Making a canvas tarp?
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Flat felled seam and bar tack the webbing loops onto the reinforcement points. plenty of stuff on the tube to show you.
bit rough but you get the idea
bit rough but you get the idea
Look at US army field manual FM 10-16, basically everything you need to know on how to sew and repair clothing and equipment. For the youtube-impaired people like myself.
I would do a flat fell seam on the central seams and a 3 fold (especially if using eyelets or tapes) round the edges.
You would need to reinforce under webbing loops with triangles or squares of material to spread the load.
Square sew the webbing and cross it.
You would need to reinforce under webbing loops with triangles or squares of material to spread the load.
Square sew the webbing and cross it.
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Flat felled seam and bar tack the webbing loops onto the reinforcement points. plenty of stuff on the tube to show you.
bit rough but you get the idea
The way you have 'Bar tacked' (which it really isn't, but that's another story) will lead to weakness in the cloth due to the small stitch length. So your reinforcement is actually the opposite.
Can you elaborate a bit please Big Swede?
I can see 4 bar tacks on that. Whilst the stitching obviously weakens the cloth, it's doubled. If the cloth is weakened by half, it only needs to equal the strength of the single layer.
I can see 4 bar tacks on that. Whilst the stitching obviously weakens the cloth, it's doubled. If the cloth is weakened by half, it only needs to equal the strength of the single layer.
A real genuine bar tack is done by hand, with three long stitches and then the remainder of the thread is looped around the stitches on the top side, which means that the whole length of the thread will reinforce but only three stitches in the fabric. A lockstitch bar tacking machine also does three (or more) long stitches and then a zig zag over those three stitches. That was what I meant by those stitches in the photo not being bar tacks.
Yes, he has doubled the fabric but putting holes in the fabric so close to each other is not a good way. It would have been better to just top stitch and cross the doubled tape. Or just use longer zig zag stitch in those tacks. There are good examples of how to reinforce tapes in the manual I linked in my previous post.
I'm struggling to get any links to open on the field manual, I'll try again tomorrow.
Does it deal with canvas, polyester and nylon as seperate methods do you know? They all have different stretches, needing different stitch patterns. For instance, nylon webbing is strongest with a series of staright stitches but with polyester, it makes little difference.
Does it take into account the different needles? The cotton will be weakened with stitching as the hole is cut, the super fine and sharp needles used for the thinner sil will damage the fabric much less as it passes through the weave rather than cut a hole in it.
I have seen all sorts of methods used commercially for attaching these tie-outs, lots similar to the above method. They have held up well for me in use, even exceeded the original strength of the cloth.
You've made some good points, I'm going to do some destruction testing and report back.
Does it deal with canvas, polyester and nylon as seperate methods do you know? They all have different stretches, needing different stitch patterns. For instance, nylon webbing is strongest with a series of staright stitches but with polyester, it makes little difference.
Does it take into account the different needles? The cotton will be weakened with stitching as the hole is cut, the super fine and sharp needles used for the thinner sil will damage the fabric much less as it passes through the weave rather than cut a hole in it.
I have seen all sorts of methods used commercially for attaching these tie-outs, lots similar to the above method. They have held up well for me in use, even exceeded the original strength of the cloth.
You've made some good points, I'm going to do some destruction testing and report back.
I'm struggling to get any links to open on the field manual, I'll try again tomorrow.
Does it deal with canvas, polyester and nylon as seperate methods do you know? They all have different stretches, needing different stitch patterns. For instance, nylon webbing is strongest with a series of staright stitches but with polyester, it makes little difference.
Does it take into account the different needles? The cotton will be weakened with stitching as the hole is cut, the super fine and sharp needles used for the thinner sil will damage the fabric much less as it passes through the weave rather than cut a hole in it.
I have seen all sorts of methods used commercially for attaching these tie-outs, lots similar to the above method. They have held up well for me in use, even exceeded the original strength of the cloth.
You've made some good points, I'm going to do some destruction testing and report back.
It does mainly deal with repairs of clothing, equipment and tents. Mostly canvas. Just google US field manual 10-16 general fabric repair.
Poly or PA taping matters little, it is how the seam is made that matters, when it comes to seam strength.
Look here buddy, I worked with heavy sewing machines stitching custom lifting rigs and in a sail loft and now I'm in tailoring, I didn't make these things up. Look at how heavy duty technical things are sewn, ever saw any zig zag seams with the stitches overlapping in a safety belt or a tie down strap?
