Devil's advocate
- Thread starter sodajoe
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sodajoe said:
I think your wrong there, I think the general most people on here are all rounders!
I think gear is easier to discuss which adds something.
I have written a variety of "extended posts" on everything from firelighting to choosing an axe to making perfect campfire coffee.
One thing I have noticed. When I get together with people, skills are the most interesting (show me how to.....). They are harder to show in photo posts however. Showing the right way to roast coffee when you can see, smell and hear is easy. On a forum? Much harder.
I try to show the reality of my "walks in the woods" but I know it loses a lot in translation. I was tempted to throw a guided walk into the charity auction, but I know I never show how magical my area is
Red
I have written a variety of "extended posts" on everything from firelighting to choosing an axe to making perfect campfire coffee.
One thing I have noticed. When I get together with people, skills are the most interesting (show me how to.....). They are harder to show in photo posts however. Showing the right way to roast coffee when you can see, smell and hear is easy. On a forum? Much harder.
I try to show the reality of my "walks in the woods" but I know it loses a lot in translation. I was tempted to throw a guided walk into the charity auction, but I know I never show how magical my area is
Red
It would be great to be able to discuss plant lore more often, but firstly it is a seasonal thing and what with us coming into spring it is understandable there hasn't been much around to discuss.
Secondly, knowledge of this is very limited as it is not really practised by a great many people unfortunately.
Thirdly, I think (that is in my opinion) these sort of things are best taught on the ground in person as questions can be asked there and then, you smell the plant so it registers in the mind and makes learning easier. You can feel the texture and this also helps it stick in the mind.
I know a lot of the posts are kit based, but everybody chooses how much they want to rely on modern kit whilst bushcrafting. I've slept in leaf litter shelters and must say it is possibly the warmest night outdoors I've ever had. I like to be able to take a shelter I can erect and take down in less than half a day though!
Same goes for cooking equipment. A fire is great, a bit slower than a peak stove or a Nova, but then that is why I prefer an open fire but the restrictions on fire lighting can make it impossible to use anything other than a portable camping type stove of some sort or other.
It's a valid point, but it also helps us decide on the kit we want to buy without buying crap kit and finding out the hard way.
Secondly, knowledge of this is very limited as it is not really practised by a great many people unfortunately.
Thirdly, I think (that is in my opinion) these sort of things are best taught on the ground in person as questions can be asked there and then, you smell the plant so it registers in the mind and makes learning easier. You can feel the texture and this also helps it stick in the mind.
I know a lot of the posts are kit based, but everybody chooses how much they want to rely on modern kit whilst bushcrafting. I've slept in leaf litter shelters and must say it is possibly the warmest night outdoors I've ever had. I like to be able to take a shelter I can erect and take down in less than half a day though!
Same goes for cooking equipment. A fire is great, a bit slower than a peak stove or a Nova, but then that is why I prefer an open fire but the restrictions on fire lighting can make it impossible to use anything other than a portable camping type stove of some sort or other.
It's a valid point, but it also helps us decide on the kit we want to buy without buying crap kit and finding out the hard way.
i would agree with you slightly, but i think for example people like myself(new to bushcraft) dont really want to jump into anything too quickly, like friction fire etc before knowing the basics first, i would rather be comfartable with camping before starting to create woodland shelters and such likes first.
although i would like to learn more about trees, woods plants to eat etc.
although i would like to learn more about trees, woods plants to eat etc.
The BCUK mag has some stuff with regards to useful plants, which reminds me, I need to renew my subscription!
What does it matter?
We discuss the things that interest us and that are convenient to discuss in this online format.
Kit is something we all need and it costs money. Discussing what others have found useful or bad helps us to make informed decisions before parting with our hard-earned cash.
Very often we have to buy online for lower prices, availability and because many of us hate shopping. Discussing with others which are the best stores and what kit is good has saved me from making costly mistakes and has got me good advice and what might be the best to get.
I don't always follow advice given and many things that people tell me is fantastic kit is out of my budget but at least I get a feel for what might work and a frame of reference.
