Battoning idea

[Jared]

Bahco make a good wrecking knife in the same vein

View attachment 18506

Yeah, was just about to suggest a side strike chisel.. Stanley make one too for around a tenner, or a Hultafors chisel knife for 6 quid (though maybe a bit short for battoning)


A step up from that, and down from a froe.. would be a Morris stick chopper http://toolnut.co.uk/products/billhooks/Morris_Stick_Chopper.html (£13 seems a bargain), or a Morris Riving Iron http://woodsmithexperience.co.uk/shop/product/morris-riving-iron

 

[Nice65]

I hike light with a wood stove and don't want to carry my Mora or other knives for bylaw,travel and weight reasons.

The law, specifically Section 139 of the Criminal Justice Act, cover the legalities of knife carry.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/33/section/139

There aren't any bylaws I'm aware of that that affect this legislation.

If you have good reason to be carrying a knife, and you do, then take what is appropriate and don't worry about it. A locking folder such as a Opinel falls into the same legal category as a fixed blade. Folders are crap for batoning, you'll ruin the pivot, so take something that feeds your stove.

How about a splitting wedge - bang it with a handy log maybe. Perhaps a SAK saw to make a notch to start it?

Not a bad call, but a bit weighty, and an unusual tool for the job In fact if it was sharpened nicely it could almost be called...a chisel. Mounted to a stick, an axe.

There's no getting round the fact that sharpened steel is covered by Section 139.

I think this has been said before, but I'm just wondering if a Putty hacking out knife wouldn't be better? It's designed to be hit on the back edge, it's not pointed as you can see in the pic below, and can be as blunt as you like. I doubt a copper's going to kick off too much as you risk a nasty bruise rather than a cut having one of those in your possession.

Why does having a point make any difference? Or being blunt? Or inflicting a bruise rather than a cut? It's a knife. I read the OP, he doesn't really want a knife. You think local plod will see a putty knife or chisel sharpened down one side as appropriate for the needs of this bloke?? I don't. It's daft and irresponsible to suggest someone carry a chisel instead of a knife, in view of the original post, and in legal terms.

 

[Imagedude]

For battoning work I find that a small froe punches above its weight.

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99399&highlight=froe

 

[Biker]

Why does having a point make any difference? Or being blunt? Or inflicting a bruise rather than a cut? It's a knife. I read the OP, he doesn't really want a knife. You think local plod will see a putty knife or chisel sharpened down one side as appropriate for the needs of this bloke?? I don't. It's daft and irresponsible to suggest someone carry a chisel instead of a knife, in view of the original post, and in legal terms.

I realise the OP doesn't want to carry a knife, per se. I was simply making the age old point that has been done to death here many times on BCUK that the general public still perceive knives as weapons instead of tools, but the alternative use of a putty hacking knife which resembles a regular knife the way a ladle resembles a teaspoon - close, but no cigar, could be an option. Therefore carrying such a less threatening tool, might curry some favour if the plod do tug the guy and ask why he's carrying such a thing and for what purpose. It's also cheap enough that having it confiscated wouldn't hurt too much. If the copper did want to press the point hopefully wiser minds than his will see the non threatening nature of that tool.

Given the choice I wouldn't carry a chisel in my pocket any more than I'd carry a 6 inch bladed knife if I didn't have a use for it. At least with a putty hacking knife it looks comical unlike a stiletto. If we really want to get pedantic a heavy stick picked up in the woods could be an offensive weapon in the eyes of anyone who is uninformed, the fact it's a walking staff wouldn't occur to them. Public perception has to be catered for including cops looking for an excuse to tug you. Sad, 21st century, fact.

Comments like mine have been said dozens of times before, and I feel I'm preaching to the choir here. We know what we see and what the public wants to see.

Off my soap box now.

 

[Nice65]

The answer is, and has been since the OP, take the right tool for the job. In this case it's a knife, and you have good reason to be carrying it because you need to cut wood for your stove.

 

[mrcharly]

A bit OT, but what is the steel like in those putty knives? Anyone tried modding one?

 

[British Red]

Personally I have never thought a normal knife (one designed for slicing and cutting) - particularly a folding knife - is the right tool for splitting wood. Axes, froes, even wrecking knives are designed to split - and the latter two are designed to be struck for exactly that purpose. Given the OP is concerned about legality, the presence of a tool designed for splitting wood - and lacking a point, when accompanied by a wood burning stove, would provide a reason for carrying that tool - and indeed a safer way of splitting the fuel with less chance of tool damage.

 

[Nice65]

Personally I have never thought a normal knife (one designed for slicing and cutting) - particularly a folding knife - is the right tool for splitting wood. Axes, froes, even wrecking knives are designed to split - and the latter two are designed to be struck for exactly that purpose. Given the OP is concerned about legality, the presence of a tool designed for splitting wood - and lacking a point, when accompanied by a wood burning stove, would provide a reason for carrying that tool - and indeed a safer way of splitting the fuel with less chance of tool damage.

