Habitat with most odds off obtaining all your wild food needs in the U.K.

[Poacherman]

I've just been reading the STV news and there's a report on the growing spread of the Chinese Mitten Crab in the UK.....down south from us, so far.

Invasive Chinese mitten crabs the size of dinner plates spotted in UK

The large crabs have been described as one of the world's worst invasive species.

news.stv.tv

Now surely something that size has got to be worth catchting and eating, as a public service you understand
Eat up to stop the damage they cause.

M

Lot in Thames I believe

Some do. Many don't.

Most do though

 

[Poacherman]

Japanese macaques fish. They even do it in fast flowing streams.

You know the phrase, "monkey see, monkey do".....well that's us. Humanity sees something like bird diving for fish and decides that they can do it too.
It doesn't mean we're adapted to dive for fish, it simply means it's another skill in the toolbox of humanity.

......and no, shell middens weren't produced by diving, not here, they're simply collected from the foreshore.

Oysters were once so prolific that they were the food of the poor. Indeed the apprentices in London went on strike and one of their demands was no oysters or salmon more than once a week.

Besides, some of us can't eat fish, we're allergic. Surprising numbers of people are allergic to fish and shellfish, and entire cultures refuse to eat shellfish anyway.

Do macaques five deep? I knew they did it just haven't checked how deep.

 

[n00b]

In these sorts of discussions, people rarely mention insects, ants, ant eggs, earth worms, snails and slugs and so on, from a survival perspective. Admitidly, from the point of view of this thread, they are not really location specific. I'm one and a half series into Alone, and they barely feature there either. Is there any evidence of prehistoric people eating these? Or do they just not provide enough calories to be worthwhile?
I think I would also choose the coastal areas of East Anglia. Combination of wetlands, woodland, lakes and rivers and the sea.

Some interesting ideas on radio 4's food programme on wild food earlier this year, including eating wood ants by the spoonful:

BBC Radio 4 - The Food Programme, Eating Wild

Can you eat like a hunter-gatherer in modern Britain? Dan Saladino meets people who are.

www.bbc.co.uk

Second part came out this month - all very relevant to this thread: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001rgvm

Not all slugs and snails are edible.
So be extremely careful if experimenting.

Where I'm camped now, there are the remains of someone who camped here before me - and around their cooking area are loads of snail shells.

Typical values:

	per 100g	kcal	Fat g	Prot g
Lamb	Heart	129.5​	6.8​	17.1​
	Kidney	91.4​	2.6​	17.0​
	Liver	137.1​	6.2​	20.3​
Pig	Heart	97.3​	3.2​	17.7​
	Kidney	86.3​	2.7​	17.1​
	Liver	113.2​	3.1​	15.5​
Ox	Heart	104.3​	3.5​	21.3​
	Kidney	87.7​	2.1​	18.2​
	Liver	154.5​	7.8​	17.2​
Chicken	Liver	91.5​	​	17.7​

Anyone know of anywhere that lists calories of wild plant foods? I've not found anything comprehensive

 

[n00b]

Iv done similar weekend excursions but Iv prepared wild walnut butter in advance that beats rabbit starvation .Be cool to stretch it to 7 days just to say Iv done it ,but to many people n everywere is owned by somebody .

How do you make your walnut butter @Poacherman?

Also btw just do your 7 day experiment. Everywhere has owners yes but few of those owners use much of their land and not one of them can do anything but politely ask you to leave!

 

[n00b]

Re vegan options leaf curd is interesting. I made some last month from stinging nettles mashed between stone and strained through muslin to boil the liquid and skim off the curds, then I strained that through cycling shorts. In a survival situation, this may be a viable option - and it's not limiting to any particular habitat. If you haven't heard of it, the idea is that it extracts the protein, along with plenty of micronutrients, from basically any leaf (though some are better than others, nitrogen-fixing are best, eg beans). This was my yield from about an hour's work, but it can be dried and stored

 

[Wander]

That sounds like an awful lot of work for little return.
How many calories do you expend processing it compared to what you gain from eating it?
I wonder if, in a survival situation, you wouldn't be better off just eating the nettle leaves raw? You'd certainly be up on the calorie count, that's for sure. Which, in that survival situation, would be the more important thing.

 

[TLM]

Just a reminder that (natural) plants are not there to eat, they actually fight back with chemicals to make themselves inedible.

 

[Wander]

True. But some (natural) plants (could you name some 'unnatural' ones for us?) are better at it than some. Nettles are a good example of a (natural) plant that humans can consume.
Or maybe it's escaped your notice that humans have been eating (natural) plants since we've existed.
But, yes, some (natural) plants can have negative effects. Not sure anyone is suggesting otherwise though so don't see the necessity of the cautionary advice.

 

[Broch]

Well, n00b did say "basically any leaf" - I would advise against such things as Conium maculatum however

But I agree, if you've got the time to do all that faffing about, you're not in a survival situation. Also, you've lost some of the value of the 'greens' by boiling. The only reason you'd do this is if it had a storage value for 'winter greens' but I think there are easier ways.

