Carrying knives to the woods - knife license...inevitably rambling onto American gun stuff

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Broch

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Jan 18, 2009
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Indeed.
There was serious talk a short time ago about introducing physiological testing to the licensing system, including some pretty invasive mental health questions.

And, to be honest, I'm not against that. I know several people with firearms certificates that I do not believe should have them. I know they are prone to temper and even physical violence - they should never have been issued with one in the first place IMO. Another one, who walked through my land with a shotgun with breech closed and pointed it at me saying 'it's OK it's not loaded' when I challenged him, the local gamekeeper said 'Oh, he's OK, he's not all there at times'!
 
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TeeDee

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And, to be honest, I'm not against that. I know several people with firearms certificates that I do not believe should have them. I know they are prone to temper and even physical violence - they should never have been issued with one in the first place IMO. Another one, who walked through my land with a shotgun with breech closed and pointed it at me saying 'it's OK it's not loaded' when I challenged him, the local gamekeeper said 'Oh, he's OK, he's not all there at times'!


I assume Wildgoose meant Psychological rather than Physiological testing?

Open ended question how would one police this as a policy ? A single test when applying for a FAC? Or ongoing tests every few years?



I
 

henchy3rd

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Apr 16, 2012
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We're not allowed to talk about that ;)

Seriously though, I don't think comparing us to any other country has any merit at all; we are our history, we make legal decisions based on that.

At the sake of being contrary, I am happy with the way the knife law is in the UK. I am confident that when I carry a knife I have justification and that I am carrying legally. I don't try to tilt at windmills or push the limits because I don't need to in the activities that I'm involved with.

So, out and about every day I carry a legal folder; camping and backpacking I'll have a fixed blade but in my bag, not on my belt; in the woods (mine or with permission), I'll have a larger fixed blade and only have it on a belt when I'm actually working (you won't see me walking around the Moot with a knife on my belt, why would I need to?); Canoeing I carry a one-handed opening locking folding knife that stays with my buoyancy aid.

Whereas a young cop that doesn't actually know the law may question me, I am confident that I am not committing any crime.
I always carry a fixed blade knife on my belt when I’m out on my boat..Ive used it three times.
Once when someone’s hand got trapped between a post & rope whilst tying a boat up.the other when I saved a drowning man near Trentham.
The third was my own stupid fault when I nearly capsized my boat with my kids on board?
 

hudd4444

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Mar 13, 2019
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I can see why it might not make sense now. It seemed so simple, but oh no...

So going from this seems like a good idea, now I'm hoping something like this isn't introduced. I wonder what I'll think tomorrow.
 

C_Claycomb

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No worries Hudd4444 :bigok: :beerchug:

I remember years ago one of the knife makers we had here saying that they had had a chat with their local police to explain what they did for a living. The aim being so that they had a better feel for him as a person, so if there was ever a problem he wouldn't just be some random bloke with knives. I don't know what practical purpose it would have served him. These days with so few police to go around, I can imagine that even if you went to that sort of trouble, the officer you bump into wouldn't be the one you had worked on building a relationship with.

Chris
 

Broch

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I assume Wildgoose meant Psychological rather than Physiological testing?

Open ended question how would one police this as a policy ? A single test when applying for a FAC? Or ongoing tests every few years?

That's what I assumed :)

It's a difficult one really; a single life event can change the mental state of any of us - we are all closer to the edge than we would like to think I suspect.
 

Broch

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I can see why it might not make sense now. It seemed so simple, but oh no...

So going from this seems like a good idea, now I'm hoping something like this isn't introduced. I wonder what I'll think tomorrow.

It is so refreshing for someone to listen to reasoned argument and be prepared to change their mind :)
 
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C_Claycomb

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Psychological...oh boy...just so long as they NEVER learn about the Naughty Corner!

Given the spate of recent threads, I think a far more challenging question would be along the lines of:
'So, you say you will use this knife for "bushcraft". Could you please describe what that is and where you will be doing it?'
:eek3::runaway:
 

TeeDee

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That's what I assumed :)

It's a difficult one really; a single life event can change the mental state of any of us - we are all closer to the edge than we would like to think I suspect.

Very True Broc.

I think we all have times in our lives that can be/feel unsettling at best , terrible at worst - Mental State is NOT a fixed point on a spectrum.

At what point of feeling 'down' should a Firearms holder contact that Police and say - I'm not feeling terrible, but equally I'm not feeling great . I'm sure the police won't be taking chances and will act accordingly in the interests of not having an incident at all costs.

