the nature???

[Janne]

Tree huggers, bunny lovers, dirt eaters?

Mass generalisation and stereotypes. �� Never helpful.

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Why not?
It is a quite specific type of people that chain themselves to trees, do not eat meat and release minks into the wild.. thinking they are the saviours of Earth.

I know a few. Moved to the countryside from inner London to be part of nature, then start complaning when the next doir neighbour spreads manure on his fields. And gets hysterically upset when I popped around with a couple of braces of Pheasant as a gift.....
One of my old friends even called the RSCPA when another of my ( and his) friends had a hunt....
I think Robson V has met a few too. We all have.

 

[mountainm]

We've all met idiots. Idiots exist in all walks of life. Some hunt, shoot, fish and farm. Others don't eat meat, won't wear leather and hug trees.

But.

Hugging trees doesn't mean you're an idiot.

Not eating meat doesn't mean you're an idiot.

Shooting doesn't mean you're an idiot.

But stereotyping, and denigrating people based on there opinions or beliefs because they differ from yours..

Well... that works both ways. You've met a cultural impasse because neither group is respecting the other.






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[Janne]

We've all met idiots. Idiots exist in all walks of life. Some hunt, shoot, fish and farm. Others don't eat meat, won't wear leather and hug trees.

But.

Hugging trees doesn't mean you're an idiot.

Not eating meat doesn't mean you're an idiot.

Shooting doesn't mean you're an idiot.

But stereotyping, and denigrating people based on there opinions or beliefs because they differ from yours..

Well... that works both ways. You've met a cultural impasse because neither group is respecting the other.






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I am just a politically incorrect old fool that has very little empathy and understanding for fringe beliefs.

 

[mountainm]

I am just a politically incorrect idiot that has very little empathy and understanding for fringe beliefs.

Everyone's beliefs are fringe somewhere.

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[baggins]

OK Guys, beliefs aside, please can we get back on subject . Everyone has their own beliefs. Some are radical, most are moderate. We've all met the hard core hunters and greenies and they exist everywhere. We just have to accept them for what they are.
As a tree surgeon, i cut down trees for a living, but have planted far more than i have ever felled. But i'm never happier than being in a beautiful forest or woodland.
The Nature, for what i believe, is living in our environment and learning how to appreciate it and allow it to thrive so that future generations can do the same. being able to immerse myself in our natural world.

 

[Janne]

Right you are, Baggins.

I think that the native peoples appreciation of nature comes from the knowledge that nature provides for their existence.

We go to a supermarket to buy a bird or other meat. They have to hunt it, or spend a lot of time with their semi domesticated herds.

Until recently, if you wanted billberries / blueberries in Sweden you had to pick your own. Sure, we could buy jam, but if you wanted them fresh you had to go to the forest. You needed knowledge.

Also the people relying in nature for the food need a deep understanding and knowledge of the animals themselves. What percentage to kill sustainably. What kind of animal to kill when.

 

[mountainm]

Sometimes you don't appreciate what you've got until someone who hasn't got it tells you how lucky you are.

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[Janne]

Also all the Scandinavian countries were really poor until relatively recently. The nature was a way to be able to supplement what you placed on the table. Berries, meat, fish. Mushroom picking is fairly recent in Sweden, but an old tradition in Finland.
By tradition, small game like hares, rabbits, some bird and squirrels were an open season game the poorer rural class could hunt with the permit free .22 LR rifle. Up to the late 1960's or so?
As most people could not afford any leisure travels, staying in the nature ( camping, huts, cabins) was a good alternative. Combine this with a bit of berry picking and fishing, it was not only a way to relax, but also helped feed the family.

 

[Janne]

To appreciate and fully enjoy Nature you need one important thing:
The Nature itself. Full, unrestricted access if it.
In all of scandinavia areas of wild or semi wild nature are easily reached, at most a couple of hours or a half day walking away.
Again, the Allemans rätten ensures everybody has full access.

Compared to Sweden, UK has very large urban areas and very little nature left. What is left is heavily used and / or inaccessible to the general public.
Yes, you have a few public footpaths, but that is it. You are not allowed to "trespass" and pick berries and such. Not allowed to fish the streams.

Of course you have the state owned nature preserves, but I believe you are quite restricted in their use, just like in Scandinavia?

 

[mountainm]

. You are not allowed to "trespass" and pick berries and such. Not allowed to fish the streams.

Fishing really depends on land ownership, but berries you can pick anywhere without anyone bothering unless it's someone's garden.


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[baggins]

Janne, it's not quite that bad. Although we are restricted on access (apart from Scotland, which has similar access rules to Sweden and Norway), We are still allowed to forage as long as no roots are removed and the species isn't rare or endangered (ok, there is a bit more to than that, but thats the basics). It's more of a problem of finding areas where we can find enough abundant species to harvest. For example, today we found some Hedgehog mushrooms and an older lady who was passing said that 30 years ago the area was flooded with them, now, barely anything (we only took enough for a meal). we still had to travel over an hr to this site as there isn't really anywhere closer that we have found.

 

[Janne]

I was sharply told off by a landowner when I ventured off the footpath through his land when I lived in Mayfield.
I was nit the only one. Then the old fog put up barbed wire alonside the path.
We local ramblers cut it down. Illegally I was told by a lawyer friend, but we did this a couple times until he gave up.

Them somebody in the village remembered that there used to be a connecting path between the two main ones, which we found on an old map.
Then we reinstated that path. Yep, several sessions of barbed wire erecting and cutting until we won.

 

[Robson Valley]

Come over. I can shoot you up the Holmes River valley into the most luxurious wild camp you can imagine.
That you have to move every 2 weeks = so be it, I'll save the best for last.
We maybe get to the hanging glaciers at km 60.

Here's what you do = you use Google Earth to find McBride. That's easy, the speed of light, yes?
Then you go east maybe 20km, across the Holmes river bridge to the hairpin bend north of HWY 16.
Then, you go up the logging road past Greggo's place at km 18 just across the river
and we will spread your kit at km 23.

Probably not in the best interests of your personal health and safety to stop at Greggo's
without me standing in front of you. Greggo is a licensed trapper, a bushmaster par excellence.
However, he and his woman are quite shy.