Thanks for your thoughts Big Swede. What you say makes sense. I learned a lot making my first tarp so ill look at that next time and try a different approach.
Please don't take me wrong Big Swede, I'm not questioning your experience and you obviously know what your talking about. I make a lot of gear myself and this is important to me.
As for seeing overlapping and bad stitches on safety belts and tie downs then yes, I've seen some shocking stuff. What I notice in general is that it's not the stitch length or weakening of the fabric that causes issues, I've had far more failures from too small a seam allowance and not enough threads to hold up to abrasion. Just my observations.
Tie outs on the perimeter with thinner cloth is always going to be trickier to get spot on to because of the large force radiating from a small area.
Got the link mate this morning, I shall peruse.
Please don't take me wrong Big Swede, I'm not questioning your experience and you obviously know what your talking about. I make a lot of gear myself and this is important to me.
As for seeing overlapping and bad stitches on safety belts and tie downs then yes, I've seen some shocking stuff. What I notice in general is that it's not the stitch length or weakening of the fabric that causes issues, I've had far more failures from too small a seam allowance and not enough threads to hold up to abrasion. Just my observations.
Tie outs on the perimeter with thinner cloth is always going to be trickier to get spot on to because of the large force radiating from a small area.
Got the link mate this morning, I shall peruse.
No, I never assumed you were questioning my experience, I just stated it so you know where I come from. Like you I have sewn a lot of outdoors gear for myself and for others. I started out as a DIY:er too. But work experience, tailoring school and apprenticeships have taught me a lot and I kind of laugh when I look at stuff I made back then. It's like they say, when you're a novice you know a lot but as you gain experience you realise that that isn't the case.
I don't question using zig-zag as a reinforcement but use appropriate stitch length. I have seen one of your tarps here on the board and you had a longer stitch making the part stronger. Seam allowances are of course important, but you have to see quality (where rip strength is one part) as a chain where the total is only as good as the weakest link. If you're gonna tack something do it right. And regarding abrasion, typically seams will get most worn due to the bulk in the seams. If you can manage to reduce bulk you will reduce wear. Better to use an appropriate cloth and thread than to stitch abrasion resistance. I typically use #40 bound nylon for Equipment, sometimes #20 depending on area of use. But you have to have a machine which have a shuttle and needle system that can handle that. If I were to sew a canvas tarp I would use barbour linen thread I Think, running it thru a lubricating unit first.
And to the OP: Work on as small units as possible, for instance if you want attachment points for making a ridgeline, attach those Before sewing the panels together. Always work in as small units as said, stuff like these can get unwieldly otherwise.
You make a lot of sense to me. Good to discuss the subject with your experience of tailoring and the heavy duty stuff too.
This is a thread I would use if I were to go the all natural route (which seems appropriate since we're talking cotton tarp here): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Barbours-...3287?pt=UK_Thread_Floss_1&hash=item3f33d58e67
Sometimes you find it with British MOD marks as it is used as general repair thread apperently. It does not hurt to use it with a lubricating/waxing unit but I guess most people don't have that at home. You might be able to sew it in a household machine with a 120 or heavier needle. Might. The shuttle might not like the large needle or your thread tension assembly might not like it. But it is an awesome thread. I have sewn quite a few leather items with it and they look aweseome. And also a few canvas items, heirloom shirts (in linen cloth) and I use it to attach buttons on outdoors wear. It's way stronger than I initially thought. Specially when wet. Good for handsewing (I keep a small card with a few ten meters, a small piece of wax, thimble and a couple of large eyed betweens in my pack) and as a general repair thread.
Sometimes you find it with British MOD marks as it is used as general repair thread apperently. It does not hurt to use it with a lubricating/waxing unit but I guess most people don't have that at home. You might be able to sew it in a household machine with a 120 or heavier needle. Might. The shuttle might not like the large needle or your thread tension assembly might not like it. But it is an awesome thread. I have sewn quite a few leather items with it and they look aweseome. And also a few canvas items, heirloom shirts (in linen cloth) and I use it to attach buttons on outdoors wear. It's way stronger than I initially thought. Specially when wet. Good for handsewing (I keep a small card with a few ten meters, a small piece of wax, thimble and a couple of large eyed betweens in my pack) and as a general repair thread.
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