 

[Broch]

How do you make your walnut butter @Poacherman?

Also btw just do your 7 day experiment. Everywhere has owners yes but few of those owners use much of their land and not one of them can do anything but politely ask you to leave!

Best not to encourage anyone to break the law on an open public forum

Also, be aware that, going onto someone's private property with a knife, axe, catapult, air rifle, or other such 'tool', is armed trespass and a criminal offense. So, no, there is more a landowner can do than politely ask you to leave.

 

[Broch]

Anyone know of anywhere that lists calories of wild plant foods? I've not found anything comprehensive

Here's a mixed table of commercial and wild foods. The last column of number of units a day assumes you need at least 3000kcals a day - in practice, it is likely, in many scenarios, that you will need more than that for long-term survival.

 

[TLM]

could you name some 'unnatural' ones for us?

There are several cultivated plants that have undergone selective breeding to get rid of some unhealthy chemical. Largest tonnage might be rape seed "canola" to get rid of an unhealthy acid.

 

[Wander]

So we should limit ourselves to just genetically modified crops?
I wonder how those herbivores and omnivores who have evolved to eat (natural) plants would feel about that, not to mention those hunter gatherer and nomadic communities who have done perfectly well for many generations?
Come on!
It's perfectly ok to eat (natural) plants - just so long as one knows what one is eating. But, again, no one has suggested otherwise.

 

[TLM]

So we should limit ourselves to just genetically modified crops?

Jumping to wrong conclusion. Canola is not gene modified, very old fashioned selective breeding was used.

I wonder how those herbivores and omnivores who have evolved to eat (natural) plants would feel about that

They are are actively having a war with the plants, more than a few are not healthy for ruminants.

not to mention those hunter gatherer and nomadic communities who have done perfectly well for many generations?

Or more correctly just survived, the population explosion only happened after agriculture started in large scale. Apparently even very early selective breeding was used.

It's perfectly ok to eat (natural) plants - just so long as one knows what one is eating.

You can survive eating some plants even though they contain something like oxalates or whatever but that does not mean thriving.

 

[n00b]

Well, n00b did say "basically any leaf" - I would advise against such things as Conium maculatum however

But I agree, if you've got the time to do all that faffing about, you're not in a survival situation. Also, you've lost some of the value of the 'greens' by boiling. The only reason you'd do this is if it had a storage value for 'winter greens' but I think there are easier ways.

I meant it - in theory. Because you're only extracting the protein, even poisonous plants could be used. But I don't foresee that ever being necessary, unless you're trapped in a wicked witch's greenhouse.

 

[n00b]

Here's a mixed table of commercial and wild foods. The last column of number of units a day assumes you need at least 3000kcals a day - in practice, it is likely, in many scenarios, that you will need more than that for long-term survival.

Thanks that's handy. Think I've found calorie counts for many of these, though, like acorns, nettles, chestnuts etc. It would be good to find a comprehensive list of common wild plants and their nutritional profiles including calories.

 

[n00b]

That sounds like an awful lot of work for little return.
How many calories do you expend processing it compared to what you gain from eating it?
I wonder if, in a survival situation, you wouldn't be better off just eating the nettle leaves raw? You'd certainly be up on the calorie count, that's for sure. Which, in that survival situation, would be the more important thing.

Yes it's a lot of work but I suppose you could make it in days of plenty to store for times of scarcity. And if you're not a homeless tramp like me you might have access to a food processor, in which case you can make loads at minimal calorie expenditure. It's a great source not just of protein but several other nutrients:

Leaf concentrate is an extremely nutritious human food, containing approximately 50% (dry weight) high-quality protein, together with numerous micronutrients, principally beta-carotene, vitamins B6, B9, E and K, plus iron, calcium and magnesium. Many studies have shown that those consuming it recover quickly from nutritional anaemia and have a significantly improved general state of health.

https://research-information.bris.ac.uk/en/publications/leaf-concentrate-and-other-benefits-of-leaf-fractionation

 

[n00b]

Eating the leaves instead would of course not have the same nutritional profile, and as much as I would like to know calories, they're not all important.

 

[n00b]

Just a reminder that (natural) plants are not there to eat, they actually fight back with chemicals to make themselves inedible.

I'm not an expert but I thought many plants evolved certain traits, like brightly coloured berries for birds, specifically to be eaten so their seeds could be propagated through shite. The botany of desire.

 

[TLM]

like brightly coloured berries for birds, specifically to be eaten so their seeds could be propagated through shite

Yup, but that is not at all like eating the plant itself. Even there is some selectivity as some berries are poisonous to some animals and not to others. Then there is the case of the pulp(?) being edible but seeds poisonous like yew. Even there we have selection as some cultivated berries are the result of selective breeding to get rid of things like saponins.