hi, i,m looking at purchasing one of these tents .i have been looking at them for some time now and they seem to be what i,m after for putting in the canoe.i went up to see casper in edinburgh and he was kind enough to pitch one for me.does anybody on the forum have one of these tried and tested ,that could posssibly give me some feedback as to how they perform.i am looking at this tent because i want a tent i can put a fire in ,(desperate to experience a heated tent)but i just cant seem to beleive that this would not damage or even burn the tent,and it is quite a bit of cash to get burned at £1000 with the groundsheet.the stove looks great but i just cant justify the expence of that on top of the tent and groundsheet,i was wondering if a round firepit found in garden centres would work well,they even have a mesh gaurd over the top which would obviously help with the sparks.does the tent get smoke damaged at the top ,and my other concern is where and how long it would take to dry out after a soaking.any help ,suggestions are welcome.any pictures would be great .
tapp varrie 7
- Thread starter Gill
- Start date
-
Come along to the amazing Summer Moot (21st July - 2nd August), a festival of bushcrafting and camping in a beautiful woodland PLEASE CLICK HERE for more information.
I've not yet lit a fire in mine (only had it a month or so). However I've seen a couple that have had fires (fireboxes) in them, and they seem absolutely fine. I couldn't see any obvious damage, discolouring etc.
Another option is to buy a wood-burning stove/heater. I know the official one is hugely expensive, but you can get one made for a fraction of the price. It might not be as light or compact, but should still be manageable in a canoe. PM me if you want a tel number.
Another option is to buy a wood-burning stove/heater. I know the official one is hugely expensive, but you can get one made for a fraction of the price. It might not be as light or compact, but should still be manageable in a canoe. PM me if you want a tel number.
...and re soaking, the canvas is impreganted, so shouldn't get soaking wet. Water should bead off it for the most part. I've had mine up during a few heavy downpours, and it doesn't seem to take long to dry off if the sun's out. There is a loop at the top of the tent that you can hang it by if you need to dry it out when you're back from a trip.
i've no experiance with those exactly, buy i've had a firebox in my tipi-tarp afew times and there were no problems (aslong as the ventilation was good!). yarrow has an arran 5 and regularly has a fire box in it with him, + mrs + 2 dogs and no problem. hope that helps,
rob
rob
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
It doesn't seem to be a problem for this coulpe 
http://www.abenteuerbox.de/images/moskoseltapp5n.jpg
I'm awaiting delivery of a new traditional tipi and will be having fires in that for sure during the winter meets
Cheers,
Bam.
http://www.abenteuerbox.de/images/moskoseltapp5n.jpg
I'm awaiting delivery of a new traditional tipi and will be having fires in that for sure during the winter meets
Cheers,
Bam.
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
gill said:
Yep, a First Nations People one!
always wanted one and now I've got one on order....should be here in a few days time!!!!!!!!!
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
I don't have a link handy I'm affraid.
Yes far prefer....if I'm carrying then I use my hemmessy hammock or a basha but if car or canoe camping then what could be better!!!
Do a google search for "History tents", as that's the company I bought it from.
Hope that helps,
Bam.
(Edit, looked up their site...it's in german so you'll have to do a translation via google too
here you go: http://www.halang.de/h-home.html ).
Yes far prefer....if I'm carrying then I use my hemmessy hammock or a basha but if car or canoe camping then what could be better!!!
Do a google search for "History tents", as that's the company I bought it from.
Hope that helps,
Bam.
(Edit, looked up their site...it's in german so you'll have to do a translation via google too
here you go: http://www.halang.de/h-home.html ).One thing worth mentioning is that you need to be more selective about what you're burning, and how. The fire needs to burn hot (eg with a firebox or some system to create a more efficient burn. You also try to avoid resinous and damp woods as these will create more tars in the smoke. Casper suggested that compressed sawdust logs were particularly good as they're virtually smokeless and burn hot and long. Obviously not terribly handy unless you're car camping though.
MagiKelly
Making memories since '67
Mmmmm
You mean like this one
Now where you you find someone near to you that had one of these? I wonder?
Now I have never tried having a fire in one but will be recieving a small fire box next week. I still probably will not have a fire in it. I also take it in a canoe, usually when the girls are with me. The other times will be in winter but I have not had it through a winter yet.
