Who was the genius who conned us into believing we need a fixed blade knife for bushcraft?

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Mar 11, 2023
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Well I imagine that got your attention didn't it?

But it's a serious question.

Let me explain, when we look at the history of mankind a fixed blade knife wasn't the main tool option.

Otzi the iceman, for example, is probably the earliest none written example of a outdoorsmans tool choices. Yes he had a flint knife but that was the standard of the time. His main tool, the thing of value and there for the tool he valued the most was his bronze axe. If a knife was better why didn't he have a bronze knife and a flint axe?

Travel forward in time to the dark ages, what was the tool that every man had for both work and war? An axe, not a sword or spear these were for the elite, the warrior class. Yes, most people had a small fixed bladed eating knife which probably doubled up for a carving tool, but again the technology was limited. Although I do own a bronze handle from a roman pocket knife which was caste to depict a hound chasing a hare, there for we can assume it was a hunting knife and due to cost of manufacture at the time probably owned by someone of status.

Travel forward again to a time where metal tools were much more common and technology had evolved to allow cost and choice to be much more a personal thing such as the earliest days in the birth of the America's. A time where we have records of people's lives, a time where almost all people lived and worked outdoors in one form or another, what do we find? The choice of tools for the outdoorsmans, the long hunter and the soldiers on the frontier even the indigenous people they encountered was the folding pocket knife and the axe. Fixed bladed knives were used for butchery, of both beast and man, but for outdoor life it was a folding knife and a axe.

Records from the French and Indian wars show that soldiers on both sides were issued pocket knives, one in summer and two in winter, and belt axes. No records I have seen record soldiers being issued fixed bladed knives, indeed the belt axe is even recorded as being issued to replace the bayonet.

Jump forward again to the last century or so. People like Nessmuk, sportsmen and hunters, what do we know of their choice of tool? Well still we see the ancient wisdom of pocket knife and axe! Yes, the famous Nessmuk knife was there, but like the long hunter of old, his sheath knife was used purely for butchery or eating.

Even in the two world wars where more industrialised men where taken from town or semi rural life the cutting tool they were issued was a pocket knife.

So what's my point?

If at a time when men lived and breathed a life in the woods the pocket knife and the axe where the tools of choice, for many thousands of years (technology allowing) - now at a time where we all live in a life almost totally removed from nature our so called gurus and outdoors experts all preach we need a fixed bladed knife!

Why? What has changed?

Given that 90% of our so called outdoors experts are monkey see monkey do and are just regurgitating information they've been taught at some school or another and have rarely grown up in a immersed outdoor life so potentially don't have the depth of experience of our forebears, who was the person who started the trend or fad of the fixed blade knife?

Or, as I suspect might be the case, who was the genius who realized that modern outdoors folk lack in skill so much that it was better that carry a fixed bladed knife rather than the tools of choice of their ancestors?

OK, well done for bearing with me, I'm sure your now chomping at the bit to reply, but before you do bear in mind I'm not talking about collecting fixed blade knives or their practicality or beauty, i'm talking about why modern people (urban types we are now) seem to believe a fixed bladed knife is so special that they now ignore the woods wisdom of generations people who lived and breathed the life of a woodman.

And as a example of this let me add one last little gem! Batoning, so removed are we now from the wisdom of old that we had to invent a way of using a tool, not designed for the job, to split wood.

Moras etc aside, financially a good pocket knife and a belt axe is better value and more versatile than a sheath (one tool option) fix bladed knife.

Phew, hopefully I've explained my thoughts clearly enough. Now I'll grab a pipe and a coffee and await the replies I'm sure you good people will share
 
the tool he valued the most was his bronze axe
Ötzi's axe was 99% copper, very different from even bad bronze.

Moras etc aside, financially a good pocket knife and a belt axe is better value and more versatile than a sheath (one tool option) fix bladed knife.
Hmmm ... apples and oranges. For hundreds of years people in Taiga have carried an axe and a fixed blade knife. As far as I know Finns( Swedes at the time) emigrating into the colonies (present day Delaware) carried an axe and a fixed blade knife. Puukkos have been around for some while.

A small axe and a fixed blade knife are not alternatives they are complementary.
 
Not sure if I agree with all of your observations but I'm sure it will be an interesting thread.

I do have , One question however. If that is your assertion - does that mean that all of these were somewhat misguided purchases?

