Is there really any need for camoflage?

SoldierPalmer

Full Member
Dec 10, 2015
254
19
South Wales
There is no sadder site than Civvies in full Dpm. We used to call them walts :lmao:

I can understand wearing the trousers as they are light cheap and have great pockets but to be seen with a Dpm shirt and deputy dog hat it's laughable.
 

Klenchblaize

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 25, 2005
2,584
123
61
Greensand Ridge
There is nothing wrong with a liking for camo be it of military design or not. There being a great deal more of the latter if you're interested enough to look. I have a book with accompanying data patten CD from Japan called "Hidden Nature" that details 100 royalty-free camo designs. Wonderful stuff and any number of which would look both cool on the High Street and discreet in the woods or on the hill.

There is no getting away from the fact that camo works in the context of the human eye:



K
 
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santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,394
881
63
Florida
There is no sadder site than Civvies in full Dpm. We used to call them walts :lmao:

I can understand wearing the trousers as they are light cheap ......
"Light" is the last thing I want in outdoor pants; now that I'm retired and back when I was still active duty.
 

Nic Le Becheur

Tenderfoot
Sep 10, 2015
73
0
Southampton
It may be argued that there is another valid reason to avoid the wearing of military camouflage when not out in the sticks - in fact, a small but very real risk associated with the incautious wearing of army surplus clothing altogether.

This morning, rejoicing in a pair of very recently purchased Belgian army Seyntex combats (Jigsaw pattern Mk 4, and highly recommended for their stout material, generous cut, comfort and cheerfully extrovert appearance) whilst playing military band music when working on the computer, La Marche des Parachutistes Belges came on the playlist and the trousers - normally quite passive as such items tend to be - suddenly seemed to perk up and want to pace about the room with a brisk, measured tread. This can be quite alarming when you're not expecting it. I think the trousers may be possessed.

Despite being a useful, psychometric way of finding out what unit your surplus kit may have been originally issued to, the possibility of its ongoing psychic possession is a real one and not to be underestimated. My advice is, if you have any kit that was issued to another person before you, get it exorcised first. And/or avoid any music of country of origin.

And the hazards of listening to military band music when in an ex-army tent or bivvy bag hardly bears thinking about.

I hope this is at least as useful as some of the posts I've ploughed through on this thread.

Nick.
 

Klenchblaize

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 25, 2005
2,584
123
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Greensand Ridge
I do despair of these threads of "don't use an axe", "don't have a fire", "don't make a shelter", "don't wear cammo".

When I want peoples advice on how to conduct myself, within the law on and on my own land (or land where the landowner has given me permission), I'll ask for it.

In the meantime, I wish those who seek to impose yet further restrictions on the limited freedom left to us, would spend a little more time doing, and a little less time regulating others.

Red
+1

I like camo but would probably find something a little more arresting than DPM to attack our archeological heritage in.

K



 

KenThis

Full Member
Jun 14, 2016
825
119
Cardiff
I care not for what you villains want to wear, go about in whatever floats your boat.
Just as, I assume, you're not worried about my sartorial choices.
Personally though I really dislike camouflage gear and don't own anything cammo.
Then again I'm not a big fan of the colour green in general.
But then I have no need or wish to go unnoticed. I don't hunt, I don't 'hide' in the woods watching birds/wildlife and I am not a member of the armed forces...

I don't go around in day-glo orange jumpsuits, but I do like a bit of colour now and again.
 

leaky5

Maker Plus
Jul 8, 2014
752
49
Basildon
There is no sadder site than Civvies in full Dpm. We used to call them walts :lmao:
Funniest one I ever saw was at a living history show. You tend to get two type of people who dress up there. The ones who are part of large organised groups and the individuals.

One individual was dressed up IIRC as an NVA soldier, AK and all. It was only when I ended up next to him, that I realised the whole suit was knitted. Must have taken his mum hours.
 

