Forests and how we have treated them, a man made landscape.
- Thread starter boatman
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Thanks, boatman. Very educational for me, living in the Boreal forest. Those medieval forests had many values which needed management for sustainability.
Much of our forested landscape has had very few people and a fire cycle of 70-100 years. The subsequent seral stage progression is quite predictable.
Much of our forested landscape has had very few people and a fire cycle of 70-100 years. The subsequent seral stage progression is quite predictable.
Yup, you got that right. The big fires here are slowing down, up in the same region as the Fort McMurray fires. That beast has burnt 390,000 acres and growing.
Dry + big wind + freak high temps and POOF! Maybe 20% of Fort Mac got burned out. The air was so hot, trees were exploding like popcorn.
Evacs in Fort St. John have been stood down to alerts again and people are going home.
Have not heard of any damage. They got cold and a dusting of snow a couple of nights ago. Forest Service fire crews are on it.
The two biggies are the Siphon Creek fire and the Beatton Airport Road wild fires, if anybody is dropping names.
In my district, we didn't get a lot of snow this winter past. I don't think we got 3', if that. It melted 6+ weeks early. No rain to replace it. Maybe 1.5" total rain in the last 6 weeks at my place.
Cold rain showers in the last few days, gives a dusting of snow up top (6,000 - 9,000') but it melts away by noon each day. Not going to be a good summer for hay at all.
Thanks for thinking of us.
RV/Brian
Dry + big wind + freak high temps and POOF! Maybe 20% of Fort Mac got burned out. The air was so hot, trees were exploding like popcorn.
Evacs in Fort St. John have been stood down to alerts again and people are going home.
Have not heard of any damage. They got cold and a dusting of snow a couple of nights ago. Forest Service fire crews are on it.
The two biggies are the Siphon Creek fire and the Beatton Airport Road wild fires, if anybody is dropping names.
In my district, we didn't get a lot of snow this winter past. I don't think we got 3', if that. It melted 6+ weeks early. No rain to replace it. Maybe 1.5" total rain in the last 6 weeks at my place.
Cold rain showers in the last few days, gives a dusting of snow up top (6,000 - 9,000') but it melts away by noon each day. Not going to be a good summer for hay at all.
Thanks for thinking of us.
RV/Brian
Just tonight, forestry people tell me that the Beatton and Siphon fires, added together, have burned more area than the Fort McMurray fire.
Gonna be a hot summer.
Gonna be a hot summer.
Dave: from that day and time to this one, are wild fires, forest fires, ever much of an issue as they are here?
That was good. I have been reading Oliver Rackhams `Trees and woodlands in the British Landscape` which is good.
Place near here, they dug down to the Mesolithic and found hoofprints of Giant deer and Auroch.
I dont think I would have liked Cornwall back then.
Place near here, they dug down to the Mesolithic and found hoofprints of Giant deer and Auroch.
I dont think I would have liked Cornwall back then.
Canadian Boreal Forest Biome coniferous forests appear to have a 70-100 year fire cycle which is documented in my district, going back 7,000 years.
The adaptation of Lodgepole and Jack pine cones with fire is called "serotinous." Apparently for seed collection, the effect can be duplicated with a microwave oven!
Cleaned, "Plus Tree" quality seed runs maybe $4,500/kg. Don't recall nominal seed quantity in that.
Recall that the Rocky Mountains more or less divide British Columbia from Alberta and further east.
Here on my side, the west slope, the Mountain Pine Beetle epidemic from maybe 1995 - 2005 has left us with
18,000,000 ha (44, 480,000 acres) standing dead, cracked pine of next to no commercial value at all.
That's our real fire hazard.
For forest fires in the UK, what's yours?
The adaptation of Lodgepole and Jack pine cones with fire is called "serotinous." Apparently for seed collection, the effect can be duplicated with a microwave oven!
Cleaned, "Plus Tree" quality seed runs maybe $4,500/kg. Don't recall nominal seed quantity in that.
Recall that the Rocky Mountains more or less divide British Columbia from Alberta and further east.
