or full scale nuclear war.
To say some of you are overreacting to a subject that quite clearly interests enough forum members for a discussion to take place – would be understating it immensely.
Again, just don't read the threads. It's honestly that simple.
I did the survival stuff 30+ years ago, it was OK, bit cold, wet and hungry, but OK, bushcraft is about being comfortable when outdoors, so yes, I think things have changed, bushcraft has moved on from just survival techniques.
So why is it that one can't use bushcraft to be comfortable in a survival situation?
Why do so many people seem to be arguing that if the smelly brown stuff hits the fan you're supposed to be cold and miserable, but if you go outdoors intentionally you're meant to be comfortable and enjoying it all the while being a superior person because you don't lower yourself to all that survival stuff and nonsense?
I'm well aware that not everyone is saying that - but it certainly sounds that way reading a lot of the anti-survival/preparedness posts.
I still remain completely unconvinced that bushcraft isn't relevant in a survival situation.
I still think people who don't like the survival and preparation view should just not read the threads discussing it.
I'm certainly not interested in low carbon living. I'm not all that interested in whittling cutlery, though I don't doubt its usefulness at times. Should we prevent the discussion of those issues, or make "noise" in those threads just because they don't factor into my personal view of bushcraft?
Should we heck!?
The more simple (and let's be honest, the more intelligent) approach is simply not to read those threads that don't interest you.
Why do so many people seem to be arguing that if the smelly brown stuff hits the fan you're supposed to be cold and miserable, but if you go outdoors intentionally you're meant to be comfortable and enjoying it all the while being a superior person because you don't lower yourself to all that survival stuff and nonsense?
I'm well aware that not everyone is saying that - but it certainly sounds that way reading a lot of the anti-survival/preparedness posts.
I still remain completely unconvinced that bushcraft isn't relevant in a survival situation.
I still think people who don't like the survival and preparation view should just not read the threads discussing it.
I'm certainly not interested in low carbon living. I'm not all that interested in whittling cutlery, though I don't doubt its usefulness at times. Should we prevent the discussion of those issues, or make "noise" in those threads just because they don't factor into my personal view of bushcraft?
Should we heck!?
The more simple (and let's be honest, the more intelligent) approach is simply not to read those threads that don't interest you.
Its like watching telly. Change teh damn channel if you dont like what is on. You dont have to read these threads and make a noise just for the sake of it.
Dana...
...campcraft
It's all part of the same big thing.
Maybe it'd be better to say "relatively comfortable" though.
...campcraft
It's all part of the same big thing.
Maybe it'd be better to say "relatively comfortable" though.
To true it is Dana, the minute you take yourself off outdoors to sleep the night, you are camping; call it camp craft, bushcraft whatever, its still camping. When I was a boy scout back in the 60' s we learnt to light fires, skin rabbits, make shelters, use blankets instead of sleeping bags, make bread etc, but the term 'bushcraft' had not been invented, we just used our camp craft skills while camping. This bushcraft stuff ain't new by any means, it just got a new name lol
As an early responder to this thread, I may have inadvertently stirred things up. If so, then I apologise, that wasn't my intention. I realise that there are various sub-discussions going on here, but the point I was trying to make was this: The skills I have learnt as 'bushcraft' don't seem particularly relevant to most of the items listed. If the brown stuff hit the fan, I reckon I could survive quite comfortably at home for a good few days. If things went more pear-shaped than that, then I'd say all bets are off as society as we know it would have disintegrated. If I was away from home, I'd never be that far away from civilisation that I'd be in real trouble. On the odd occasions where I do venture into the 'wilds' I'd take special precautions and measures.
I'm going to pour some virtual oil on these troubled waters, and leave this discussion to others.
G
I'm going to pour some virtual oil on these troubled waters, and leave this discussion to others.
G
Hiya
I am not of the apocalypse type of Survivalist nor am I of the cosy camping type either, but somewhere in-between. I am a nurse (nearly qualified), I see the end results of some 'survival' type situations nearly every week and therefore that makes me a realist. I also live on an Island, maybe that makes me think differently - I know how easy it is to be 'cut off' from the things we take for granted, so prepping for me, is part of it.
regards
Dana
I am not of the apocalypse type of Survivalist nor am I of the cosy camping type either, but somewhere in-between. I am a nurse (nearly qualified), I see the end results of some 'survival' type situations nearly every week and therefore that makes me a realist. I also live on an Island, maybe that makes me think differently - I know how easy it is to be 'cut off' from the things we take for granted, so prepping for me, is part of it.
regards
Dana
Survival skills to me are about surviving a disaster or a catastrophe of one description or another, we use them to live until rescued, bushcraft enhances these skills to allow us not only to survive, but indeed to thrive. I use my survival skills alongside my bushcraft skills to enjoy the woods and wild places, they are interlinked and cannot be seperated. I am no survivalist, nor do I spend all my time whittling, or making things, or foraging, or tracking. Instead I dip into whatever skill set I have, that is required at the time, to enjoy my hobby and make myself comfortable. I have had a survival tin for over 40 years now since doing my first survival course in the forces with the great Lofty himself :notworthy , I've never had to use it in anger thankfully and the contents have changed many times during that period. I agree there are other forums more aimed at survival than here but Dana has only asked a question which interests her. Why slate her for it? I don't go in for ultra light, I cannot see the attraction personally but I would't dream of interjecting a thread to voice my disdain, cos many of you are into it and that's what you like. When she asks the question at least answer civily and if it's not your bag, move on. 
This is just my honest and humble opinion in these matters so please accept it as such. :togo:
we use them to live until rescued, bushcraft enhances these skills to allow us not only to survive, but indeed to thrive. I use my survival skills alongside my bushcraft skills to enjoy the woods and wild places, they are interlinked and cannot be seperated. I am no survivalist, nor do I spend all my time whittling, or making things, or foraging, or tracking. Instead I dip into whatever skill set I have, that is required at the time, to enjoy my hobby and make myself comfortable. I have had a survival tin for over 40 years now since doing my first survival course in the forces with the great Lofty himself :notworthy , I've never had to use it in anger thankfully and the contents have changed many times during that period. I agree there are other forums more aimed at survival than here but Dana has only asked a question which interests her. Why slate her for it? I don't go in for ultra light, I cannot see the attraction personally but I would't dream of interjecting a thread to voice my disdain, cos many of you are into it and that's what you like. When she asks the question at least answer civily and if it's not your bag, move on. This is just my honest and humble opinion in these matters so please accept it as such. :togo:
Camping is often the name used by some of the military for something totally more fraut,ie we're going camping in Kosovo (maybe it's just an RAF thing). So I suppose that again it all comes down to how you percieve what it is your doing and the progressions you make from Survival to Bushcraft then on to Camping. It all fits together as an evolution of comfort levels.
As Mike Ameling says" just my humble opinion".
Andy
Survival skills to me are about surviving a disaster or a catastrophe of one description or another,
Sniper - I think what you written here, basically sums it up for me too. I am too, ex-forces (Senior Service) and though I have never had the priveledge of learning under Mr. Wiseman, I have had the mere basics from RN/RM Instructors, including NBC(D) and sea survival, though it was many years ago. The sea survival course is even today very relavent to my location in the UK as I regularly travel to the mainland by ferry.
Andyraf - I understand what you are saying about 'camping' RAF style. We too in the 'Andrew' had many an understated name for various things.
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