A friend has a Trabant. These cars were legislated off the roads because of what comes out of the exhaust, but, according to some learned bods calculations, there is more pollution created in the manufacturing of some modern cars, before they turn a wheel, than twenty years running of a smokey old Trabant. Off course this research could be blowing smoke up ones back passage. What is more environmental friendly, limiting the use of and keeping your old vehicle, or, buying a new one. Remember, our world, like it or not, revolves around consumerism. Have a look at "Slow Tech" some of it makes sence.
What is best for environmental reasons?
- Thread starter Paul_B
- Start date
Sorry to hear about your breathing problems, but I doubt it was because of the fumes alone from the vehicles, more likely from the brake dust and dust from the tyres, one of the leading Professors from the UN, pointed this out a few years back and actually advised cyclists to stay away from the roads
It is a bit weird that old cars are allowed into the LEZ and ULEZ zones as well as other vehicles that obviously pollute, yet penalise new cars and cars a few years old, this is why it is so hard to think when buying a new/second-hand vehicle, you just can't tell what is going to happen in the future.
About electric vehicles breaking down on motorways, we know we should always be aware of the range of the vehicle, my car has a computer that tells me, the problem with that is it is a computer and it bases its estimate on time and distance, I can get 70mpg on a clear motorway and 20mpg sitting in a slow moving traffic jam, so with one gallon of diesel I can travel 70 miles or 20 miles, therefor if I have half a gallon of fuel left after sitting in the jam, I know I can get 30-35 miles up the motorway, or to the first service station.and all that is if the fuel guage is correct, if my diesel car runs out of fuel at night, I put my hazard lights on, in an EV the battery is dead so I assume the lights wont work, unless it is fitted with a slave battery.
My assumption was made simply on the fact I am sure cars run out of petrol diesel on motorways, and I am sure the same will happen with EV's, which is why I do think most will be hybrids.
[QUOTE="Janne,
Electric vehicles need charging. If/when every vehicle is electric, how will you produce the electricity that is needed in UK??
Coal? Dirty. Hydro power? Not enough in UK. Gas? Dirty. And people oppose extraction. Solar? Not economically efficient in UK. Wind? well......
Wind, Solar are very varying supply too.. So you would need huge battery facilities to store the excess for low production times.
Nuclear?
Britain has just spent it's first week.. since victorian times without using any energy derived from coal... so they say. If it's true we just might be on the move towards a carbon free britain at last. Diesel is a lie. More polluting than petrol. Don't believe me? Stand by a bus exhaust and see how long you last before your throat gets sore and you start coffin.. sorry coughing
Electric vehicles need charging. If/when every vehicle is electric, how will you produce the electricity that is needed in UK??
Coal? Dirty. Hydro power? Not enough in UK. Gas? Dirty. And people oppose extraction. Solar? Not economically efficient in UK. Wind? well......
Wind, Solar are very varying supply too.. So you would need huge battery facilities to store the excess for low production times.
Nuclear?
Britain has just spent it's first week.. since victorian times without using any energy derived from coal... so they say. If it's true we just might be on the move towards a carbon free britain at last. Diesel is a lie. More polluting than petrol. Don't believe me? Stand by a bus exhaust and see how long you last before your throat gets sore and you start coffin.. sorry coughing
[QUOTE="Janne,
Electric vehicles need charging. If/when every vehicle is electric, how will you produce the electricity that is needed in UK??
Coal? Dirty. Hydro power? Not enough in UK. Gas? Dirty. And people oppose extraction. Solar? Not economically efficient in UK. Wind? well......
Wind, Solar are very varying supply too.. So you would need huge battery facilities to store the excess for low production times.
Nuclear?
Britain has just spent it's first week.. since victorian times without using any energy derived from coal... so they say. If it's true we just might be on the move towards a carbon free britain at last. Diesel is a lie. More polluting than petrol. Don't believe me? Stand by a bus exhaust and see how long you last before your throat gets sore and you start coffin.. sorry coughing
so assuming they never used coal in the Victorian Era then.........for that to be true,......... and you are too young to be standing by bus exhausts...so stop it....................its surprising how old some of those buses are...and how badly they are looked after.......
Sorry fadcode. Promise I won't do it again . There isn't a lot to do round here since they stopped selling glue at the stationers and turned it into a fancy coffee shop. I hate coffee . And my skateboard got broke trying to do a 180. Then my mum sent me to bed for not taking care of my toys and I been here ever since. I'm now over six yrs old and untill I agree to clean my room she won't let me out to play! Not fair! Stomp Stomp Stomp.
. There isn't a lot to do round here since they stopped selling glue at the stationers and turned it into a fancy coffee shop. I hate coffee . And my skateboard got broke trying to do a 180. Then my mum sent me to bed for not taking care of my toys and I been here ever since. I'm now over six yrs old and untill I agree to clean my room she won't let me out to play! Not fair! Stomp Stomp Stomp.
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A badly adjusted and worn out ( = many busses and lorries) diesel engine spew out unimaginable amount of crap, but not a well adjusted engine.
2 stroke engines ( like Trabant, MZ motorbikes) are hugely polluting too.
We can not win.
Sounds like a conspiracy thingy, but if the States wanted to clean up the environment ( EVERYTHING) they could.
Start by improving the mass-people transportation like busses, trolleys and trains. More freqvent, cheaper, latest tech.
I wanted to take the bus(ses) to work in UK. Lived in Mayfield. Worked in Crowborough.
