to quote or not to quote ?

[spirit-bear]

This is the question..

In my signature i have qouted a little known bushcrafter by the name of Ray Mears.
I have been a little puzzled by the qoute and recieved a pm from somone asking me the same thing which has got me wondering.

you can not underestimate the importance of preparation...

from what i seem to get from it from the meaning of "underestimate" is to give somthing a low meaning of worth or quantity which would mean that this qoute would translate as prepearation is pointless ????

surely it should be more like.... you SHOULD not underestimate....

But this is a qoute by ray mears as ive googled it etc and come back with the same qoute..

Or am i missing somthing here ?

 

[Shewie]

Don't they both mean the same thing ?

"You can not" means there is no alternative, "you should not" means it's probably best if you don't.

 

[Ahjno]

Semantics ...

You should not (...)
I read this as something being posed. You can make up your own mind of what you do, irrespective of what the person said:
- underestimating the importance (...), or
- not underestimating the importance (...)

It's up to you to draw your own conclusion.


You can not (...)
I read this as the person saying this (making a statement ...) finding it being a fact. In his opinion there's only one option:
- not underestimating the importance (...)

You can not draw your own conclusion. The person making this statement made this as being a fact. End of discussion. Period.

Don't want you to learn to suck eggs ... Me not being a native speaker

 

[nuggets]

Dank je wel

 

[spirit-bear]

I am happy to suck eggs as it were

I was reading as though.. can not as in no choice but to... underestimate which would mean you have to underestimate it which got me confuzzled.

But i am happy to bow to your superior understanding of the english language on this one as what you have put forward makes sense to me.

Jim..

 

[myotis]

"You can not underestimate the importance of preparation."

I think you are correct, and this quote is wrong.

It should be

You cannot "overestimate" the importance of preparation

OR

You should not underestimate the importance of preparation.

As it stands, it makes no sense.

Graham

 

[Shewie]

I'm lost now, are we saying that it's the underestimate or the overestimate that is the issue ?

Underestimate - an estimation that is too low
Overestimate - an estimation that is too high

So to make an "estimation that is too low" of the importance of being prepared makes it right to me.

The "can not" "cannot" or "can't" makes it more definitive than a slightly unsure "should"

I only got a c for o-level English though

My head hurts

 

[Tadpole]

Would it make more sense to you if it read "you can not (allow yourself to) underestimate the importance of preparation.

 

[spirit-bear]

My head hurts too

If the qoute had been... can not overestimate... then it would read fine to me, because it would mean no matter how important you think it is its never overestimated therefore very important.

But because it has underestimate in the quote does it not mean that no matter how unimportant you think it is its never underestimated therefore not very important at all.

 

[nitrambur]

from common errors in English usage
http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/underestimated.html

it should be should

 

[Ahjno]

"You can not underestimate the importance of preparation."

I think you are correct, and this quote is wrong.

It should be

You cannot "overestimate" the importance of preparation

OR

You should not underestimate the importance of preparation.

As it stands, it makes no sense.

Graham

I think the quote is correct.

First of course because it's a direct quote. It's penned down word by word.

Second:
When you overestimate your opponent, you might find yourself winning playing a game of chess, while you first thought you would loose dramatically.
When you underestimate your opponent, you think you can have him handsdown, but in the end get beaten big time.

Therefor it must be 'underestimate'.

You can not underestimate the importance of preparation.
When you think lighly about (read: underestimate) the importance of preparation, you might find yourself in trouble.

You should not drive on the right side of the road (but you could do so).
You should do the dishes (but you could choose to do different)

You should not underestimate the importance of preparation (but you could do so).

(Again) Signed,

A Dutchie

Wondering if he can / should have dinner

EDIT:

from common errors in English usage
http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/underestimated.html

it should be should

Aaaahh - learnt something new ...
Thank you for the URL!!

 

[spirit-bear]

from common errors in English usage
http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/underestimated.html

it should be should

Thanks for the link.

So Mr Mears SHOULD have said SHOULD not rather than CAN not which makes more sense to me.

But then if i change the quote to.. should not.. its no longer a quote by mr Mears lol

 

[helixpteron]

Me not being a native speaker

You speak native just fine!

 

[nitrambur]

Thanks for the link.

So Mr Mears SHOULD have said SHOULD not rather than CAN not which makes more sense to me.

But then if i change the quote to.. should not.. its no longer a quote by mr Mears lol

You could change it to ..... To paraphrase R.Mears "You should not..."

 

[Pierr]

[caveat: non native speaker] I think you could use both "should not" or "can not" but they have opposite meanings:

You should not underestimate --> do not underestimate
You can not overestimate --> it is not possible to overestimate: no matter how much you estimate the importance of preparation (in this quote's context), it would still not be too much importance granted to preparation

This would make it a bit ironic that this sentence has been accepted as a quote

 

[Trev]

I think it's more to do with the way people speak . In the quote when Ray says " you can not " he means "don't" . It's just how people express themselves when talking .

 

[Pierr]

I think it's more to do with the way people speak . In the quote when Ray says " you can not " he means "don't" . It's just how people express themselves when talking .

Makes sense: "you cannot do that", it something you should not do; I can buy that way of reading it; still funny in its ambiguity.

 

[Tony]

This thread...

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Umm, why's my smilie not clapping his hands....

 

[Hoodoo]

You can but you shouldn't. :borgsmile

 

[Hoodoo]

This thread...

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Umm, why's my smilie not clapping his hands....

You know your famous when people analyze you're every word.