 
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Nobody 'conned' me into anything. I learnt from doing, not watching some self proclaimed 'expert' on TV or YouTube; I pick the tool I need to do the job. But then, I guess I spend a lot more time in the field and in the woods than any 'urban types' (your words not mine). I must admit, I laugh sometimes when people that do things for a hobby try to tell others that do it every day what tool is best for the job :) But there's no 'one way'; each to their own.

I could write a two page answer but, quite honestly, don't have the energy (I've been splitting 12" ash logs with wooden wedges).
 
M
Not sure if I agree with all of your observations but I'm sure it will be an interesting thread.

I do have , One question however. If that is your assertion - does that mean that all of these were somewhat misguided purchases?

Lol, or am I as guilty of being suckered into wasting money like every one else?

No as I said above I not talking about knives as such. I love my knives as much as the next man, and for the record, I don't carry an axe mostly either, I have a fixed bladed, hand made leuko and a opinel no9 in my kit mostly.

This thread is more about the discussion or idea.
 
Like TLM said; here in Finland a fixed blade puukko have been the staple knife for hundreds of years besides the axe.
I got my first Mora knife at about the age of ten or so. So about mid-70´s. No internet and no bushcraft programs on tv.
Carved my own toy rifles out of scrapwood and batoning was one of the methods to remove wood. No one taught me that - figured it out by myself. The Mora puukko was the only tool I had.
 
Like TLM said; here in Finland a fixed blade puukko have been the staple knife for hundreds of years besides the axe.
I got my first Mora knife at about the age of ten or so. So about mid-70´s. No internet and no bushcraft programs on tv.
Carved my own toy rifles out of scrapwood and batoning was one of the methods to remove wood. No one taught me that - figured it out by myself. The Mora puukko was the only tool I had.
Interesting, you chose a Sweden knife over a Finnish maker?

The puukko and leuko combo is a thread for another day me thinks
 
< snip >

So what's my point?

If at a time when men lived and breathed a life in the woods the pocket knife and the axe where the tools of choice, for many thousands of years (technology allowing) - now at a time where we all live in a life almost totally removed from nature our so called gurus and outdoors experts all preach we need a fixed bladed knife!

Why? What has changed?

<snip>

Is it possibly that few of us have free reign to use Axes to cut down trees that don't belong to us - so we don't tend to fixate on carrying axes unless its more a organised course and so permission has already been granted?

A Pen knife can do lots at a smaller level, and as an easy to carry tool that is discrete , doesn't raise eyebrows or areas of concern is or can be a useful addition.

But to me a Fixed blade can do much of the in between work and then some more.

Your point about Pocket knives being issued to military - How would you then view the Ka-Bar? Fighting knife that should be lumped in with Bayonets or sentry removal or general Utility knife??
 
Is it possibly that few of us have free reign to use Axes to cut down trees that don't belong to us - so we don't tend to fixate on carrying axes unless its more a organised course and so permission has already been granted?

A Pen knife can do lots at a smaller level, and as an easy to carry tool that is discrete , doesn't raise eyebrows or areas of concern is or can be a useful addition.

But to me a Fixed blade can do much of the in between work and then some more.

Your point about Pocket knives being issued to military - How would you then view the Ka-Bar? Fighting knife that should be lumped in with Bayonets or sentry removal or general Utility knife??
Good question, worth expanding on too.

K bars, Israeli defence force knife, SRK, Fairburn Skyes knife etc tend to be, as far as I'm aware, specialist issue. K bars for Marine Corp, SRK seal teams, Fairburn Skyes command etc... Even the modest Mod Survival knife is specialist issue... More general issue these days are multitools, even in my day we were issued Gerbers for the Gulf War.

As for the trees and axes question, it could also be argued a folding saw has replaced the axe and is safer (especially in untrained hands) and more selective or less destructive, so potentially had they been available 200 years ago they may have been more common, although for many years of mans existence a axe was a weapon and a tool, a viking beserker waving a laplander about probably wasn't as bowl loosening as one with a bloody great dane axe
 
I always carried a rather large fixed blade knife whilst in the Armed Forces, the folding bayonet hasn't really caught on yet.

We use a fixed blade knife at home in the kitchen for safety (hygiene and physical safety), why wouldn't I use a fixed blade knife for food prep when out doing bushcraft? And at that point, why carry more than one knife?