Here on my side, the west slope, the Mountain Pine Beetle epidemic from maybe 1995 - 2005 has left us with
18,000,000 ha (44, 480,000 acres) standing dead, cracked pine of next to no commercial value at all.
That's our real fire hazard.
For forest fires in the UK, what's yours?
In Savernake Forest, Wiltshire, it was worrying that a new policy left a lot of cut underbrush among the trees. Fortunately we had damp season and it rotted down quite quickly. I suppose it was good for the wildlife to leave it.
The apparent mismanagement philosophy of the day was to stop forest fires at all cost, whether the fire was a threat to people or not.
The direct consequence was an ever increasing tinder dry fuel load (needles, cones & the self-pruned lower twigs) in the understory.
Once the fire gets going, they often jump and run, creating their own weather and wind to blow up as a firestorm. As in a blacksmith's forge
the temperatures are running maybe 1,000C in the fire (cannot put that out with hoses or airsupport = too hot, simple as that).
Now, the fire crews protect what they can of human activity. To their credit, 80+% of Fort McMurray is still standing.
Next, they will turn their attention to firing ahead of the main front to starve it of fuel. There's no rain in the forecast
so if no immediate threat, let it go because fire is a natural part of our landscape.
The direct consequence was an ever increasing tinder dry fuel load (needles, cones & the self-pruned lower twigs) in the understory.
Once the fire gets going, they often jump and run, creating their own weather and wind to blow up as a firestorm. As in a blacksmith's forge
the temperatures are running maybe 1,000C in the fire (cannot put that out with hoses or airsupport = too hot, simple as that).
Now, the fire crews protect what they can of human activity. To their credit, 80+% of Fort McMurray is still standing.
Next, they will turn their attention to firing ahead of the main front to starve it of fuel. There's no rain in the forecast
so if no immediate threat, let it go because fire is a natural part of our landscape.
It really depends on just what wildlife you mean. Some benefit from underbrush (white-tailed deer here come to mind) and others from a more open floor. A truly natural forest grows through different stages of undergrowth to openness over two to three centuries and the wildlife under the canopy changes with the growth.
A natural forest grows through several seral stages, one canopy replacing another and as you say, santaman, the understory and the wildlife change with it.
I have a sneaking suspicion, that I can't document, that many British forests are maintained in a state of stasis where little has changed for maybe thousands of years.
I live in a volatile and violent landscape, altered so recently by both the ice ages and repeated fires.
In an hour or two, I can show you 5 or 6 wholly different landscapes from hot sand dunes to dark, dark conifer forest.
On the dunes, there are objects which look like dog turds. They are not. They are living knots of algae and fungus.
Just about the strangest living things that I have ever seen.
I have a sneaking suspicion, that I can't document, that many British forests are maintained in a state of stasis where little has changed for maybe thousands of years.
I live in a volatile and violent landscape, altered so recently by both the ice ages and repeated fires.
In an hour or two, I can show you 5 or 6 wholly different landscapes from hot sand dunes to dark, dark conifer forest.
On the dunes, there are objects which look like dog turds. They are not. They are living knots of algae and fungus.
Just about the strangest living things that I have ever seen.
To answer your question about british forest fires, they aren't a particular problem. As you suspected, our forests are both managed and small.
We do have a (small) issue with fires on open heathland. It's not a major issue. The areas that can be a worry have peat in the ground. If fire gets into that, it is a real pain to put out, usually it's just a case of contain and wait for rain (hence you'll see comments on the site about not having open fires on places like Dartmoor). However almost never are buildings threatened.
We do have a (small) issue with fires on open heathland. It's not a major issue. The areas that can be a worry have peat in the ground. If fire gets into that, it is a real pain to put out, usually it's just a case of contain and wait for rain (hence you'll see comments on the site about not having open fires on places like Dartmoor). However almost never are buildings threatened.
Probably not. The insect record, beetles in particular, has led scientists to believe since 6,000 BC, we had more patchy woodland, rather than dense canopy. But over the last million years, we've probably seen every enviroment, from Savanah to arctic
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