11 miles house to work taking A road, B road.
Bus: Mayfield to Tunbridge Wells. Wait. Change bus, Tunbridge Wells to Crowborough. Time? Between 1.5 hours and 1.75 hours.
2 stroke engines ( like Trabant, MZ motorbikes) are hugely polluting too.
We can not win.
Sounds like a conspiracy thingy, but if the States wanted to clean up the environment ( EVERYTHING) they could.
Start by improving the mass-people transportation like busses, trolleys and trains. More freqvent, cheaper, latest tech.
I wanted to take the bus(ses) to work in UK. Lived in Mayfield. Worked in Crowborough.
11 miles house to work taking A road, B road.
Bus: Mayfield to Tunbridge Wells. Wait. Change bus, Tunbridge Wells to Crowborough. Time? Between 1.5 hours and 1.75 hours.
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Supercharged, flooding cylinders with diesel oil.
A true spectator sport!
It look like this when the humongous cruise ships crank up the engines before they depart Grand Cayman. Up to 8 in one evening. If no wind - Black cloud that does not disperse for an hour.
But they use the lowest grade of 'bunker oil'
A true spectator sport!
It look like this when the humongous cruise ships crank up the engines before they depart Grand Cayman. Up to 8 in one evening. If no wind - Black cloud that does not disperse for an hour.
But they use the lowest grade of 'bunker oil'
Those were the days. The days of recycling!
And fun!
Professional Gladiators fighting, mixed with the occasional Christian and other criminals.
Free bread, and wine!
Do you know they had jars all around the spectator areas in the amphitheaters?
To collect Urine?
And fun!
Professional Gladiators fighting, mixed with the occasional Christian and other criminals.
Free bread, and wine!
Do you know they had jars all around the spectator areas in the amphitheaters?
To collect Urine?
No?
Lots!
When did you get a free Ciabatta and a bottle of Italian Red last time at any sports event?
Not even when Elections are. Used to be lots of gifts from the political candidates....
Now you get some leaflets, of a quality not even suitable as loo paper....
Lots!
When did you get a free Ciabatta and a bottle of Italian Red last time at any sports event?
Not even when Elections are. Used to be lots of gifts from the political candidates....
Now you get some leaflets, of a quality not even suitable as loo paper....
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Google "Bread and Circuses" not much changed .No?
Lots!
When did you get a free Ciabatta and a bottle of Italian Red last time at any sports event?
Me - only when I was lucky to be invited to the VIP section.
superficial appeasement type of "Bread and Circuses" .
Juvenal, who originated the phrase, used it to decry the selfishness of common people and their neglect of wider concerns. The phrase implies a population's erosion or ignorance of civic duty as a priority.
He might have been the first one to put it in writing, but this has been occurring since the Neanderthals...
But they had no Bread and Wine. Mammoth and Roots maybe?
But they had no Bread and Wine. Mammoth and Roots maybe?
Of course it has. So has the evolution of "dumness", otherwise it still wouldn't be happening.
Thats interesting, do you think the saying" doesn't have a pot to p**s in " comes from, meaning of course the unfortunates.
On the environmental car issues. One of the big concerns in the late 19th century cities, was the amount of horse manure, and what to do with it. The event of the motor car solved one problem, and created another. Dr Beeching helped the problem grow in the 1960's by axing the UK rail network, the future was the car. Now it is no longer deemed cool to smoke, perhaps if it was no longer cool drive alone in your "Audi Q7" to work, things may change. My neighbours consider me poor, and odd, because I don't have a car. Of course some people need cars for justifiable reasons, but equally there are a lot who don't. A good friend of mine, who also made the decision to move from the countryside into town, has been a devoted petrol head all his days. He has made the decision to dump the car, and hire one if and when required, holidays etc. Makes a lot of (financial) sense.
In fact I read a report saying that the particulates in London tube trains and stations is actually worse than the roads in London because of train brake use I guess in confined sizes. Of course fuel combustion only adds to the fine particulates from other sources like brakes. Also iirc there's PM10s and PM2.5s. The latter is worse for health reasons. I also think I read yet come from different sources, one from brakes the other from fuels, however I can't remember the details or where I found it.
The issue with age of cars being compliant with the zones is due to the difference in pollution between petrol and diesel. Petrol is less polluting so older cars meet the LEZ & ULEZ requirements. Diesel cars are more polluting so to be LEZ & ULEZ compliant took 10 years of development to meet the requirements.
The euro standards are updated frequently. The higher euro rating the better the car is in terms of performance, efficiency and pollution.
On my diesel it has a trip computer that gives miles left with the fuel in the tank. When driving around town in traffic it gives one miles left figure. Then I get out of town and driving on good, clear roads. Suddenly the mileage goes up as the roads become clear and free of traffic. The miles left does seem to follow the mph figure though.
Although using these trip computer data seems helpful I think a simple gauge is better. Once it's below the 1/4 tank / battery level you really need to charge it for safety. Makes it easy to not run out on the motorway. It's easier to do that on motorways because you very regular services with 24 hour charging points plus signs giving distance to services coming up.
Personally I've run out fuel (both diesel) on motorway twice. Both cases because the fuel gauges were very iffy. One kind of stuck at 1/4 of a tank so you hit that mark and it never hit lower. Easy to run out if you're not careful. The other had a similar kind of issue. I wonder if EV gauges will have a similar effect.
Best way to cope with running out of fuel on motorways is to not get too low. Charge or fill up well before it gets very low.
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