Robson Valley

Full Member
Nov 24, 2014
8,279
1,378
McBride, BC
Camo is so very useful here as we have so many different hunting opportunities, from ducks and turkeys to moose and mountain sheep.
Most people in my mountain district wear camo when they hunt, but never to buy groceries or go to the post office. Just isn't done.
Imagine buying stamps in a ghillie suit. Really.
 
Dec 6, 2013
417
0
N.E.Lincs.
Ahhh, you obviously have to queue for a long time too when you buy stamps and groceries, I agree them suits do get very warm after a while, I find shorts and straight forward camo cream a lot better for shopping and stamp buying.

D.B.
 

Dave

Hill Dweller
Sep 17, 2003
6,019
8
Brigantia
When youre out in the middle of nowhere doesnt really matter what colour it is, so long as it does the job.
 

Robson Valley

Full Member
Nov 24, 2014
8,279
1,378
McBride, BC
I began with some old clothes = coats and coveralls. Got painted with broad stripes and blobs of acrylic house paint in drab brown/beige/dirty green. Break-up camo. When I stop moving, I disappear, you can't pick out my human outline.

The absolute key point is to NEVER use a finish white acrylic paint. The companies all add some UV brightener to the finish white = you danfg near glow in the dark.
Best to ask for "primer white" and dilute that with small amounts of color.

What I see is that most commercial camo is really gaudy and bright colored when compared with the forest. And, the forests are different colors, too. My very best is a bib-front in high-sierra sage. Hardly any green at all. The jacket is totally covered with cut-leaf fabric, hat as well.
 

Klenchblaize

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Nov 25, 2005
2,584
123
61
Greensand Ridge
That rather suggests a season & location specific pattern approach as per that peddled by Realtree ‎and who for the most part fail miserably albeit I accept we aren't viewing with the eye of an ungulate.
‎
UK DPM has worked very well for me in Summer Lowland woodland for more years than I care to recall and I won't therefore be looking to improve on this.  

Finding the ultimate Autumn and Winter ‎patterns remains a challenge and is one I enjoy experimenting with.   As of writing I'm sold on the Cabelas Outfitter Brown for late Autumn but this probably has a lot to do with it being a wool garment.  

K‎
‎
 
It makes no difference if you wear came clothing for hunting. Animals I've been told don't see colour anyhows. We rarely use came for hunting.

In some places its darn right dangerous to wear came if you hunt cos there are folk whose skills at recognising what they are shooting at means folk have been shot in the woods by hunters. Now many hunters down south wear dayglo .

It is easy to hide in woods , or the forests and even in the open without camo - Stay still. Stay down, keep still,
 

C_Claycomb

Mod
Mod
Oct 6, 2003
5,588
658
Bedfordshire
My 2p.

"Animals I've been told don't see colour anyhows."


Animal is a catch all that covers all vertebrate and a big hunk of invertebrate life, that means mammal, bird, reptile, amphibian, fish, plus about eight different flavours of invertebrate. Many, animals have colour vision, and there are a lot that have colour vision as good or better than ours.

Many of the mammals that people hunt have dichromatic colour vision, meaning they have two types of colour receptors while we have three. Not all prey mammals see the same colours, so the colours that a deer can see are not entirely the same as can be seen by a rabbit. Squirrels and deer have vision similar to humans with red/green colour blindness, hence the use of day-glo orange, but even that is often broken up so that the human outline is somewhat camouflaged. Birds in general have excellent colour vision.
If you want to scare every creature for miles, try wearing something in solid bright blue.

Camo clothing may not give particular people in a particular place any discernible advantage hunting or approaching their target animal, but taking hunting and stalking more broadly there can be no doubt that it can confer an advantage, particularly when animals are encountered at close range. Not only can it help conceal you from the main target of your attention, but also from other animals which if startled could sound a warning and alert your target.

My experience is that camo can be quite location specific. Get it wrong and it isn't much if any better than just wearing drab solid colours. Get it right and you can blend in with much less effort, startle fewer alarm species and get away with being caught in the open more often.

