Responsible behaviour as the world changes.

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"If you see unattended cooking equipment, get to a safe place and call 999 immediately"

Good grief.

Can't help but feel if they want people to take these things seriously, they need to stop with the hyperbole.

Although they have form at the New Forest for overstepping their authority when they tried to tell people that mushroom foraging was banned, which had no legal basis whatsoever.
 
Having spent many an hour in the forest dealing with the stupidity of people who visit but don’t have an ounce of common sense or care about the environment that are visiting from miles away, or the problems that their activities will have. If I remember correctly the mushroom foraging was due to organised commercial exploitation of the resource for personal gain. I understand the need of people to access open space. However when many come from urban areas with no concept of how to respect the spaces due to being removed from understanding the relationships between the land and the current custodians. Therefore simplistic rules have been and will be brought in so that there is no misunderstanding. And yes I have been to the forest and seen people with stoves, did I report, hell no.

Louis
 
Interesting article here on this issue.

That pretty much what the protection order for the New Forest says. Can’t use a camping stove to make a brew.
 
Having spent many an hour in the forest dealing with the stupidity of people who visit but don’t have an ounce of common sense or care about the environment that are visiting from miles away, or the problems that their activities will have. If I remember correctly the mushroom foraging was due to organised commercial exploitation of the resource for personal gain. I understand the need of people to access open space. However when many come from urban areas with no concept of how to respect the spaces due to being removed from understanding the relationships between the land and the current custodians. Therefore simplistic rules have been and will be brought in so that there is no misunderstanding. And yes I have been to the forest and seen people with stoves, did I report, hell no.

Louis
IMG_3703.jpeg
Advisory. Except for commercial picking.
 
It's always a pleasant experience discussing such topics as use of fire in the outdoors in the forum. Indeed other topics like camping in the outdoors (wild camping with leave no trace principles and the other less acceptable forms of camping without the LNT principles, IMHO of course) too.

If you go onto Reddits for the outdoors in the UK you get some very rabid views expressed. By this I mean people get very defensive, aggressive and offensive if their strongly held views are questioned.

For example one redditor mistakenly read the room wrong and posted a picture of people camping with big family car camping tents on the side of Derwentwater below Catbells in clear and open land. They had remains of open fires and BBQs plus signs of drinking waste around the place. The photo was taken by a local IIRC. He got rounded on by a pack of posters after best part of a day of sensible comments along the lines of it's not really right or wildcamping and they shouldn't have had fires due to dry weather and high fire risk. Also, comments that if they pack up and leave no trace then it would be less bad. Also comments about the Scottish situation on this

Then some people got to hear about the post and the tone of discussion changed to the negative. A lot of people arguing that they should be allowed to do what they want. Comments along the lines of the OP being a weirdo for creeping around taking photos early in the day. Apparently the photo was about 11am and nobody was up!

So I would say thank you everyone for creating and maintaining this friendly place for people who like to go into the in outdoors.
 
As to my POV, I prefer that people didn't have open fires. I do not see a need for it but see it as a want. There is something calming and primal about open fires and I bet most are less about cooking and more about the so called bushcraft TV side of it.

If you were about cooking only then you'd probably be better off with one of the many wood fire based stove and cooking systems like Kelly kettles or wood gasifier stoves. In the right places and situations (wrt fire risk status in the area) they are a potentially good option IMHO. I know I have always wanted one but haven't got one because they do not suit my needs.

So whilst I don't agree with open fires in the outdoors in the UK I accept and realise that my POV is but one of many. The only true agreement we can have is that we must all manage the risk of causing a wildfire.

However we should discuss such things and raise awareness through reasoned discussion. I hope people on here take this attitude that is on display here and spread out widely into less balanced online places. The reasonable should work harder to temper the less reasonable IMHO. Call it bushcraft outreach if you like!
 
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It's always a pleasant experience discussing such topics as use of fire in the outdoors in the forum. Indeed other topics like camping in the outdoors (wild camping with leave no trace principles and the other less acceptable forms of camping without the LNT principles, IMHO of course) too.

If you go onto Reddits for the outdoors in the UK you get some very rabid views expressed. By this I mean people get very defensive, aggressive and offensive if their strongly held views are questioned.

For example one redditor mistakenly read the room wrong and posted a picture of people camping with big family car camping tents on the side of Derwentwater below Catbells in clear and open land. They had remains of open fires and BBQs plus signs of drinking waste around the place. The photo was taken by a local IIRC. He got rounded on by a pack of posters after best part of a day of sensible comments along the lines of it's not really right or wildcamping and they shouldn't have had fires due to dry weather and high fire risk. Also, comments that if they pack up and leave no trace then it would be less bad. Also comments about the Scottish situation on this

Then some people got to hear about the post and the tone of discussion changed to the negative. A lot of people arguing that they should be allowed to do what they want. Comments along the lines of the OP being a weirdo for creeping around taking photos early in the day. Apparently the photo was about 11am and nobody was up!

So I would say thank you everyone for creating and maintaining this friendly place for people who like to go into the in outdoors.

I won’t go near the Reddit outdoor forums, they’re utterly rabid. No nuance exists on lots of Reddit and when you look at the main demographics that use it you can understand why. I too am grateful for this forum as a place to discuss different opinions and perspectives on these things.
 
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This is my campfire, to keep the fire off the ground. After this photo was taken I bought a fireproof mat (can stand up to 500 degrees celsius) to place under it so no fallig embers fall directly on the ground.


