Spider
- Thread starter gsfgaz
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Teganaria domestica - Common house spider. that one is a male.. very small body, long legs and pedipalps.
There are also another species Tegenaria duellica; formerly known as T. gigantea. It is pretty much identical to domestica, but has significantly larger and thicker hairs on it's legs though and slightly larger body. It grews slightly larger, but not much.
It's breeding time for them. Males are on the wander and are coming into homes en masse.
It's breeding time for them. Males are on the wander and are coming into homes en masse.
There isn't an Atlas spider as such. I think the term is generic and covers different species in different parts of the country. These are sometimes called atlas spiders down here...
There isn't an Atlas spider as such. I think the term is generic and covers different species in different parts of the country. These are sometimes called atlas spiders down here...
crackin shot ..
The beastie we call the Atlas spider is the male one, nearly 4" across, comes into the house by mistake I think, it's just off for a wander, not setting up home.
Gave me a heck of a start the first time I saw one on the kitchen cupboard door
Especially since I'd just brought in the messages with a bag load of assorted tropical fruits
M
Gave me a heck of a start the first time I saw one on the kitchen cupboard door
Especially since I'd just brought in the messages with a bag load of assorted tropical fruits M
loads around at the moment - and only recently was I made aware that most are upside down - absolutely gutted the wife spotted it first!
Cheers, here's another...
That's the orb web or garden spider. Loads of those about getting fat in their webs on bushes and trees etc.
Back to House spiders. They give one mean bite. There was one hiding in the previous nights washing up, and it nailed me in the fleshy part of my thumb. Painful bite and very irritating for days.
Jon, I'm afraid your taxonomy is a little out of date, although granted there has been confusion over this group in the past. The species in the original pic is either Tegenaria saeva or T. gigantea (formerly T. duellica) - impossible to tell which from a photograph. It definitely isn't T. domestica, which has a less patterned appearance and is smaller, as well as being invariably found indoors.
Right about it being a male though
Nice pics all round in this thread though.
Jon, I'm afraid your taxonomy is a little out of date, although granted there has been confusion over this group in the past. The species in the original pic is either Tegenaria saeva or T. gigantea (formerly T. duellica) - impossible to tell which from a photograph. It definitely isn't T. domestica, which has a less patterned appearance and is smaller, as well as being invariably found indoors.
Right about it being a male though
Nice pics all round in this thread though.
Haven't you got that backwards? My taxonomy may be fuzzy, but it is the same as these sites and Bristowes backs it up too.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant_house_spider
http://wiki.britishspiders.org.uk/index.php5?title=Tegenaria_gigantea_saeva
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegenaria_domestica
Personally, I find distinction between the three species mind boggling, but the size of the spider in the original pic against the scale of the grass and what I assume is a gardening cane makes it too small to be the larger species, especially as it is a male in the last legs of it's lifecycle (excuse the pun). Also lack of patternation on the cephelothorax is distinct and both T.saeva and T.duellica/gigantea have a more spotted patternation than T.domestica. The time of year as they wander about looking for females also finds them very much outdoors and travelling quickly in short bursts of speed.
Puubs picture is very much T.domestica and has the same cephelothorax patternation...
Although, the damned things still all look the same to me.
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Well Jon, we can disagree. I have no problem with the scale, given how long the legs are on these things. I see T. gigantea/saeva when I look at those pics, but of course there is no way to tell without seeing the actual specimen. They can mature at different sizes too.
As for markings, I don't recognise T. domestica as something brightly marked. Maybe it is different in the States. The pictures on this site are much closer to my experience. The picture of T. domestica in that link is the same one as in Dick Jone's "A Guide to Spiders of Britain and Northern Europe" which, whilst out of print, is still the best photographic guide to UK spiders. On the other hand, Mike Roberts 3 volume set of books (the definitive taxonomic guide for UK species) does say that T. domestica is very variable in markings, sometimes bright like your pic, sometimes dull like mine
But I've never seen a well marked one, and all of the ones in my collection are uniform brown.
As for the taxonomy, Roberts does refer to T. duellica, but he sometimes uses names that are not accepted by the general arachnological community, and on the official checklists T. duellica is known as T. gigantea.
I've got great respect for your skills and knowledge, and you are invariably right when I see you post, and I certainly wouldn't argue with you about reptiles, but spiders are my thing. Sorry if I sound argumentative.
As for markings, I don't recognise T. domestica as something brightly marked. Maybe it is different in the States. The pictures on this site are much closer to my experience. The picture of T. domestica in that link is the same one as in Dick Jone's "A Guide to Spiders of Britain and Northern Europe" which, whilst out of print, is still the best photographic guide to UK spiders. On the other hand, Mike Roberts 3 volume set of books (the definitive taxonomic guide for UK species) does say that T. domestica is very variable in markings, sometimes bright like your pic, sometimes dull like mine
But I've never seen a well marked one, and all of the ones in my collection are uniform brown.
