My post was aimed at Broch, sorry.
Use of "incorrect" and "misguided" was purely aimed at his assertion that I was wrong to use the term sportsmanship in the context of hunting.
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My post was aimed at Broch, sorry.
Use of "incorrect" and "misguided" was purely aimed at his assertion that I was wrong to use the term sportsmanship in the context of hunting.
I suspect so - as I hope I've made clear, I have no problems with hunting - but our ancestors (and by that, in the UK, I mean Mesolithic and Neolithic not Medieval) killed animals for two reasons alone - to eat or to protect themselves or their stock. We can maintain a tradition of hunting without it being an entertainment or a sport. My fear is that there will be more and more limitation in the UK because as long as it's portrayed as 'fun' it will result in more public lobbying against it.
Anyway, the bl**dy rabbits are getting closer to the newly planted brassicas - time to sight in the .22
Chris, I have never said 'you are wrong', all I have said is 'I see it this way'.
However, the skills you describe above have nothing to do with 'sport' in my opinion; they are all to do with survival. I am a hunter, a fisherman, and I craft from bone and leather - have done since a kid but, I suspect, my skills methods and practices are a lot closer to 'our ancestors' than many.
Broch, the mistake you keep making is answering me as if I think hunting is a sport, like football, and that I am trying to present it as such. All this because I can separate the concept of "sportsmanship", as it has been used by others, from things that I personally consider to be or not be "sports".
You are absolutely right; I have just re-read our posts and, as far as I can tell, you have never described hunting or shooting animals as 'sport'.
We are probably in total agreement
- around a pub table we would have come to that conclusion two pints ago!
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I have always believed that Alienation from Nature is a major enviromental problem.
We sorta manage. Societally we’ve moved from an era where disputes were settled either
I suspect some of our differences trace back in history as well although now back to Neolithic ages. Rather I mean that at least from the Middle Ages and on through the colonial period it seems that hunting for pleasure in Europe (and by extension the UK) was reserved for the Royals (or at least for the nobility) As times have progressed that puts it in a bad light for the common people (the vast majority of society) and their traditions would have developed much differently as would their views. On the other hand hunting was the purview of the common settlers and pioneers; and still is. In other words where on your side of the pond (and to some extent here as well in this age of urbanization) the common person whose view of nature is derived from tv documentaries likely think of ”sport” hunting as a pastime of the wealthy: here in out traditional rural environments (and to a lesser extent urbanites who until recently were rural) think of it as the way of life I described earlier. Ironically it’s our wealthier (celebrity class) who clamor the loudest against hunting. A reversal of class norms I suppose.I suspect so - as I hope I've made clear, I have no problems with hunting - but our ancestors (and by that, in the UK, I mean Mesolithic and Neolithic not Medieval) killed animals for two reasons alone - to eat or to protect themselves or their stock. We can maintain a tradition of hunting without it being an entertainment or a sport. My fear is that there will be more and more limitation in the UK because as long as it's portrayed as 'fun' it will result in more public lobbying against it.
Anyway, the bl**dy rabbits are getting closer to the newly planted brassicas - time to sight in the .22
And yes, you’ve been clear on you views. I also wouldn’t force my views on others entirely. However nothing would prevent me from both defending those views, and doing my best to pas that way of life down to the next generations.
You are correct, its very dfferent here.
(We certainly do have American style game parks).
Hunting, is unfortunatley, very schismatic.
(We certainly do have American style game parks).
Hunting, is unfortunatley, very schismatic.
I think I need to clarify the Meaning of some of my comments regarding hunting (and by extension, fishing) as a way of life. As briefly as possible I mean their intrinsic to that way of life. Some hav commented that the idea of keeping hunting (and I presume fishing) trophies is somehow different from other types of trophies. Why? It’s been mentioned that nobody would take photos of a domestic animal (cow) if they killed it. Perhaps not, BUT! but it is extremely common for prize cattle to be taken to completions and awarded trophies along with pictures and bragging rights. Not just livestock, but vegetable crops and home made jams, preserves, pies, etc. The biggest watermelon, the finest tomato, the most desired strawberry jam, etc. all win prizes around harvest time. The very idea of a county fair was developed exactly to show off these things and foster competition in a friendly fest.
Why would hunting/fishing be different save for the fact you can’t put a halter on a prize deer or a wild caught salmon. Indeed many hunting traditions and competitions (particularly out West developed with such in mind: many Western cities have sponsors providing prizes for the a) First deer killed, b) the largest one, c) the one with the most points, etc. Here along the Gulf Coast the same concept is applied to saltwater fishing with most of the coastal cities have annual fishing rodeos with similar prizes (The difference being the hunting prizes are more likely to be premium rifles while the fishing rodeos usually offer premium tackle as prizes)
Regarding the “trophy” it’s been discussed in a light that asks why a hunter or fisherman should want to keep a trophy. I post the reverse question: Why wouldn’t he or she? As I described it as a way of life, one to be passed down to generations, one to be enjoyed with like minded people (very usually family or lifelong friends) With that in mind, why wouldn’t we want photos and trophies to remind us of those times spent either alone with the prey, alone with the dogs, or together with our “tribe” as it were?
