I get what you're saying. But I don't look at it as a static 'smash glass in an emergency' type of thing. I just happen to have something that can solve the problem. It happens to be in a little box.
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That or my car. But mostly yes.
Lol, I don't think I'll be catching any fish soon, or having to chop down that mighty oak with the finger saw. But in the last few weeks I've had to fix a radio mic, deal with a hangover, swap out a PC PSU, temporarily fix a solid state drive, open a can of soup, sort out a cut finger. All menial crap. Non of it life or death. But I could deal with bits I had on me in my pocket then and there, and often not related to the big outdoors, which I think a few people get hung up about with these sorts of things. It's simply a small box that I carry bits around in.
Lol, I don't think I'll be catching any fish soon, or having to chop down that mighty oak with the finger saw. But in the last few weeks I've had to fix a radio mic, deal with a hangover, swap out a PC PSU, temporarily fix a solid state drive, open a can of soup, sort out a cut finger. All menial crap. Non of it life or death. But I could deal with bits I had on me in my pocket then and there, and often not related to the big outdoors, which I think a few people get hung up about with these sorts of things. It's simply a small box that I carry bits around in.
As you say none of that stuff is really 'survival' in the traditional sense is it? Or at least not survival within the remit of the original concept of the survival tin. For a good while I carried a 'TAD Gear Survival Capsule' on my key ring with all the usual tut in it and then one day I took a look at it and thought what's the point? I hadn't used any of it in 4.5 years and I'd been all over the world traveling with work and into a fair bit of wilderness in that time.. I've gotten the most use for fixing stuff and handy man style jobs out of my Leatherman (when it's not in being fixed under warranty but that's another story) TBH.
When I'm in the wilderness my survival kit is my bergen full of camping kit. When I'm in an urban setting stuff goes wrong and I can get it sorted in short order even in some pretty far flung bits of China with very little Chinese to my name I've gotten by without any drama's . So for me based on experience and personal choice carting a pocket full of 'EDC' gear around seems a bit pointless and it just gets pinged when your hand luggage gets scanned and you spend 25 minutes explaining to some jobsworth security guard what it is and why it's allowed on the plane. I can understand why you'd do it and respect that decision. The whole E+E SAS tin in the pocket thing is a bit overstated for the UK that's all.
Christ no, I carry mine on anything more than a hike. I've got enough teaching kit in the car at any time not to have to worry about carrying it for driving.
It's not an E&E kit, or it would have E&E kit in it, like a hack saw, lock picks and a garotte. I agree that it's a kit that is useful for all sorts of thing that are not full on survival, but the content is survival oriented and it'll sure as hell become a survival kit if it's used to get out of a genuine survival situation.
It's quite possible that one may survive without one, but the content may make the situation easier. It's also possible to use one outside of a survival situation, you may as well. However, if one single item from the kit makes the difference between life, death or a permanent medical problem, then it's a survival kit.
So, call it what you want; survival kit, toy box or tin of small things. Carry it when you want, be it all the time or in high risk situations. But let's not get over worried about what other people put in them or do with them.
OK, that was a poor phrase. Maybe a hike is more than a walk and that's what I meant. I take it if I'm going somewhere off the beaten track. I take it if I might need something out of it, even if it's the puritabs. I don't repack it for the UK, but I would if I was changing climate.
The BCB one used to have a 1/4 of a hacksaw blade for use as a striker and the 'wire saw' was famously supposed to be able to be used as a garotte ( which makes sense as it was carp at sawing anything useful) and it had a few safety pins so in a romantic moment after watching Mcguyver I suppose you could imagine them as lock picks.... So I guess it was an E+E kit to a degree....
So If you're going on an extended trip say Dartmoor for a few days or your going to Hike on the SWCP say from Ilfracombe to Braunton you'd carry it along?
Yes yes, OK, it's could be used for E&E. I suspect it could also be used for cooking, fixing the car or getting stones out of horses' hooves.
Yeah, I reckon. I feel like I'm being set up
Yeah, I reckon. I feel like I'm being set up
Steve I'm not trying to set you up.. Ok lets say we're going to walk from the RNLI station in Appledore to the Clovelly Lifeboat station via Westward Ho! and Abbotsham... would you....
Only Joking...
Some years ago my mother, who was living on the farm alone, had heard the river come up. (it sounds like a train going through when it is flooding). She walked down to the river and saw two young men who had climbed up into two different trees (the water was out of banks and into the woods, and was about 2 meters deep in the woods and swift). It was going to be dark soon, and it was about 7 degrees C. After much urging they finally got out of the trees and swam to her.
They were freezing cold, their clothes were soaked. Everything they had was in their canoe, which had capsized and went on down the river. (See Hoodoo's post above regarding likelihood of loss of kit in canoes.) Coincidentally, we never did find their canoe. My mother took them to her house and got them dry clothes. The river remained at flood stage for three days before they could get out.
There is no doubt, whatsoever, in my mind that these two young men would have died of hypothermia before the night was out. Even if they would have come ashore they most likely wouldn't have found the house in the dark. You don't live in 7degree C weather when you are soaking wet, and can't build a fire. As important as getting a drink and getting sleep is, you first have to be warm and dry.
About two or three weeks after this incident, I walked the river bank looking for their canoe. As I said above I never found it, but I saw a black trashbag stuck in some bushes and when I picked it up it felt heavy. Upon opening the bag there was some mildewed and ruined pants and shirts and of all things one of them had put his Dutch passport in the bag. It was in a ziplock bag and was perfectly all right. No fire making equipment, no light, no food, no nothing of any use at all, had they been lucky enough to have grabbed it on the way out of the canoe.
All of this illustrates the fact that when all of sudden everything goes terribly wrong, most people are not prepared at all. I'm sure their thinking only involved: Hey, lets go canoe the river for a couple of hours," and never went into any "what if" scenarios.