But I'm happy to discuss whatever's going down. In many departments I'm not qualified to give advice so I don't. I'm not going to tell people which fungus is safe to eat because I don't know. But seeing as I wear boots, trousers and a jacket I might be able to say what I like to use when somebody asks.
We discuss the things that interest us and that are convenient to discuss in this online format.
Kit is something we all need and it costs money. Discussing what others have found useful or bad helps us to make informed decisions before parting with our hard-earned cash.
Very often we have to buy online for lower prices, availability and because many of us hate shopping. Discussing with others which are the best stores and what kit is good has saved me from making costly mistakes and has got me good advice and what might be the best to get.
I don't always follow advice given and many things that people tell me is fantastic kit is out of my budget but at least I get a feel for what might work and a frame of reference.
But I'm happy to discuss whatever's going down. In many departments I'm not qualified to give advice so I don't. I'm not going to tell people which fungus is safe to eat because I don't know. But seeing as I wear boots, trousers and a jacket I might be able to say what I like to use when somebody asks.
sodajoe said:
This old chestnut again.
Do your own thing and don't bother with anyone who irritates you.
If I wanted to talk to someone about plants, I'd talk to the people from my area 
.
It's the only reason I don't, you're in the UK! I'm in Canada, we may have some similar plants, but not all the same!
I think it's easier to talk about the gear, and things we make, rather than;
"this weekend I came across four silver maples, and gathered yellow wood sorrel while in their shade. I then came across coyote tracks that lead to a kill it made."
I've read those types of topics. Heck, I've written those topics. They're good and interesting, but it's not really a big conversation piece. And not everyone can share the same interest. Silver Maple doesn't grow in Australia, and coyote aren't in the UK.
My own thoughts I guess
.It's the only reason I don't, you're in the UK! I'm in Canada, we may have some similar plants, but not all the same!
I think it's easier to talk about the gear, and things we make, rather than;
"this weekend I came across four silver maples, and gathered yellow wood sorrel while in their shade. I then came across coyote tracks that lead to a kill it made."
I've read those types of topics. Heck, I've written those topics. They're good and interesting, but it's not really a big conversation piece. And not everyone can share the same interest. Silver Maple doesn't grow in Australia, and coyote aren't in the UK.
My own thoughts I guess
sodajoe said:
Whatever people are or are not concerned with, it doesnt have anything to do with this site. People use all sorts of forums for all sorts of chatter. They talk about what they want to, roughly withing the topic framework of the forum. Who cares whether 50% want to tlk about kit or not? Just pretend you cant see those threads if you dont want to get involved.
Some people on this site dont ever leave thier gardens - so what? Some people on this site just collect gear - so what? Some people on this site cant spell very well - so what? Who cares?
Just do what you want to do, take from the place whatever makes you happy and leave others to do the same.
Martyn said:
I do. I've lost count of the number of times I've had to sit and re-read a post to try and work out what the person is actually trying to say. That is bad communication. I'm not asking for the Oxford English Dictionary, but some posts are almost written like phone texts - and poor ones at that. No punctuation, no capital letters, no structure, p**s-poor spelling - no sense! In fact, there are people writing posts on this site in their second language that are far better that some of the ones you see in people's so-called first language. The whole idea of a forum is to communicate so I believe everyone should at least make an effort!
Anyway - that specific rant over - but that's not the question...
Sodajoe said:
In principal, I agree with you. In practice, I looked at the number of posts I've put in the kit forum and there's quite a few! I do have a bee in my bonnet about people asking the same rubbish questions (ie, "Poll: What's Your Favourite Colour?" and "What's the best {insert random object here}?") but when we actually go out and do something, we do it with kit, don't we? We wear clothes, shoes, carry things in backpacks, etc. And sometimes it's good to get someone else's perspective before you spend your hard earned cash on kit that could be quite expensive.
One of the main problems with the kit forum is repetition - there are so many posts which have been discussed before, so it looks like there is more emphasis on kit than there actually is. That's what the search function is for.