My solution to heating it is a "Heat Pal 5100" This is a safe way to heat the tent and gives you a way of cooking in the Tipi as well. You can get these from Casper but they are far cheaper from your local boat chandler. I have one you can look at.
I am actually thinking I might sell the heat pal on as I have started looking at a Coleman Blackcat The disavantage is that you can't cook on this but carrying the fuel etc is a lot easier. Still not decided which way to go. Tentipi seem to recommend the Heat Pal so will try it for a while probably.
Any more questions, let me know. I will probably have the Tipi with me at the meet up next week but will be sleeping in a hammock so will only be setting it up if someone is wanting a look
You mean like this one
Now where you you find someone near to you that had one of these? I wonder?
Now I have never tried having a fire in one but will be recieving a small fire box next week. I still probably will not have a fire in it. I also take it in a canoe, usually when the girls are with me. The other times will be in winter but I have not had it through a winter yet.
My solution to heating it is a "Heat Pal 5100" This is a safe way to heat the tent and gives you a way of cooking in the Tipi as well. You can get these from Casper but they are far cheaper from your local boat chandler. I have one you can look at.
I am actually thinking I might sell the heat pal on as I have started looking at a Coleman Blackcat The disavantage is that you can't cook on this but carrying the fuel etc is a lot easier. Still not decided which way to go. Tentipi seem to recommend the Heat Pal so will try it for a while probably.
Any more questions, let me know. I will probably have the Tipi with me at the meet up next week but will be sleeping in a hammock so will only be setting it up if someone is wanting a look
do you put the heat pal on the ground sheet John? that coleman thing looks a lot like it would turn your tent in to more of a sawner(sp) that a cosy enclosure! 
led said:
Led.. i have found that if you collect really nice dry fire wood, you split it down nice and thin, and you strip the bark of just to leave you with bright wood you can get a nice hot burn.. and dig a trench under your fire box to allow oxygen to be drawn easily you can enjoy as warm and smokless a burn as you can.. obviously on damp nights with no wind you may get a bit of smoke hang in the tent.. but to me its part of the fun! and as you say.. compresses sawdust dont seem very 'bushcraft' to me!
MagiKelly
Making memories since '67
tomtom said:do you put the heat pal on the ground sheet John? that coleman thing looks a lot like it would turn your tent in to more of a sawner(sp) that a cosy enclosure!
You could probably get away with putting the Heat Pal on the groundsheet but I tend to either zip open the groundsheet or put it on a couple of bits of split wood.
Hi gill and bam. Been very interested to read your posts re tipi and kata. There are pros and cons for each. If my wife and i had to choose again we would be very pushed to make a decision as they both have many merits. First i would be reluctant to have an open fire, unless it was completely smokeless, in a kata. Most that i have seen have a stove.They are not tall enough to cope with smoke even charcoal is smokey when first lit. 
The smoke will preserve the material but will discolour it in time, and think what it will do to your lungs! There are some superb contraptions available including the bespoke Moskoselkaten ones (spelling?) Portability favours highly and the central pole can be cut from the bush if you want so saving weight even more. They are beautifully made and i like the colour.
The whole concept of the tipi is based around an open hearth. The lining keeps the draught away, the pitch direction and smoke flaps help to suck out the smoke. The base of the tipi & kata are much the same but with height the smoke can rise up out of the fire without billowing infront of you sat around the fire. Our tipi is twenty years old now the smoke has preserved the poles and the canvas. It has been to many occasions one of the recent best being The Wilderness Gathering. It has even been shot through with a 22 in wales. It survived the 1989 storms and all my children
(which is worse?) The poles are perhaps the biggest problem,although grown by me and very light are 23' long and there are 14 of them. One set i made for someone were cut in half to be joined like billiard cues. These fitted on an estate car. Still 28 pieces of timber
Bam, there are two things i will recommend to you, one is Patrick Whitefields book 'Tipi living' with illustrations by Anne Monger produced in 1987. A super little book by a master tipi fellow. The other is to not worry about rain as this is cured by an Ozan.
Lastly they both seem to be the same price at £ 800---£1000
Most of the stands of spruce now measure 18''+ so my market has shifted somewhere else, so i cant help with poles anymore. Good luck
All the best from Swyn.