Post Script: If they would have swam out on the OTHER side of the river, they would have been able to see the occasional car on the nearby road, and flagged one down for a wet ride to town. Although they were grateful for three days free food and lodging, and dry clothes, my mother felt that neither of them ever fully grasped the magnitude of their situation, had she (and a warm house) not been there.
They were freezing cold, their clothes were soaked. Everything they had was in their canoe, which had capsized and went on down the river. (See Hoodoo's post above regarding likelihood of loss of kit in canoes.) Coincidentally, we never did find their canoe. My mother took them to her house and got them dry clothes. The river remained at flood stage for three days before they could get out.
There is no doubt, whatsoever, in my mind that these two young men would have died of hypothermia before the night was out. Even if they would have come ashore they most likely wouldn't have found the house in the dark. You don't live in 7degree C weather when you are soaking wet, and can't build a fire. As important as getting a drink and getting sleep is, you first have to be warm and dry.
About two or three weeks after this incident, I walked the river bank looking for their canoe. As I said above I never found it, but I saw a black trashbag stuck in some bushes and when I picked it up it felt heavy. Upon opening the bag there was some mildewed and ruined pants and shirts and of all things one of them had put his Dutch passport in the bag. It was in a ziplock bag and was perfectly all right. No fire making equipment, no light, no food, no nothing of any use at all, had they been lucky enough to have grabbed it on the way out of the canoe.
All of this illustrates the fact that when all of sudden everything goes terribly wrong, most people are not prepared at all. I'm sure their thinking only involved: Hey, lets go canoe the river for a couple of hours," and never went into any "what if" scenarios.
Post Script: If they would have swam out on the OTHER side of the river, they would have been able to see the occasional car on the nearby road, and flagged one down for a wet ride to town. Although they were grateful for three days free food and lodging, and dry clothes, my mother felt that neither of them ever fully grasped the magnitude of their situation, had she (and a warm house) not been there.
Sadly not Steve I'm off camping tomorrow for a long weekend and I don't think you'll fancy a flight to NZ for the generally poor beer here..
However I'm glad that your survival tin contains Beer Tokens...
However I'm glad that your survival tin contains Beer Tokens...
Can I really throw the cat amongst the pigeons here
Can I just point out that a possibles pouch or just useful items that you have in your pocket just like lighters SAK, mini first aid kits etc.... are all types of survival kits?
Yes they are not the classic tin type, but they are all things that people have thought to keep on them to make their life easier or be able to survive?? if a situation no matter where they are will improve their situation and most of Joe public will not have on them.
We all no matter if you just carry them in case or use them regularly have thought about what will make my life easier. All of you have thought along the lines of Fire, Shelter, Food, Water, Tools which are the basics for any survival kit.
All a tin does it put the items in one place and sharpen your mind as to what to carry and it means its all in one place on your person.
Anyway I thought I might just add my 2p worth on this one.
Can I just point out that a possibles pouch or just useful items that you have in your pocket just like lighters SAK, mini first aid kits etc.... are all types of survival kits?
Yes they are not the classic tin type, but they are all things that people have thought to keep on them to make their life easier or be able to survive?? if a situation no matter where they are will improve their situation and most of Joe public will not have on them.
We all no matter if you just carry them in case or use them regularly have thought about what will make my life easier. All of you have thought along the lines of Fire, Shelter, Food, Water, Tools which are the basics for any survival kit.
All a tin does it put the items in one place and sharpen your mind as to what to carry and it means its all in one place on your person.
Anyway I thought I might just add my 2p worth on this one.
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Chinkapin, Thanks for the story very interesting... I don't think anyone is saying don't prepare for your adventure and taking some basic kit along on what is a seemingly benign trip especially if you're heading out into some backcountry or wilderness area. But do you need a specific survival kit? Especially in the UK? A 'switched on' hill walker will take precautions and their 'survival' kit is the daysack and contents and clothing system they are wearing. Survival preperations start with knowing when and when not to go for the adventure weather forecast snow conditions etc followed by giving good clear intentions as to where they are going and an expected time back to a responsible person. If things go tit's up ( sprained ankle, loss of route, benightment etc)then they have kit to keep them warm and dry ( or at least alive) for the most part and when they become overdue the responsible person gets worried and alerts the emergency services and the clear intentions plan swings into action. What's unlikely to happen is the need to dip into a survival tin for kit to: Improvise shelter, snare rabbits, navigate with a button compass use a condom for water collection etc...
An arguement for a survival kit is what if you get seperated from your main kit so our example hillwalker looses his pack. The question is how is he going to loose it? This is a civillian hillwalker not a Badged SF 'Operator' so our Hill walker is not going to have to dump his Bergen in a contact and flee to Syria.. He might fall in a river and it gets swept away. This is where the urbanisation of the UK comes in handy in reality you're not too far from a road even in quite wild places.
Along with walking in a group and knowing when to cross rivers and when not too. So loose your kit and your mates will help you out... Understand river systems and river crossing techniques and you might not have gotten into the river in the first place. Fall in and loose the pack no friends around.. Walk to nearest road and seek assitance. Cannot navigate to nearest road then are you going to have the skill to extract value out of a survival tin??...
I loved making various survival kits when I was a kid and it made me think hard about what to pack and how it might be used. I agree with some of the comments above however, that most of the content of a typical BCB type kit would never be used in most UK survival situations.
Now I just carry a first aid kit, water, knife and lighter. That and the appropriate clothing can go a very long way in most situations.
Now I just carry a first aid kit, water, knife and lighter. That and the appropriate clothing can go a very long way in most situations.
And survival situations are not most situations.
You could get away without the first aid kit, water, knife and lighter in most situations