Why would hunting/fishing be different save for the fact you can’t put a halter on a prize deer or a wild caught salmon. Indeed many hunting traditions and competitions (particularly out West developed with such in mind: many Western cities have sponsors providing prizes for the a) First deer killed, b) the largest one, c) the one with the most points, etc. Here along the Gulf Coast the same concept is applied to saltwater fishing with most of the coastal cities have annual fishing rodeos with similar prizes (The difference being the hunting prizes are more likely to be premium rifles while the fishing rodeos usually offer premium tackle as prizes)
Regarding the “trophy” it’s been discussed in a light that asks why a hunter or fisherman should want to keep a trophy. I post the reverse question: Why wouldn’t he or she? As I described it as a way of life, one to be passed down to generations, one to be enjoyed with like minded people (very usually family or lifelong friends) With that in mind, why wouldn’t we want photos and trophies to remind us of those times spent either alone with the prey, alone with the dogs, or together with our “tribe” as it were?
“Game parks“ are rare here. They do exist, but for larger game, they’re rare. most hunting is done on either private land (self owned or with permission from the owner) or on public land (National Forests, State Forests, or open range)
Back to more like the original theme, does this steak look familiar?
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Mosquitoes are more dangerous than any other critter so let's get that hunted for money instead!!! You really test your skill stalking then shooting one out of the sky without getting bitten!!! With added risk by doing your hunt in a malaria area.
Blast that pesky mosquito with a shot gun. Awesome. Quite a risk of missing though.
When I looked at this I was quite fascinated by the numbers. However, I was always told that Water Buffalo were the most dangerous animals in Africa - but not according to this list (I think the numbers are pretty 'rounded'):
1) Mosquitos - 750,000 deaths per annum (though it's the malaria they carry that kills)
2) Humans - 437,000
3) Snakes - 100,000
4) Dogs 35,000 (most caused by rabies)
5) Freshwater snails - 20,000 (caused by a parasite)
6) Assassin bug - 12,000 (Chagas disease)
7) Tsetse flies - 10,000 (again, not actually killed by the fly)
8) Roundworms - 4,500
9) Crocodiles - 1,000
10) Tapeworm - 700
11) Hippo - 500
12) Elephant - 500
13) Lions - 22
14) Wolves - 10
15) Sharks - 6
1) Mosquitos - 750,000 deaths per annum (though it's the malaria they carry that kills)
2) Humans - 437,000
3) Snakes - 100,000
4) Dogs 35,000 (most caused by rabies)
5) Freshwater snails - 20,000 (caused by a parasite)
6) Assassin bug - 12,000 (Chagas disease)
7) Tsetse flies - 10,000 (again, not actually killed by the fly)
8) Roundworms - 4,500
9) Crocodiles - 1,000
10) Tapeworm - 700
11) Hippo - 500
12) Elephant - 500
13) Lions - 22
14) Wolves - 10
15) Sharks - 6
Occasionally ALDI sell wagyu beef in gold printed packaging. If you spot that give it a go. I know about the company that supplies it from a farm that does some of its production and it's well reared cattle. The same beef goes to a famous, London (Birmingham and possibly elsewhere) department store so it's good beef at Aldi prices. Never tried it because the stuff goes too quickly when it hits the shelves in my local store. The farmer rearing them actually stockpiles for the freezer.
It should be noted that supermarkets get a truly bad press at times and some of it is likely justified. Tricks where foreign, lower welfare reared animals are finished off in the UK then get called British meat. IIRC some of the largest store chains sell meat and vegetables as from British farms under very questionable practices that get through loopholes. From what I've heard the two big, budget stores are actually among the biggest supporters of British farms through the whole process of getting food to your plate. Somewhere I heard that Aldi was the stoe that supported British farms more than the others. No link but I've heard that from farming sources I have no reason to doubt yet.
Our whole food network is big business and messed up. I doubt we'd accept the cost increase the really sort it out. We're not all able to shop at local, small butchers and grocers due to cost or time needed to visit multiple retailers instead of one supermarket. Personally I get around that a bit by buying meat once a month at Booths supermarket which IME is the closest a supermarket has got to being like quality butchers and greengrocers.
It should be noted that supermarkets get a truly bad press at times and some of it is likely justified. Tricks where foreign, lower welfare reared animals are finished off in the UK then get called British meat. IIRC some of the largest store chains sell meat and vegetables as from British farms under very questionable practices that get through loopholes. From what I've heard the two big, budget stores are actually among the biggest supporters of British farms through the whole process of getting food to your plate. Somewhere I heard that Aldi was the stoe that supported British farms more than the others. No link but I've heard that from farming sources I have no reason to doubt yet.
Our whole food network is big business and messed up. I doubt we'd accept the cost increase the really sort it out. We're not all able to shop at local, small butchers and grocers due to cost or time needed to visit multiple retailers instead of one supermarket. Personally I get around that a bit by buying meat once a month at Booths supermarket which IME is the closest a supermarket has got to being like quality butchers and greengrocers.
I found a little different chart for the UK (according to the NHS)
And this one for the US
In both cases cows rank higher than sharks. Unfortunately I haven’t found one yet for worldwide.
Yep, there were definitely more people killed in the UK by cows last year than by lions
LOL. I know what you mean; I thought along the same lines when I read the charts. That said, like Allison I’d also heard before that cows kill more people annually worldwide than any other animal. While I can’t find those charts or articles this morning it certainly seems logical enough. After all, most people tend to think of them as docile (and generally they are) but they also are huge, have a herd mentality, and tend to ignore anything between them and their food (including humans) Likewise for horses but there are fewer horses than cattle overall.Yep, there were definitely more people killed in the UK by cows last year than by lions
You might also take that number of how many people are killed by humans with a grain of salt. I don’t know the ration worldwide but in the US a little over 63% of homicides are suicide.