The smoke will preserve the material but will discolour it in time, and think what it will do to your lungs! There are some superb contraptions available including the bespoke Moskoselkaten ones (spelling?) Portability favours highly and the central pole can be cut from the bush if you want so saving weight even more. They are beautifully made and i like the colour. The whole concept of the tipi is based around an open hearth. The lining keeps the draught away, the pitch direction and smoke flaps help to suck out the smoke. The base of the tipi & kata are much the same but with height the smoke can rise up out of the fire without billowing infront of you sat around the fire. Our tipi is twenty years old now the smoke has preserved the poles and the canvas. It has been to many occasions one of the recent best being The Wilderness Gathering. It has even been shot through with a 22 in wales. It survived the 1989 storms and all my children
(which is worse?) The poles are perhaps the biggest problem,although grown by me and very light are 23' long and there are 14 of them. One set i made for someone were cut in half to be joined like billiard cues. These fitted on an estate car. Still 28 pieces of timber Bam, there are two things i will recommend to you, one is Patrick Whitefields book 'Tipi living' with illustrations by Anne Monger produced in 1987. A super little book by a master tipi fellow. The other is to not worry about rain as this is cured by an Ozan.
Lastly they both seem to be the same price at £ 800---£1000
Most of the stands of spruce now measure 18''+ so my market has shifted somewhere else, so i cant help with poles anymore. Good luck
All the best from Swyn.
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Hey Swyn
Many thanks for the tips, I've never had a tipi before so it's all a bit new to me. I will be having fires in the tipi but may use a cheapy b&q bbq (the round one) to "line" my fire pit. Hadn't thought of burning charcoal, that's a very good idea!
No problem about the poles Mate, I'm a tree surgeon and have access to fell tiny pines locally so will be cutting my own.
I saw your tipi at the WG, if I'd know it was yours then I'd have come over for a butchers!
Can I ask what an "Ozan", is?
Cheers,
Bam.
Many thanks for the tips, I've never had a tipi before so it's all a bit new to me. I will be having fires in the tipi but may use a cheapy b&q bbq (the round one) to "line" my fire pit. Hadn't thought of burning charcoal, that's a very good idea!
No problem about the poles Mate, I'm a tree surgeon and have access to fell tiny pines locally so will be cutting my own.
I saw your tipi at the WG, if I'd know it was yours then I'd have come over for a butchers!
Can I ask what an "Ozan", is?
Cheers,
Bam.
Hi Bam, I can sense your excitement I still get a real buzz when ours goes up,and get a real end of summer feeling when it comes down. We take it down now in the driest time as the canvas will rot if not cared for and put it away where the mice and glis can't build nests inside it.
Skin the poles with a draw knife having cleanly snedded all spurs working from the butt end to tip. A small tripod approx 3'6'' when errected will help skinning. Point the fat ends so they stick in the ground (same as the main poles). This is tied and errected in the same way as the main tripod so is good practice. It can be made,usually with the offcuts from the butt ends when all the poles are matched up for length and diameter. Pitch the skinned poles as you would the main frame to dry. There is a ritual for this so they lay properly. I still allow ten days for initial drying. Be aware that pine is normally only felled in the depths of winter as it suffers from serious mould attack so I would recommend a good dose of 50/50 boiled linseed and proper turpentine with a further 25 percent slosh of cuprinol 5* This will slow the drying down somewhat but will prevent mould and shakes. Our poles are still oiled every year with this. When the poles are completely dry all the knot lumps can be sanded to make them as smooth as possible. This is so that the outer cover lays evenly on each pole and does not wear in small areas which may eventually turn into holes I want to see a picture of you sitting in the crown!!
The ozan is really a roof within the tipi. It is half moon shaped and does two things. The most important is directing any rain drops away from the centre and directing them down behind the lining. second to this in way of where it is inside, it traps heat from the fire and makes those inside warmer. Being half moon shaped it still allows smoke to rise up away from the fire. Ours is at eye level,any higher and it would be difficult to reach to set up, and allows room for six people to sleep completely dry even in the heaviest rainstorm. Finally beware that digging a hole for the fire will obscure heat from the red embers. I feel that a raised earth hearth perhaps would be the way to go. I made a contraption similar to the moroccan charcoal stove principal out of the usual gas bottle. This is safe, and acceptable at most gatherings, although one more thing to bring. It will still boil the kettle in two minutes, warm the family and be alight in the morning. Make your own and have a big smile when it works better than you ever imagined Good luck from Swyn.