The fireproof mat is actually intended for placing under stoves in hot stove tents so I had to cut it smaller
so it will fit inside my toves pack pouch.

Packs down flat.
 
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Not really, I guess.
I speak of course from the facts in my country, not UK.
We can only make a fire with permission from landowner, everymans right does not include the right to light fires.
No need for permission if it is a built fireplace at an official resting/camping place, unless a forest fire warning is issued.

Official resting/camping place (this is just one model). Chopping down trees is not allowed. If there are no firewood ready or you did not bring your own then you can´t make a fire.
lammasjarven-laavu-min-1024x768.jpg


Love the idea of these being in the UK.

Nice and simple. Get some kit together , get a fire on -have a chilled evening out.
 
Isn't it amazing the way things change ?

I've been camping for over sixty years. I am becoming an old lady :shameful:....but I've enjoyed almost all of those years, so no, I'm not going to apologise for being 'old'.

We used to camp on the foreshore around the Clyde lochs. My parents took me and my big brother camping the year I was born. The GareLoch, Loch Goil, Loch Long, etc., it's a beautful bit of the world. Harsh and bitter cold at times though. Fire on a foreshore was no hassle....Uncle Jimmy used to brew up with the tilley stove inside a galvie bucket though. Didn't matter whether we were onshore or out on the boat, he managed a brew, and never spilt a drop. Nearest he ever came was going through the Rhu narrows and an American sub rose up alongside us. My Dad hit it with an oar, shouting about oars before sail, sail before steam.... :rolleyes2: he could be easily annoyed by stupidity could my Dad. He'd lived wild on Rannoch Moor for three years in the 1930's as he recovered from rheumatic fever (no NHS back then, no invalidity benefit, no broo, folks just made do) and he could make a fire anywhere. He'd been a fireman during the war; a Section Officer, and he'd worked through the blitz at Clydebank and then was part of the crews sent to London when it was blitzed. Fire was life, fire was to be treated with care, he taught us to get out if there was a house fire, don't hide from it. Fire was everywhere, he even managed to live on Rannoch moor using a primus and a wee fire. He taught us how to raise the fire off the wet ground.

Fire was a constant. We had a fire in the house every day in life...no hot water otherwise, let alone heat.
My Grandpa's workshop was heated with a wee pot belly stove, and there was another firepit outside in Granny's garden. I mind watching with all the glee of childish horror as Grandpa roasted a split sheep's head on that one. Singed (singe/burnt off the hair and outer skin) Sheeps' Heid was considered a choice dish when he was growing up, and Granny wouldn't let him cook it in her kitchen, and the big pot that boiled up the pluck to make haggis was done outside too....the thrapple (the windpipe) hung over the edge of the pot as the lungs boiled. That let all the mucous stuff inside boil out.
The smell, like the memories, lingers.....

Fire was constant. It was a daily use thing, every house in the land had fire.
Right enough we had a dreadful pollution problem too.

The world changes though. Few children now grow up learning to use a rather blunt hatchet to split kindling for the fire. Few children use that same hatchet's poll to belt apart the huge lumps of coal either, and learn the control necessary not to send the stuff flying everywhere.
Few children sit and stare into the fire coals and see the gas escaping from them catch and become flame...or watch the resin bubbles froth and spit and then burn in strange colours.
To us it was normal.

We used to have two enormous neighbourhood fire days every year. Old furniture, rotting fences, whatever would burn, went onto the bonfires for Victoria Day in May (that usually burnt in daylight) and Guy Fawkes night in November, that burned in the dark. Fire was our recycling, and the rag and bone yelled about any old iron.
Every child grew up knowing fire, knowing the big fires as well as the household ones.


Our world has changed, and I think it will change a lot more than we might be comfortable about.
Woodburner stoves are next to be proscribed I reckon.

BBC
"Burning any fuel is bad for the environment.
It is a myth that wood burning is cheaper than gas central heating and heat pumps.
Breathing wood smoke can increase your risk of heart disease, of a range of cancers, of things like chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, of asthma and even dementia."

STV

My rambling is just the history that many of us carry about fire. We feel confident in our ability to be careful with it, able with it, but in a changing world, are we ?

One wee spark and up goes a gorse bush in Summer, and from there.....an entire mountainside's alight.

My own favoured camping stove is a catalytic one (no need for a galvie bucket, no open flame, not cheap, and it's pretty soul less. No 'fire', kind of thing.

Different times, different needs, different laws.
We have become a different people.

M
 
Woodburner stoves are next to be proscribed I reckon.

With any luck not. While for many they are an essential part of life and wellbeing, thankfully they are also a must have item in the country residence of anybody well off, i.e. those who make the rules, which ought to offer them protection outside of densely populated areas.

Similarly I can cruise around the ULEZ in London in classic cars thanks in part to the All-Party Parliamentary Vintage Vehicles Group...
 
With any luck not. While for many they are an essential part of life and wellbeing, thankfully they are also a must have item in the country residence of anybody well off, i.e. those who make the rules, which ought to offer them protection outside of densely populated areas.

Similarly I can cruise around the ULEZ in London in classic cars thanks in part to the All-Party Parliamentary Vintage Vehicles Group...

Folks on crofts often were self reliant on fuel. Peat was everywhere, now it's so contentious. The reality is that where it grows well, it piles on inches a year, not mm. It can be commercially cropped but it's being used as the ultimate 'everybody knows' cure to global warming :rolleyes2:
 

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