So, I reckon there is certainly a place in the forums for kit discussions but I agree that it should not be the focus of bushcraft. We do actually need to get out there and learn to use it at some point and that's where the skills, plant identification, etc, come in.
Here we go again... Ah well, it's been at least two months since someone posted this eternal moan, I suppose it's due...
If you're not happy with the balance of posts on BCUK, there are a few things you can do:
1. Post on the subject that interests you.
2. Ignore the threads that bore you.
3. Switch off the PC and go do something less boring instead.
4. Post a thread moaning that other people aren't talking enough about the things you want them to talk about.
Three of these options are productive and worthwhile. One is not. Can you spot which one?
I mean, seriously, would you go round at a party telling people that they're not having the sort of conversations you want to join?
If you're not happy with the balance of posts on BCUK, there are a few things you can do:
1. Post on the subject that interests you.
2. Ignore the threads that bore you.
3. Switch off the PC and go do something less boring instead.
4. Post a thread moaning that other people aren't talking enough about the things you want them to talk about.
Three of these options are productive and worthwhile. One is not. Can you spot which one?
I mean, seriously, would you go round at a party telling people that they're not having the sort of conversations you want to join?
Is that a horse chestnut or a sweet one? Did you know the inside of a horse chestnut can be used as soap? even old ones.falling rain said:
Don't misunderstand me, my intention is not to annoy or irritate. I think one of the best things about this site is the information on kit and gear because, as previously mentioned, it does save many people from shelling out a lot of cash on gear that's no good. This is rightly applauded.
I have also spent my fair share of time going through posts in this forum to advise on the kit that I have bought.
Neither is it my intention to stifle chit-chat about knives, boots or any other bit of clobber. There is no right or wrong on this issue. If you like to talk about kit, bully for you.
What I hoped to do was raise the issue that there are twice as many posts in the kit and tools section as all the other posts put together. Again I stress, this is neither good or bad. It's not my place or my intention to judge
Maybe, this will encourage more people to discuss other things such as tracking and plants... maybe it won't. I just thought I might bring the issue up regardless of whether it has been mentioned before.
I don't want to diminish any other forum, just to plant a seed and hope that something helpful can grow from it.
Thanks for your thoughts everyone.
sodajoe said:
I think the best way to encourage such discussion is to start them or to join in on the ones already going not to be negative about the other conversations you're not keen on.
Some of the things which have impressed me most recently have been the "Make a..." competitions, or the Atlatl meet-up which appears to have started from discussions here... or maybe Leonb's perpetual "teach me" thread which has seen great involvement from some of the folk on the forum and then of course there's the recent South Wales meet-up with just a handful of us which resulted in a good bit of teaching for me and the youngster who was with me. we did post about it, honest, but it's difficult to capture everything we did in a thread.
sodajoe said:
:yo: , bring on the next ventile/wool/cotton/carbon/gortex-mix camo pants review as I need my Monday morning fix!
Cheers
sodajoe said:
What I like about this forum is that you can click on the things that interest you and ignore the things that don't. People who want more threads on plants, skills and techniques etc. are only limited by their own lack of imagination and knowledge. You are as free as anyone to start threads on these topics. But typically threads like this one are not usually started as a way to generate more interest in those topics but to censor or criticize those who want to talk about other topics. Since topics on kit are perfectly valid here, I'd say those who want to claim some kind of moral purist highground and censor those who aren't nearly as pure, should move on to greener pastures, wherever they might be.
sodajoe said:
Even if the intention is not there to stir up conflict, that is invariably the result of such threads. I will reiterate, the best way to get more threads on the topics you are interested in is to start them. And stop worrying about what other people are discussing. You don't have to read those threads. I can tell you I personally don't post here nearly as much as I used to simply because of the incessant whining on this very issue, especially by people who themselves have contributed so little.
If i can read it ok by. Me i cant spell worth a dam even sometimes cant find in my spell checker. also if you cant spell how do you find it in the spell book [ cant spell that word dictionary] i also don't no how or when to use these. ? & ; : ' " ! etc. I am 64 and i got these far not knowing all this writing and spelling
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