Should we eat wheat?

[pteron]

The contents of this thread on diet piqued my interested and I've spent the last week or so reading papers and blogs on the subject (as recommended by Paul_B!).

As a result, I am convinced that we shouldn't eat wheat. Any of us. In the thread referenced Toddy asserted that lectins are not poisonous, they are instead an allergen for some people. I think this distinction is semantic as 83% of the population have measurable abnormal immune response when exposed to gliadin (one of the proteins in gluten). That's 5 out of 6 people. Unfortunately, for most of them they show no symptoms, but their bloodstream is exposed to the contents of the gut all the same. Once the lectins pass into the bloodstream, they attach to cells and cause the body's immune response to kill the previously working cell. The mechanism is described here for those interested.

To quote one chap (a doctor with an interest in diet and nutrition):

The biggest circle in the Venn diagram encompasses 83% of the population –all the smaller circles plus those who might show evidence of an innate response but in whom testing for antibodies may show nothing, and who therefore would never be known to have been damaged by gluten consumption, even if they had MS, schizophrenia, Hashimoto’s thyroiditis, Grave’s disease. Lupus, Type I diabetes, Sjogren disease, etc. or any other of the many diseases that travel with celiac as a consequence of leaky gut and ensuing molecular mimicry that occurs when you damage your gut with wheat.

His analysis is informed by this article in the BMJ.

So, 1 in 6 people are immune, the rest not. The problem is that without the very sensitive test for immune response, you cannot tell if you are one of the 1 in 6.

If anyone has any peer reviewed articles that refute this I'd be very interested to read them.

 

[Opal]

When I mention such and such a thing is bad for you, I've had many replies mentioning we'd all starve the amount of things that are bad for you.

I have a spoonful of sugar now and then on my porridge, it's rare I have salt, I rarely eat bread these days, stopped having pork as it takes so long to get rid of it out yer system....if you were married to my wife, you'd look like me.... I now weigh three and a half stone.

 

[Toddy]

I do know that if I eat wheat, or gluten, then the rheumatoid arthritis flares and every joint I have aches
It's not worth it for me.

I sometimes wonder if it's another of those foods that are fine, in season. Not a constant bombardment of it in every single meal we take.
I know I was really surprised at how much wheat and it's derivatives were included in almost the entire range of prepared foods in the supermarket. From crisps to soups, frozen chips to corn tortillas, there's added wheat, not just in the obvious bakery products.

cheers,
M

 

[pastymuncher]

After reading the book Born to Run the quote that came up several times was "Eat like a poor man".
No not Mcds, but natural foods, small amounts of meat but mostly vegetables and roots etc. Modern grain based foods are probably not the basis of a good diet as they are a manufactured food, by which, I mean they have been cultivated to produce an unnatural high yield crop. Unfortunately nearly every food available in the shops has been bred to produce the largest yield possible, look at wild strawberries compared to the tasteless things you find in supermarkets.

 

[teknohippy]

I'd be happy to never eat another El Santa strawberry in my whole life. Tasteless things.

I had a go a the local supermarket the other day cos I only found one British apple among all those available, some worcesters. Everything else was Granny's, Galas and the usual imported stuff. That makes no sense at this time of year.

I was told they stock what people want to buy. I'm always told that though.

 

[gregorach]

Unfortunately nearly every food available in the shops has been bred to produce the largest yield possible, look at wild strawberries compared to the tasteless things you find in supermarkets.

My strawberries are large, high-yielding and delicious. (Wish I knew what variety they are.) Let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater here!

 

[Paul_B]

Mastymuncher - Good name to comment on food!

I'm glad one of my suggestions has been taken up Pteron. Don't remember making any for a while though.

I believe gluten can cause some to be so ill that they can barely go out to work and are tired all the time. I am always wary when someone says they are XYZ intolerant or allergic as it is often self diagnosed. One of the things the NHS doesn't do well is dealing with allergies or intolerances to foods or other allergens. GPs rarely refer people for allergen testing. I think someoneonce told me that in Germany (apart from annual check-ups for all) they do allergy testing a lot more commonly. Whenever anyone comes in with say hayfever symptons they send them for testing to find the allergen responsible. They also do vaccinations for hayfever allergens which was pioneered in Britain but stopped after a few deaths because it was not monitored for the rare occurances they had bad side effects.

Off topic but it is always easy for someone to come up with an idea in their head that they have an allergy to something and convince themselves its true. A mate had it all tested and was proven to be one of the rare cases of a true food intolerance. I don't think the celebrity "intolerances" that get reported help in this.

BTW have you looked into milk and dairy products? That is another common "intolerance" people have. Also another example of something we never used to have as much of. Someone said that milk is actually bad for adults somewhere. AS in everything I do believe moderation is the key. I had IBS for a few years that I put down tothe milk at work being bad probably due toa knackered old fridge that they wouldn't replace. I stopped having milk at work and considered stopping it all together. A friend told me to try UHT milk for about a year then gradually filter in some real, fresh milk. I now have a taste for UHT (Moo brand) milk. I also drink the milk from the same supplier and kept in the same fridge as before at work and no longer have any IBS. Not sure if it worked because of the year of UHT drinking or not but all that matters is I no longer get bad trapped wind and the squits at the same time for about 5 days out of the week. Result.

Sorry about the crudity but I am very conscious about my diet and what works for me. If I listened to all the advice I would die because I had nothing to eat. I do however try to eat regularly and a mix of foods. Vegetables, fruits, pasta / rice / potatos, red meat for about the equivalent of 1 meal a week. (more likely 3 meals one week and non for two). I do eat pork products such as sausages,bacon and ham (usually in fresh pasta like tortellini or similar pouch types). Also fish but usually mackeral or occasionally smoked vietnamese cobbler (farmed in uk I believe). Anyway, whatever they say about wheat I have the opinion that advice and "latest thinking" on diet is all well and good but how can you explain all those in my family who ate really bad diets yet lived into their 90s? Experts do not know everything.They often work on statistical studies of diets as they do not truly know the mechanisms of how foods affect us in most cases.

I do like these discussions on forums but don't take the advice as gospel. I make my own decisions as to what I want to eat for my health and I live or die by those decisions. I will eat wheat whether good for me or not. I like toast and marg when I get home as a quick snack. Also a huge lump of cheddar (a good one usually) and I go through 2lb in about a week. Not exactly good for me but I'm in my 30s and fit as a butchers!! My food concern is only about it being sufficient due to faster than usual metabolism (self diagnosed as I know I hit the wall very quickly if I don't eat a lot each day).

Sorry for rambling. Mine are all my experiences and no peer reviewed documents, another sorry. As for the sensitivity testing this is not commonly done under the NHS so I doubt the true extent of sensitivity can be totally accurate. Any review of this is likely to be from a small test group and perhaps some inaccuracies due to that. Statistics is what I am saying the third type of lie if you recall that saying.

 

[Paul_B]

As a kid we used to go to a PYO place to eat our deserts I mean pick strawberries (although we did sneak through some whipped cream spray once). They were always more tasty than supermarket ones but obviously with a higher yield than many get at home. Professionals in any walk of life will by their very nature be better at whatever they are trying for. That means if only yield is required (supermarkets perhaps) then that is what will be achieved. PYO need quality and yield otherwise why would you go there?

My parents moved into a house 15 years ago that had "alpine straberries" IIRC. They were small and round and WOW! What a taste!!