I regularly baton wood with my knife as if I am not going to be chopping trees or larger logs, a saw and a knife are then all I need to carry without also having to lug an axe about the place. Really depends on the size of the fire and the size of the firewood as to whether an axe is necessary.
 
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I always carried a rather large fixed blade knife whilst in the Armed Forces, the folding bayonet hasn't really caught on yet.

We use a fixed blade knife at home in the kitchen for safety (hygiene and physical safety), why wouldn't I use a fixed blade knife for food prep when out doing bushcraft? And at that point, why carry more than one knife?

I regularly baton wood with my knife as if I am not going to be chopping trees or larger logs, a saw and a knife are then all I need to carry without also having to lug an axe about the place. Really depends on the size of the fire and the size of the firewood as to whether an axe is necessary.
Chris, I take it you never had the joy of a SA80 bayonet then, lol, the early issued ones were a caste iron type thing and snapped left right and centre, even the wire cutting attachment was about as much use as a chocolate fire guard.
 
Good question, worth expanding on too.

K bars, Israeli defence force knife, SRK, Fairburn Skyes knife etc tend to be, as far as I'm aware, specialist issue. K bars for Marine Corp, SRK seal teams, Fairburn Skyes command etc... Even the modest Mod Survival knife is specialist issue... More general issue these days are multitools, even in my day we were issued Gerbers for the Gulf War.

As for the trees and axes question, it could also be argued a folding saw has replaced the axe and is safer (especially in untrained hands) and more selective or less destructive, so potentially had they been available 200 years ago they may have been more common, although for many years of mans existence a axe was a weapon and a tool, a viking beserker waving a laplander about probably wasn't as bowl loosening as one with a bloody great dane axe

From my understanding I think we have differed from what is intended to be primarily a weapon vs what is potentially a tool ( Knife )

Weapon - explicitly for harming a person - Bayonet ( mounted or not ) F&S dagger, Smatchet , trench dagger , etc - all tend to be double edged pointy short term friend-makers.

Utility Knives - Ka-Bar , SRK , Parang, MOD survival lawnmower blade.


Yes all Utility knives can be pressed into service as a weapon if required but that is not there primary role.

Can all weapons be pressed into service as a general utility Knife??

I guess there is a similarity between axes , some axes are definitely designed and weighted for processing timber , whilst some are definitely more aligned to remove unwanted limbs from torso.

I would say a Pocket knife are more a Tool of convenience and maybe became fashionable at the time - a sort of ' look how clever we are! , Blades that fold ! - Two of them!!! and a Spike -Oh-La-La!! '


I'm not sure if American frontiers pioneers folk had Penknives??
What Penknife would you wish to take in replacement of a fixed blade if combined with an axe??
 
I loving this thread... As an aside, entrenching tools have been the infantry man's axe for quite a few years and in the trenches was used as a very effective weapon hense the spatznes shovel.

The pocket knife of the frontiers man and soldier (French and Indian War and American Revolutionary war etc) was a kind of locking knife with a ring on the lock, but the poor man's version was a penny knife, and as Dave Canterbury explains it this was like a opinel with the locking ring removed.

Herman 30, interesting in the UK when I was a kid we all had pocket knives rather than puukos, my dad gifted me his army knife when I was 6 years old, it's dated 1952 and I still have it.

I wonder if there's a cultural significance here as well as a historical one.
 
One of the better known “frontier” knives was fixed blade. The “Green River hunting knife.” Made originally in Green River, Massachusetts but known as the Arkansas tooth pick. It was extensively copied by Sheffield knife makers and tens of thousands were sold to gold rush emigrants.
 
Chris, I take it you never had the joy of a SA80 bayonet then, lol, the early issued ones were a caste iron type thing and snapped left right and centre, even the wire cutting attachment was about as much use as a chocolate fire guard.

Only those still being issued from 2006! They were pretty shocking even then, but at least never had one snap.
 
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One of the better known “frontier” knives was fixed blade. The “Green River hunting knife.” Made originally in Green River, Massachusetts but known as the Arkansas tooth pick. It was extensively copied by Sheffield knife makers and tens of thousands were sold to gold rush emigrants.
Ahhh but that's a butcher knife not a whittler... I thought the tooth pick was a dagger type blade hence the name... It had a point you could pick your teeth with.
 

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