Hand or Bow ?

[jongir]

Hi guys,

I've never started a fire (YET) and I'am wondering what is the difference between hand drill and bow drill (except the obvious). What I mean is, is this a personal choice or is one better than the other depending on what materials you have to hand. So I suppose what I mean is when your out on the ground do you choose the method or does the method choose itself?

 

[Ed]

Thats a really good question actually. I know alot of people 'think' the bow drill is easier and that the hand drill is much harder..... but I beg to differ. Just ask roving rich, who I had a conversation with at the moot .... telling him that the hand drill is easier ..... he wouldn't believe me....till he went to the hand drill lesson.... 4 passes and a coal appeared .... I think he is now converted

From personal expierence and teaching, I have found that people who are more stamina orientated (think long distance runners... boxers that use alot of hook / uppercuts in for the long haul) tend to be better at the bow drill, where as more 'burst speed' orientated people (think sprinters and boxers with the fast jab) tend to get on better with the hand drill.

I have only been doing the hand drill for a couple of years (as opposed to 10+ with the bow drill), and only really got into the hand drill in the past year, but I find it so much easier than the bow drill...... but when it comes down to it,its a personal thing...... Try both, learn both, but you will find one that you prefer.

Ed

 

[jongir]

Thanks Ed,

If I'm not mistaken (which I probably am) It's a hard wood for the drill and a soft wood for for the board?(not sure one the wording). I'll have a look on the tutorials too and hopefully some of that will stick.

Again thanks.

The reason I asked was that when watching RM sometimes he uses the bow and other times he uses the hand drill and I always wondered if it was anything to do with the native woods of where he was.

 

[Ed]

Well for the hand drill at the moot workshop, most people were using elder or teasal (sp?) drills with pine boards from a DIY store.... and they worked a treat. Remember though that teasal (sp?) will pull moisture out of the air, and can be a little hard to use in the winter months, but fine in dry summer..... elder drills work all year round for me though. For hearth boards for the hand drill. I tend to look at the qualities of the wood....soft enough to take a thumb nail print, but not so soft as to take a thumb print.... and as long as i get smoke on the firstcouple of passes (as long as its all dry) then I can usualy produce a coal.

Have a good seach on bow drill tutorials as there are lots of recomendations for wood combinations. The easiest I've found was a hazel drill on an ivy hearth..... but willow and birch hearths are also good for beginers...

Hope this helps.


Ed

 

[Ed]

The reason I asked was that when watching RM sometimes he uses the bow and other times he uses the hand drill and I always wondered if it was anything to do with the native woods of where he was.

ooops didn't answer your actual question.... sorry for ranting....

Whats available would have alot to do with it, especially for a tv programme that needs to show a variety of techniques in different environments. Doing the bow drill all the timewould get pretty boring I would think.

Ed

 

[jongir]

Thanks ed I'll try the different combi's.
(boy - you may have a lot to say, but it's all top notch stuff in my book)

 

[Jeff Wagner]

I think the bow drill affords success with a broader range of materials than the hand drill however in my experience, when conditions are right, coal formation with the hand drill is actually easier. When conditions are not favorable the hand drill is much less reliable. Reminds me of an engraving on an old German rifle

"Alle kunst ist umsumpts ven ein engle auf das zundelocke brunst". Apologies for any mispellings...

While performing a hand drill demo the other day I had the occaision to experience coal formation in the mullein spindle as well as in the dust pile. I have read about this before but its the first time its happened for me.

The photo is not very good - all I had available at the moment was my cell phone.

 

[jongir]

"Alle kunst ist umsumpts ven ein engle auf das zundelocke brunst". Apologies for any mispellings...

Now you've got me intrigued! You cany just give us the german version. Translation please

 

[Snufkin]

I agree with Jeff Wagner. Another point is physical stamina, I could probably spin away on a bowdrill all day but I can only go five or six times in a row with a hand drill, that's not even considering the damage to my palms. But if the conditions are good then the hand drill is faster.

 

[jongir]

I think I'll give it a try this weekend

 

[BobFromHolland]

I only managed bow drill fires yet. With different woods.

I occasionally get smoke from hand drill, and blisters!, but no ember yet.
I think it is a elder drill I'm using and a pine hearth.

Bob

 

[Snufkin]

I only managed bow drill fires yet. With different woods.

I occasionally get smoke from hand drill, and blisters!, but no ember yet.
I think it is a elder drill I'm using and a pine hearth.

Bob

If you are getting smoke but no ember it may be your set. For ages I could get smoke but no ember from my Budlea drill/birch root hearth, then I changed to a clematis hearth and bingo! Ember.
I've not tried a pine hearth but I have made an ember from elder drill/clematis hearth, so if you can find some, give it a try.

 

[Jeff Wagner]

If anyone has an interest in seeing a video of a 15 second hand drill coal, please send me a PM.

 

[Jeff Wagner]

"Alle kunst ist umsumpts ven ein engle auf das zundelocke brunst". Apologies for any mispellings...

Now you've got me intrigued! You cany just give us the german version. Translation please

PM sent. In essence, "dont go hunting with a flintlock when its raining".

 

[falling rain]

Thanks Ed,

If I'm not mistaken (which I probably am) It's a hard wood for the drill and a soft wood for for the board?(not sure one the wording). I'll have a look on the tutorials too and hopefully some of that will stick.

Again thanks.

The reason I asked was that when watching RM sometimes he uses the bow and other times he uses the hand drill and I always wondered if it was anything to do with the native woods of where he was.

To add to Ed's answer.....RM usually tries to use the technique used by the natives of the particular area he is in. ( generally speaking). Hand drill tends to be used by the natives in extremely hot areas, Australia - Aboriginies Africa - san and Masai, Arizona desert. Native Indians etc Fire plough south seas (polynesians) and NZ Maoris (south seas decendants) etc, and bow drill in temperate climates like colder european countries including UK and colder areas of the US like Alaska. That's how I understood it anyway.....Could be wrong though :theyareon

 

[rich59]

When I get the chance I challenge myself with trying to create a coal/ start of a fire from materials found in a given environment. Sometimes there will be something suitable for a hand drill. Sometimes there is material to make up some cordage to make a bow drill.

Mostly I fail though unless a hand drill candidate turns up as it is a major challenge for me to make up strong enough cordage to survive the rigors of the bow drill.

Mostly I fail anyway!

This week I had access to the flotsum and jetsum of a remote Scottish island beach. Don't look on plastic as an eye sore. Think of it as potential for making a fire starter! I ran out of time but I did put together the makings of a bow drill using a cast up bush the make the drill, bow handle and hearth, a shell for the bearing block and some plastic material to make cordage. Another 3 hours and I might have done it. Oh well.

 

[BobFromHolland]

If you are getting smoke but no ember it may be your set. For ages I could get smoke but no ember from my Budlea drill/birch root hearth, then I changed to a clematis hearth and bingo! Ember.
I've not tried a pine hearth but I have made an ember from elder drill/clematis hearth, so if you can find some, give it a try.

Thanks Snufkin,

I had exactly the same experience on the bow-drill, but hadn't thought about changing a thing with my hand drill set How's that for smart???

Bob

 

[BobFromHolland]

If anyone has an interest in seeing a video of a 15 second hand drill coal, please send me a PM.

Yes Jeff, I am interested!
It seems a lot more users are, since your PM box seems to be full.

I'll try PMming you later.

Bob

 

[Jeff Wagner]

Sorry - I have cleaned up the mailbox.