Bushcraft and Scouts Milestone

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Apr 8, 2009
1,165
144
Ashdown Forest
Yep- I’d agree with Sussex Rob there- If Scout leaders are sensible, then H&S really doesn't dampen what you can do within the movement. In way of an example- a recent 8 day summer camp in Snowdonia- instructed and run entirely within our leadership team- had our Explorers coasteering, rafting in the sea, Canyoning, climbing Snowdon via the Grib Goch ridge, rock climbing, abseiling 60 feet into a gorge and exiting via a flooded mine shaft, air rifle shooting, archery, and a two day hammocking expedition. It's all about leaders having the necessary experience (and backed up where needed by Scout Assn. adventurous activity permits), confidence, and risk assessing.
We were making bucksaws the other night with our unit Moras. One moderately deep cut to the finger of an Explorer resulting in a call to his parent and a quick trip to A&E for a steristrip. This is despite a session on knife safety in small groups and close supervision. It will happen every now and then, and the only consequences were a large form for the Leader in charge to fill out for the Scout Insurance Services, and a slightly irritated parent (which in my experience of Scouting was the first time a parent acted in this way!).
 

SussexRob

Full Member
Dec 26, 2010
270
0
East Grinstead
Parents, the enigma of scouting! You simply never know how they'll react.

Sounds like a cracking camp though!! How easy was it to get your lot into hammocking? I'm looking forward to starting my lot off.
 

roger-uk

Settler
Nov 21, 2009
603
0
long Eaton
My Cubs have access to Mora knives on camp under supervision. Personal knives are not allowed and knife work is supervised 100% of the time. They love it and know like archery/Air Rifle which I also instruct in there are no warnings. Misbehave and your out of the session. You "may" then be allowed to try it again at some other time.

They use them for whittling. making kindling for fire lighting and making tents pegs. Parents are briefed as to what we are making befoehand just in case its too obvious for them to reckognse.

Scouts needs more bushcraft type peoplr to pass on their skills. It does not hav eto be full time. You could offer to do a session for them on various bushcraft skills. I would be surprised if you were turned down.

Please pitc it at their level - some cubs are so indoctrinated about playing with matches that they will not even strick one. This was sorted by the parent coming on the next fire lighting session and doing it with him.
 

Winston

Member
Jun 5, 2010
18
0
Preston
I remember learning to carve tent pegs with my scout leader years back...

I have no worries with scouts taking knives to camp, but i perefer to keep hold of them when there not being used... saves issues later on... not sure about cubs tho, although as Roger points out if you set the rules then it should be fine, Thats how i teach air rifle shooting, step out of line and your on your way out of rthe range.. maybe ill see how it goes at Group camp this weekend...

I know my dad still does knife and axe with his scouts, has dfone for years.. its what campings about, using the skils like these...
 

roger-uk

Settler
Nov 21, 2009
603
0
long Eaton
Cubs tend to be frigtened about knives at first and ignorant. A lot of people are very surprised my Cubs use knives but its supervised and as safe as I can make it. They don't move away from where they are sitting or hand over a knive unless its in the plastic mora sheath. Thnakfully they are just about Scout age before they are getting too cocky about it and SL can then handle that as he does. :eek:)

Parents when they join the pack know the program and ethos and take it on board.

Don't get me wrong we don't do knives all the time but when needed we do.
 
Apr 8, 2009
1,165
144
Ashdown Forest
Sounds like a cracking camp though!! How easy was it to get your lot into hammocking? I'm looking forward to starting my lot off.

Very easy actually- they just loved how different it was, and the adventure of it. We've had one enjoy it so much he went home, borrowed his mums sewing machine and made himself a hammock from scratch. Last summer camp it was tricky to persuade a few of them to actually sleep in their patrol tents as there were trees about!
 

WolfCub

Forager
Aug 6, 2008
228
0
Bucks
I've been doing a fair bit of 'traditional scoutcraft' skills with the Cub Pack. That's now filtering through to the Scout Troop. S.L. has always been keen on getting the kids out, with the Group having kayaks, canoes, climbing gear, archery, air rfles, load of camping gear. Group funds bulk of training expenses for Leaders if it's an activity the Group are short of 'tickets' for or it's something they might be able to buy kit for and provide (most recently archery, snorkling and mountain biking)

This past term he offered "Survival badge". Getting 'instructors' in from the local RAF training base, Wildlife Trusts for foraging, me for game prep and cooking.

