is birch any good for carving with

[alanssaab]

i went a walk into the local birch forrest the other week and there were a number of large birch that had been blown down recently in the storms so was wondering if this timber when green was good for working with , also which of the hook knifes is better for bowls ect or is it advisable to get both types ? thanks
alan

 

[DoctorSpoon]

Yes, it's brilliant for carving with - I make a lot of spoons from it and the Scandinavians make everything from it. Which hook knives are you referring to? I'm not sure what you mean by 'both types'.
Nicola

 

[John Fenna]

Very good to carve!
Carved green it is great and clean cutting, carved dry it takes sharp detail!

 

[alanssaab]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Frosts-Mora-C...tcZphotoQQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Frosts-Mora-C...tcZphotoQQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

these are the two i've seen , and thanks for the reply , looks like i'll be doing some chopping at the weekend

 

[DoctorSpoon]

My experience with those double sided ones is not good. Whilst technically you can get into more places with a cutting edge on either side you are completely reliant on hand strength because obviously you can't push the back of the blade for a more forceful cut. Having little hands I struggle with that, it might be easier if you've big hands.

I'd get a single edged one and see how it goes. If you feel the need to work the other way you can get a left handed one as well. I personally don't I just change my grip to work around the other way, but I know quite a few folk who work with both a left and a right hander. If you have both remember to clearly mark the handle of the leftie (we paint the ends blue) so you don't accidentally get the wrong one and push on the sharpened side!

 

[alanssaab]

thanks for the info but being a 41 year old joiner/ carpenter hand and arm strength isn't a problem , i'll take the chainsaw up into the woods on sunday , saturday is my 19th wedding aniversary (going to loch fynne then onto loch etive ) looking forward to trying this out

 

[Gailainne]

clearly mark the handle of the leftie (we paint the ends blue) so you don't accidentally get the wrong one and push on the sharpened side!

Ouch, thats the problem with the double edge ones, you forget, and need to add a little pressure...and why has the wood suddenly turned red

 

[Matt Weir]

thanks for the info but being a 41 year old joiner/ carpenter hand and arm strength isn't a problem , i'll take the chainsaw up into the woods on sunday , saturday is my 19th wedding aniversary (going to loch fynne then onto loch etive ) looking forward to trying this out

Off topic but congratulations Alan

 

[fishy1]

I love birch for working with, I'm currently building a coracle and it is forming a large part of it.

 

[alanssaab]

thanks matt for the congratulations , but i think i deserve a bloody medal

 

[cariboo]

My goodness. Buy a good quality double bevelled hook knife. If you buy a cheap one you will get lousy results. Better yet, make one if your inclined.

A good double bevel is hollow ground on its back for an aggressive edge, is made with good steel and will hold an excellent edge.

The shape and size of the handle is very important on any knife.

We just made a set of 5 for a mask carver in Alaska. She has tiny hands. We made tiny handles.
Look at what aboriginal people and Seattle carvers carve from Alaska all the way down the coast to Mexico. Hundreds of professional carvers. They are not stupid. Double bevel hook knives are their main tools.
I would think if you're getting bad results...try again

Oh yeah, birch is very nice to carve.

Scott.
Double bevelled hook knives.

 

[robin wood]

My goodness. Buy a good quality double bevelled hook knife. If you buy a cheap one you will get lousy results. Better yet, make one if your inclined.

A good double bevel is hollow ground on its back for an aggressive edge, is made with good steel and will hold an excellent edge.

The shape and size of the handle is very important on any knife.

We just made a set of 5 for a mask carver in Alaska. She has tiny hands. We made tiny handles.
Look at what aboriginal people and Seattle carvers carve from Alaska all the way down the coast to Mexico. Hundreds of professional carvers. They are not stupid. Double bevel hook knives are their main tools.
I would think if you're getting bad results...try again

Oh yeah, birch is very nice to carve.

Scott.
Double bevelled hook knives.

My take on this is that it depends what you want to carve and which tradition you are inspired by. Most folk carving in Europe at the moment are following European and particularly Scandinavian tradition so carving hardwoods and primarily spoons and small bowls like kuksas. The traditional tools for this are short handled single bevel hooks and the best on the market at the moment are (in my opinion) hand forged in Sweden. The Frosts hooks are cheap but (again in my opinion) don't work very well out of the box and need quite a bit of work to get them working reasonably. I have nothing against cheap and love the Frost's straight knives, many people here get on well with the Frost hook knives though I am not sure how many have tried all the alternatives.

The West coast native American carving tradition has every bit as much to offer as the European one though it is different. As I understand it (do correct me if I am wrong) more soft woods such as cedar were used particularly for masks and totems and the grips are different, the hooks being used more frequently palm up which is unusual in Europe and two handed carving on larger objects also being common. I would love to experience this type of work. I have seen some wonderful bowls, do you have pictures of any you could share Scott? I would be interested to know what timbers were traditionally used for bowls over there.

I would love to try one of your knives Scott but by gosh they are expensive even with the current weak dollar, 4 or 5 times the price of the best Swedish forged hooks.

I have been considering putting together a package of the various hooks available as a pass around so that folk could try everything available for a week then pass them on to the next person. There really is nothing quite like playing with a bunch of these tools to get a feel for the quality and also for what fits your hand and your style.

 

[gorilla]

I have been considering putting together a package of the various hooks available as a pass around so that folk could try everything available for a week then pass them on to the next person. There really is nothing quite like playing with a bunch of these tools to get a feel for the quality and also for what fits your hand and your style.

that would be a great idea Robin - i have a pair of frosts - 1 single and 1 double bevel, and i seem to have been doing ok with them, but as you rightly say, i fall into the group that hasn't tried any of the alternatives. the frosts don't seem sharp enough, and i rely on hand strength alot of the time to force the cut.
i would definitely be interested in a pass around

 

[loz.]

Its good to turn too !!!!!


click to enlarge,




Loz

 

[mr dazzler]

As I understand it (do correct me if I am wrong) more soft woods such as cedar were used particularly for masks and totems and the grips are different, the hooks being used more frequently palm up which is unusual in Europe and two handed carving on larger objects also being common.

Typically non conforming EUropean as ever , I instintivley use the palm up style like the alaskan and inuitt peples use to carve, I find this better than poatato peeler style grip, and I find it easier to take fatter heavier cuts, faster, and also easier to maintain symettry when doing hollows in spoons/ladles etc (one cut left, one cut right or one forward one backwards etc)