I still get a real buzz when ours goes up,and get a real end of summer feeling when it comes down. We take it down now in the driest time as the canvas will rot if not cared for and put it away where the mice and glis can't build nests inside it. Skin the poles with a draw knife having cleanly snedded all spurs working from the butt end to tip. A small tripod approx 3'6'' when errected will help skinning. Point the fat ends so they stick in the ground (same as the main poles). This is tied and errected in the same way as the main tripod so is good practice. It can be made,usually with the offcuts from the butt ends when all the poles are matched up for length and diameter. Pitch the skinned poles as you would the main frame to dry. There is a ritual for this so they lay properly. I still allow ten days for initial drying. Be aware that pine is normally only felled in the depths of winter as it suffers from serious mould attack so I would recommend a good dose of 50/50 boiled linseed and proper turpentine with a further 25 percent slosh of cuprinol 5* This will slow the drying down somewhat but will prevent mould and shakes. Our poles are still oiled every year with this. When the poles are completely dry all the knot lumps can be sanded to make them as smooth as possible. This is so that the outer cover lays evenly on each pole and does not wear in small areas which may eventually turn into holes
I want to see a picture of you sitting in the crown!!The ozan is really a roof within the tipi. It is half moon shaped and does two things. The most important is directing any rain drops away from the centre and directing them down behind the lining. second to this in way of where it is inside, it traps heat from the fire and makes those inside warmer. Being half moon shaped it still allows smoke to rise up away from the fire. Ours is at eye level,any higher and it would be difficult to reach to set up, and allows room for six people to sleep completely dry even in the heaviest rainstorm. Finally beware that digging a hole for the fire will obscure heat from the red embers. I feel that a raised earth hearth perhaps would be the way to go. I made a contraption similar to the moroccan charcoal stove principal out of the usual gas bottle. This is safe, and acceptable at most gatherings, although one more thing to bring. It will still boil the kettle in two minutes, warm the family and be alight in the morning. Make your own and have a big smile when it works better than you ever imagined
Good luck from Swyn.swyn you obviously know what you are doing with a tipi.could you elaborate a bit more on the heating the tent with a fire ie what do you burn etc.do you have any pics(any pics at all would help) of the fire piece you made from a gas bottle.i have had a lot of mixed attitudes about this ,some say no fires,some say with certain woods,some say with man made fuels.it can all get a bit confusing.i have my eye on the moskoselkatan tapp varrie 7 canvas which at first i thought it was as simple as erecting and lighting a small fire inside with good dry fuel.now the more i have looked into it the more complicated it has become,so much so i,m not so sure about the tipi idea .i have looked at the stove and chimney option which looks fine but i would rather not have to transport this as well ,and the cost well i could probably heat my house for a year at the cost.and it is not the same as staring into a crackling fire on a snowy winters night .
Hi gill, pleeease don't ask me to do anything technical with my computer. I am always amazed what people seem to do and it always looks sooo simple Think your choise for Kata is great Me personally would burn charcoal in a moroccan stove if i had to make a serious choice right now this minute! I agree that the cost of the genuine stove is equal to a winters heating bills I can picture the moroccan job now, very pretty, made of beaten tin, it stands approx 16'' is 6'' round at the base 10''round at the top (where the charcoal is burned) has a handle like a beer mug and holes around the middle to allow air through (these may be adjustable). The top piece has holes in the bottom (like a cullender also to let air in under the fire) It is very light and could be lit outside so you would not fumigate yourself,your family and friends You could make a support for it so it would not get knocked over.
My gas bottle is similar in principal.
Unscrew valve, cut the valve guard off bottle (after filling it with water) or BANG!!!!! with a disc cutter, then cut bottle just above welded joint. This will form your burning crucible. Turn crucible upside down and place on top of base. This gives an idea of where to put a door in the base ( it should look right) Put this to one side for now and concentrate on the base.