This weekends camp we had a lot on offer like this. Next hurdle in confidence for the Group(parents/some leaders) is knife use. Done some tent peg making with a small group of selected older Cubs, with individual 'verbal approval' from thier Parents, who I knew would say yes (primed in private, then 'asked' in public;)) Will gradualy build on this till it appears 'normal' and 'familiar' and just another thing we often do. Most resistance is knee jerk and easier to set asside if I can point out it already being done safely.

I've also sited posts and threads on here and elsewhere as example and 'supporting evidence' in the past ..... so please keep posting:)

Duncan
 

GordonM

Settler
Nov 11, 2008
866
51
Virginia, USA
Mark Wood - Very well done with the knife skills!

The Lord Poncho - Outstanding High Adventure program you have with your Explorers. The older ones thrive on the high adventure activities and it will keep them active in the unit. In this day of peer pressure, a young Scout may not be willing to share their Scouting experiences with school mates. But I guarantee, from experience as a young Scout and a Scout Leader, that if the young Scout can go to school and talk about the wonderful and challenging high adventure outings they are experiencing in Scouts, they become popular in the eyes of their peers and usually will have a peer or two that wants to join in on future adventures!

YIS,

Gordy
 

Vickyjs

Tenderfoot
Sep 18, 2008
60
4
Devon
I do a bit of carving with my Guides (girls!), we just use swiss army knives mostly, originally we got written consent form parents, the next year we notified parents what we were doing and asked them to tell us if they had issues (no one did) and now we just put it on the programme as a normal part of what we do! (if they want to do less adventurous stuff they can join one of the other Guide Units!)

No one has ever expressed anything but suport! (either that or they are just not interested what we do with them as Guides.)

We've had a few cuts but nothing major. Some girls are totally terrified of opening and using a pocket knife to start with so learning to use one is a real confidence building exercise - we also have the same issues with matches and fire lighting when they first join, they soon get over it though.

We do a little training programme every year around safety, they learn to sharpen pencils to start with (I buy packs of 10 and saw them in half) and then we do things like little trolls with pointy hats, wooden twig knives / butter knives, whistles etc.

I've done a pocket knife 'card' a bit like the US scouts have which the girls have to sign (there's a copy of it on our website, weekly page, 2ndkingsbridgeguides.org.uk) We also discuss the law regarding knives & we have some quiz type questions the have to complete also.

I have a set of swiss army knives bought second hand on ebay before the ban and we lend those out - they are all numbered and the girls have to sign for them.

Some parents go on to buy their daughter a knife but we always check them before use & recommend what to buy (tinker / hiker / recruit - ones without a corkscrew & with a large and small blade). We're thinking of getting some more sheath knives for bigger stuff now everyone has got used to the idea of carving. I carve spoons and I'd quite like to get a set of spoon knives as well. Unlike scout groups each guide unit has it's own money so we can buy what we want without consulting a committee.

The' Little Book of Whittling' is good to get people enthusiastic and it's a really cheap book. Amazon stock it. You only need a pocket knife to do most of the projects and little bits of wood so anyone can have a go - no axes needed!

Vicky
 

Miyagi

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Aug 6, 2008
2,298
5
South Queensferry
Thanks for all the advice folks, I've contacted my local group, 21st South Queensferry, through their website and am awaiting their reply.

Scouts on a Friday and Explorer Scouts on a Sunday, don't know which one is for me but luckily neither clash with my Jujutsu club nights.

Do you still say dub dub dub and should I have kept the woggle I made as a trainee Chef? :D

I get tied in knots trying to do knots as well...

Cheers,

Liam
 

georann

Full Member
Feb 13, 2010
1,255
1
Warwickshire
www.slice-of-fire.co.uk
The whole dib dib dib thing is well gone! You will eventually have to wear an necker and woggle but theyre readily available and if not tie a turks head. You wont need one immediately though, and not at all if you just stay as an adult helper rather than a leader. Explorer groups often dont wear uniform regularly as well!
All I can say is goodluck!

Yours in scouting
Dan
 

mark wood

Forager
Jul 25, 2004
205
0
52
Newcastle
Wow - great comments :D

I just asked our GSL about the funds and away I went. As mentioned, the Moras are very cheap - £3 each or so from Clas Olsen. The Leeds shop was particularly helpful - a member of staff actually brought the knives up to me as she had some business in Newcastle (recruiting for the new store). We're a fairly traditional group and have a great equipment store full of canvas tents, tilley lamps, trangias, axes etc but no knives (until now). My next challenge is the nights away permit and a potential survival camp in September.

Mark
 

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