As for the taxonomy, Roberts does refer to T. duellica, but he sometimes uses names that are not accepted by the general arachnological community, and on the official checklists T. duellica is known as T. gigantea.
I've got great respect for your skills and knowledge, and you are invariably right when I see you post, and I certainly wouldn't argue with you about reptiles, but spiders are my thing. Sorry if I sound argumentative.
No, this is a great discussion and I'm always open to education on any subject. I believe the spider in the first pic has very recently shed which is why the abdomen is shrunken and the colours are bright. I actually started out with entomology as my main goal, but somehow ended up with scaly stuff. These three species we are discussing are the ONLY ones in the entire world that scare the beejesus out of me and I avoid like the plague. How weird is that. I can hadle any other spider with no problem whatsoever.
So what is going on with the taxonomy issue? A few snake species I know of are going through the same thing. Is it like the Carcharias Megalodon v Carcharodon Megalodon issue?
I'd love to see pics of your collection.
So what is going on with the taxonomy issue? A few snake species I know of are going through the same thing. Is it like the Carcharias Megalodon v Carcharodon Megalodon issue?
I'd love to see pics of your collection.
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Thanks Jon. I've already stuck my foot in my mouth once tonight on this forum, and thought I was being unusually argumentative.
My collection is in an awful state, and the specimens being in alcohol don't lend themselves to photography. Besides, once pickled the appearance changes anyway. Over the years I've moved increasingly away from collecting specimens and recording, and more into looking, handling, and releasing unharmed.
Tegenaria are apparently some of the fastest species in the world over short distances, which is probably why they generate such terror. I had a big male one at a kids bugs display a few weeks ago which I was handling, and it was great to see how many initially frightened children (learned reaction from parents?) ended up overcoming their fear and handling the spider, and realising that it wouldn't bite and just tickled when it walked on them.
Probably helped that I'd tired it out a bit first though. They can't sustain that blinding speed for long.
Oh, and I have been bitten by them. No adverse effects, but boy did it hurt!
My collection is in an awful state, and the specimens being in alcohol don't lend themselves to photography. Besides, once pickled the appearance changes anyway. Over the years I've moved increasingly away from collecting specimens and recording, and more into looking, handling, and releasing unharmed.
Tegenaria are apparently some of the fastest species in the world over short distances, which is probably why they generate such terror. I had a big male one at a kids bugs display a few weeks ago which I was handling, and it was great to see how many initially frightened children (learned reaction from parents?) ended up overcoming their fear and handling the spider, and realising that it wouldn't bite and just tickled when it walked on them.
Probably helped that I'd tired it out a bit first though. They can't sustain that blinding speed for long.
Oh, and I have been bitten by them. No adverse effects, but boy did it hurt!
My youngest picks them up this time of year. I hate it when she comes up to me with cupped hands, it requires all the will power in the world not to leg it. So far it's paid off and she has no idea they freak me out. If she did, she would actively seek them out and put them under the bed sheets. I've handled everything from Goliaths to the freakiest of wandering spiders, whip scorpions and solifugids, so no idea why they have this effect on me.
The bite I got itched like crazy for a good five days.
Back to the original pic though... do you think it looks like a recently sloughed spider?
I had a goliath some years back that was a whopper, the usual big bodied brown spider we all know. One day it sloughed and emerged jet black with red tinged abdomen, the abdomen was tiny compared to what I had become used to and the pedipalps huge (similar in dimension to the Tegenaria in the top pic), but a legspan as wide as a large frying pan. It died soon after, but was a magnificent and massive looking thing.
The bite I got itched like crazy for a good five days.
Back to the original pic though... do you think it looks like a recently sloughed spider?
I had a goliath some years back that was a whopper, the usual big bodied brown spider we all know. One day it sloughed and emerged jet black with red tinged abdomen, the abdomen was tiny compared to what I had become used to and the pedipalps huge (similar in dimension to the Tegenaria in the top pic), but a legspan as wide as a large frying pan. It died soon after, but was a magnificent and massive looking thing.
Cheers, here's another...
That's the orb web or garden spider. Loads of those about getting fat in their webs on bushes and trees etc.
Back to House spiders. They give one mean bite. There was one hiding in the previous nights washing up, and it nailed me in the fleshy part of my thumb. Painful bite and very irritating for days.
Yep, the females are a good deal larger than the males and once they lay eggs they don't bother feeding and just guard the eggs. They are easy to tell cos they have a little cross pattern on the abdomen, seen clearly on this internet photo...
We currently have three of them competing for space outside my wife's jewellery workshop window, which is ever so slightly disconcerting when I go out to bung the waste in the compost bin in the dark.
Not especially to me. There's quite a bit of flash in that shot. Oh hell, I'm arguing again! I need to go to bed...
I suppose it could be. After all the males don't always live very long once mature, given that they have to get close to the bigger, weightier females
Now I'm just envious. My spider expertees stops at the UK borders, and I know very little about overseas stuff, although I have seen a few Goliaths, but never handled one.
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