I know People that haven't been to the GP to help with mild depression because they fear how the GP and then by proxy ( in informed ) the Police will react if they go seeking help for depression / anxiety. - which clearly doesn't help anyone.


That being said, with reference to anger issues I would hope Character witness statements should aid such things in verifying what a persons default character type is. But again- we can all have bad days.

I would think if one had serious concerns about a Firearms owner having a repeat and predictable Anger or Violent nature then a call and chat to the local Police HQ would be justified. But its should be more that just one person assisting the Police with forming a broad scope view of a persons mental state as opposed to one person offering their interpretation of a snap shot moment. IMO
 

Broch

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I took all my knives and axe and colt 45 in to work today to show them my leather work for sheaths .i was a bit worried if got stopped but i did have reason to take them out my home

Ah, but did you?
"Excuse me sir, why are you carrying these blades and a gun in your car?"
"I'm going to show the leatherwork to my workmates"
"so, I ask again sir, why are you carrying these blades and a gun?"
 

Broch

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Jan 18, 2009
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Very True Broc.

I think we all have times in our lives that can be/feel unsettling at best , terrible at worst - Mental State is NOT a fixed point on a spectrum.

At what point of feeling 'down' should a Firearms holder contact that Police and say - I'm not feeling terrible, but equally I'm not feeling great . I'm sure the police won't be taking chances and will act accordingly in the interests of not having an incident at all costs.

I know People that haven't been to the GP to help with mild depression because they fear how the GP and then by proxy ( in informed ) the Police will react if they go seeking help for depression / anxiety. - which clearly doesn't help anyone.


That being said, with reference to anger issues I would hope Character witness statements should aid such things in verifying what a persons default character type is. But again- we can all have bad days.

I would think if one had serious concerns about a Firearms owner having a repeat and predictable Anger or Violent nature then a call and chat to the local Police HQ would be justified. But its should be more that just one person assisting the Police with forming a broad scope view of a persons mental state as opposed to one person offering their interpretation of a snap shot moment. IMO

Well, whether we like it or not, our doctors now have to agree to us having a firearms certificate - I don't think they'll be ticking a box lightly. The problem is I can see no way of appealing.
 

C_Claycomb

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I took all my knives and axe and colt 45 in to work today to show them my leather work for sheaths .i was a bit worried if got stopped but i did have reason to take them out my home
If you were taking the knives and sheaths to show someone in a private home, that would be a good reason.
Taking the knives along for the ride when you are really just showing the sheaths, that sounds paper thin as reasons go. That you took them to work, well, guess it depends on the work. A small place and the owner wants to see, you could have adequate cover. Big place, corporate kind of thing, not so much. If I had done that in the engineering firm I worked for, I can easily imagine unpleasant consequences if the wrong person caught sight of them, even if I brought them to show the MD. Things like that can quickly attain a life of their own.
 

TeeDee

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Well, whether we like it or not, our doctors now have to agree to us having a firearms certificate - I don't think they'll be ticking a box lightly. The problem is I can see no way of appealing.

Correct .

So if a person is in good health and visited their Doctor only a few times every few years unrelated to non psychological issues they would have no insight into our mental state. Then putting an onerous judgement call upon an over worked individual who may hold their own subjective opinions ( pro/con ) on Firearm ownership in the first place.

I think reputable character witness statements at the start of an application and then again every time the licence comes up may be just a useful metric for the Police to use.

I'm not even sure how one could effectively implement psychological testing as psychometric tests can be a tricky one to interpret for such things.

Its a complicated issue for sure.
 

richos36

Tenderfoot
If you were taking the knives and sheaths to show someone in a private home, that would be a good reason.
Taking the knives along for the ride when you are really just showing the sheaths, that sounds paper thin as reasons go. That you took them to work, well, guess it depends on the work. A small place and the owner wants to see, you could have adequate cover. Big place, corporate kind of thing, not so much. If I had done that in the engineering firm I worked for, I can easily imagine unpleasant consequences if the wrong person caught sight of them, even if I brought them to show the MD. Things like that can quickly attain a life of their own.
Im A upholsterer making 3 piece suits and mainly re-covers small family run working with different types of fabric and leather but none of my work mates have seen natural veg tan hide told them what i was doing as a lock down interest and they wanted to see so i did a show and tell like we used to at school lol
 

Wildgoose

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May 15, 2012
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I'm not even sure how one could effectively implement psychological testing as psychometric tests can be a tricky one to interpret for such things.

Its a complicated issue for sure.
The conclusion to the paper I read was that it would be expensive and not particularly effective.
 
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