Mark door approx 6'' wide 3'' tall and carefully cut one side, top and bottom. Leave second side uncut. Weld a 3'' butt hinge to cut side. (can you see it now?) Cut second side and make a traditional door catch (similar to that of a thumb latch) There should be enough play in the hinge to not have to have any moving parts I f you bend the side of the bar that runs across the centre of the door at 90 degrees after it goes past the opposite side of the hinge and beyond the catch, and drill a hole in it, you will have a handle you can get hold of to open it when it is too hot to toutch, using a bit of no 8 fence wire. This will allow air to pass inside under control.(you could make a nice poker later!)
Place the crucible in the finished base and mark where it sits. Remove again and either drill or gas 1/2 holes evenly around (about 30 of them) Fill in old valve hole with a nut or v thick washer (to stop coals falling through) Replace this onto base and weld together. Hey presto a charcoal burner Oh don't forget to grind off the galvanising where you are going to weld, it makes life easier
I hope these are clear. good luck from Swyn
Think your choise for Kata is great Me personally would burn charcoal in a moroccan stove if i had to make a serious choice right now this minute! I agree that the cost of the genuine stove is equal to a winters heating bills I can picture the moroccan job now, very pretty, made of beaten tin, it stands approx 16'' is 6'' round at the base 10''round at the top (where the charcoal is burned) has a handle like a beer mug and holes around the middle to allow air through (these may be adjustable). The top piece has holes in the bottom (like a cullender also to let air in under the fire) It is very light and could be lit outside so you would not fumigate yourself,your family and friends You could make a support for it so it would not get knocked over.My gas bottle is similar in principal.
Unscrew valve, cut the valve guard off bottle (after filling it with water) or BANG!!!!! with a disc cutter, then cut bottle just above welded joint. This will form your burning crucible. Turn crucible upside down and place on top of base. This gives an idea of where to put a door in the base ( it should look right) Put this to one side for now and concentrate on the base.
Mark door approx 6'' wide 3'' tall and carefully cut one side, top and bottom. Leave second side uncut. Weld a 3'' butt hinge to cut side. (can you see it now?) Cut second side and make a traditional door catch (similar to that of a thumb latch) There should be enough play in the hinge to not have to have any moving parts
I f you bend the side of the bar that runs across the centre of the door at 90 degrees after it goes past the opposite side of the hinge and beyond the catch, and drill a hole in it, you will have a handle you can get hold of to open it when it is too hot to toutch, using a bit of no 8 fence wire. This will allow air to pass inside under control.(you could make a nice poker later!)Place the crucible in the finished base and mark where it sits. Remove again and either drill or gas 1/2 holes evenly around (about 30 of them) Fill in old valve hole with a nut or v thick washer (to stop coals falling through) Replace this onto base and weld together. Hey presto a charcoal burner
Oh don't forget to grind off the galvanising where you are going to weld, it makes life easier I hope these are clear. good luck from Swyn
We have both the 5 man Arran Lightweight tent and the 9 man Canvas version. We have used the firebox many times in the small lightweight version and as long as you burn some good British smokeless charcoal these are very cosy and dont damage (ours is about 5 years old) We also have the whole stove in the large tent and this heats up the whole thing superbly. The top of the canvas can discolour over time (ours is 2 years old) and you will get a smoke smell in the tent fabric but the trade off for warmth is excellent.
We do not use a ground sheet with either tent and have not yet been in any conditions where one would have been an advantage. You can put a small sheet under any rollmat which is a lot smaller than the ground sheet and much cheaper!
The tents have a skirt all the way round simply pitch it and cover this with leaf litter to stop any drafts coming through.
If you want a warm tent there is nothing better ! I have been in shorts and T-shirt on 29th December in snow and -5 outside. The only problem is at some point you may want to leave for a pee!
We do not use a ground sheet with either tent and have not yet been in any conditions where one would have been an advantage. You can put a small sheet under any rollmat which is a lot smaller than the ground sheet and much cheaper!
The tents have a skirt all the way round simply pitch it and cover this with leaf litter to stop any drafts coming through.
If you want a warm tent there is nothing better ! I have been in shorts and T-shirt on 29th December in snow and -5 outside. The only problem is at some point you may want to leave for a pee!