I agree, though a knife will cope with small wood for a stove.

The OP cites weight as a problem though, so axes might be out.

I think he should get a gas stove

 

[Wayne]

I have newer had an issue travelling with a fixed blade. I travel all over teaching bushcraft and related skills so am often well laden with sharps.

Be polite and look smart not like a reject from Deliverance and most police will be more interested in your activities than the tools. I carry an example spoon to show them what a make as well. Anything to get a conversation going. The police want to prevent crime and catch villains not prevent decent hard working folk enjoying the great outdoors.

 

[Macaroon]

I've used a putty hacking knife for splitting small stuff for my TLUD stove for years, handled it with a bit of beech and ground the profile I need, never touched it since and it does the job perfectly; avoids potential damage to both knife and user, weighs nothing and is precisely..............the right tool for the job!

 

[Nice65]

I have newer had an issue travelling with a fixed blade. I travel all over teaching bushcraft and related skills so am often well laden with sharps.

Be polite and look smart not like a reject from Deliverance and most police will be more interested in your activities than the tools. I carry an example spoon to show them what a make as well. Anything to get a conversation going. The police want to prevent crime and catch villains not prevent decent hard working folk enjoying the great outdoors.

Good post mate

 

[FGYT]

If it has a blade or a sharp point it needs a good reason (in fact a butter knife that has no real sharp edge or any point is deemed to be covered by this but a screwdriver isn't)

no mention of knife in S139 Except the exemption for reason as a pocket knife

anything you carry that cuts still needs the same good reason as a knife so a putty knife or a Fro etc will to they are NOT a folding non locking pocket knife with a sub 3" cutting edge.

 

[Biker]

If it has a blade or a sharp point it needs a good reason (in fact a butter knife that has no real sharp edge or any point is deemed to be covered by this but a screwdriver isn't)

no mention of knife in S139 Except the exemption for reason as a pocket knife

anything you carry that cuts still needs the same good reason as a knife so a putty knife or a Fro etc will to they are NOT a folding non locking pocket knife with a sub 3" cutting edge.

Is there a definition of what the law states as a "Cutting edge" It's just that I've seen sharper edges on brick cutting bolsters than on some putty hacking knives. All it needs to do is start the split and then cleave the wood, not make a shaving stick out of the branch.

OK, I'll get my coat. I'm just quibbling the issue is all.

 

[FGYT]

Is there a definition of what the law states as a "Cutting edge" It's just that I've seen sharper edges on brick cutting bolsters than on some putty hacking knives. All it needs to do is start the split and then cleave the wood, not make a shaving stick out of the branch.

OK, I'll get my coat. I'm just quibbling the issue is all.

no there isn't nore for what sharply pointed is exactly its the good bit about the law (and the bad bit) it leaves room for interpretation by the judge etc

But as i said a Butter knife has been deemed to fall under the needs good reason bit and most have no grind on them whatsoever and are fully rounded

if your camping and need to process wood then you have reason to carry lots of sharp options and the cops wouldn't bat an eyelid seems daft to over PC the situation.



under S139 if your an bottom you need good reason to carry a sharpened pencil (sharply pointed artical) ie you are specifically gong to write something not i may need to

BUT you can freely carry a non sharpened pencil and a 3" folding pocket knife to sharpen it if needed

 

[Everything Mac]

Cheers for the video Si. I'll watch it when I get ashore.


I must say that if it is small enough to be split with a knife, then it is small enough to be burnt whole.

The correct tool for the job otherwise is an axe or indeed a froe. This idea that people seem to have that a knife is the correct tool for splitting applications is wrong in my opinion.

If one insists on battoning, then get something designed to be hit like a hacking knife. Though I must refer back to my first point, if it is this small then you should really burn it whole.

If it is kindling that is the issue, perhaps a sharp SAK should be carried to making feather sticks. No issues with plod there.

Andy

 

[bb07]

The correct tool for the job otherwise is an axe or indeed a froe. This idea that people seem to have that a knife is the correct tool for splitting applications is wrong in my opinion. Andy

My sentiments as well.

 

[dodss]

thanks for all the ideas I now have Opinel.i do some long distance treks and use a wood burning stove so i am not hunting around in towns for fuel.O n another forum a guy suggeste you don't needa kinfe as you should be using small twigs anyway. Its just handy to a have a useful knife to dig out some dry pieces or split a larger piece to get at the dry stuff inside.I find very rarely is the available wood just the right size.

 

[Skaukraft]

The correct tool for the job otherwise is an axe or indeed a froe. This idea that people seem to have that a knife is the correct tool for splitting applications is wrong in my opinion.
Andy

Couldn't agree more.
Never understood the need to re-invent the wheel over and over again.