Many of the patterns from the last 20 years aimed at hunters have been aimed at the US where hunting is often a late Fall or winter activity and where the dry/cold turns the landscape brown and grey. In the UK and I would imagine in other places with a milder maritime climate, things are pretty green all year round and you do tend to stand out rather a lot wearing one of the black/grey or orange/brown based patterns.

Covering the pink hands and face makes a huge difference, although you could probably get away with any solid colour that matched the tone and colour of the background.

If all you are doing is wishing to watch an animal, it may not be worth the extra cost, but getting a clean shot with a bow, rifle or camera is more demanding and if clothing can help, its a card worth playing.
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,394
881
63
Florida
That rather suggests a season & location specific pattern approach as per that peddled by Realtree ‎and who for the most part fail miserably albeit I accept we aren't viewing with the eye of an ungulate......‎
Ungulates aren't the most visually wary species hunted though. That would be doves and waterfowl.

It makes no difference if you wear came clothing for hunting. Animals I've been told don't see colour anyhows. We rarely use came for hunting.

In some places its darn right dangerous to wear came if you hunt cos there are folk whose skills at recognising what they are shooting at means folk have been shot in the woods by hunters. Now many hunters down south wear dayglo .

It is easy to hide in woods , or the forests and even in the open without camo - Stay still. Stay down, keep still,
Lots of truth to all of this except that as I stated above, most birds do indeed see colors. Even those that don't see colors as such will notice different hues. Yeah, the best way to hide is to stay still in the shadows (hence good camo often should blend with those shadows rather than foliage colors.

.....Many of the patterns from the last 20 years aimed at hunters have been aimed at the US where hunting is often a late Fall or winter activity and where the dry/cold turns the landscape brown and grey. In the UK and I would imagine in other places with a milder maritime climate, things are pretty green all year round and you do tend to stand out rather a lot wearing one of the black/grey or orange/brown based patterns.....
It would be interesting to see the companies such as Mossy Oak develop a pattern specifically for the UK.
 

bigant

Tenderfoot
Aug 30, 2009
83
0
35
Stoke on trent
i tend to wear whatever fits and is suitable for been outside been a short ****.. at 7 foot tall with size 16 feet and a 56 inch chest...
Im normally happy to just get something to fit sometimes its camo sometimes its not :) i have no problem with people in camo though when out and about..
People who sew badges on they dont deserve... like rank and para training badges ect get me annoyed at times.... but camo on its own no problems.
 

KenThis

Full Member
Jun 14, 2016
825
119
Cardiff
i tend to wear whatever fits and is suitable for been outside been a short ****.. at 7 foot tall with size 16 feet and a 56 inch chest...
Im normally happy to just get something to fit sometimes its camo sometimes its not :) i have no problem with people in camo though when out and about..
People who sew badges on they dont deserve... like rank and para training badges ect get me annoyed at times.... but camo on its own no problems.
I thought I was a giant at 6'4" and 20 odd stone... You have my sympathy in finding cheap, well fitting clothing... When you do find well fitting stuff please share I'm always on the lookout.
 

sunndog

Full Member
May 23, 2014
3,424
402
derbyshire
It makes no difference if you wear came clothing for hunting. It is easy to hide in woods , or the forests and even in the open without camo - Stay still. Stay down, keep still,
Agreed, even though i'v never liked it, i used to wear camo for hunting all the time, up until my early teens when i saw a herd of deer disapear before my eyes in the woods.....If they can do it just by being brown so can i
I'm not a big bird hunter but in the 20+ years since those deer i'v never felt at a disadvantage just wearing my normal muted colours
 

Johnnyboy1971

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Dec 24, 2010
4,153
21
48
Yorkshire
I wear camo (mtp) daily for work and sometimes in my leisure time. DPM for me is one of those patterns that stands out like a sore thumb. I find it cheap and cheerful and hard wearing for my job.

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