Sharpening with Japanese Waterstones RM Style!

[pibbleb]

Hi

Last week I posted that I was planning on sharpening my Frosts mora with waterstones that I'd got for Christmas and I'd asked for any hints or tips.

A couple of people posted that Ray had enclosed a Sharpening extra on one of his Bushcraft DVD's.

So with this in mind I dug out my DVD, I'm not big on the extras, and I searched the tutorial out.

Having found it I have literally hung on every word and below is a transcript of what is said. I've also attached links to some pictures I've taken.

Apologies for the plagiarism but I thought you guys may find it helpful.

SHARPENING YOUR KNIFE AT BASE CAMP!

At home and in camp we can keep knives sharp using bench stones like these:

These are Japanese water stones and the first job is to soak them in water.

They only need to soak for around 5 - 10 minutes just to saturate them.

We will use three different grits, the coarsest stone is 800, the medium is 1200 and the finest stone is 6000.

You can manage without this

but it i a very good idea to have one. It's a clamp to hold the stones with rubber feet so you can put it on a flat surface and the stone wouldn't slip around.

I'm starting here with the 800 stone, the coarsest one.

I'm making sure that I keep the stone wet. If it goes dry it'll stop working efficiently. http://www.bushcraftuk.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=1875&size=big&limit=recent

Place the knife flat on the stone and then tilt it until the bevel is flat against the stone.

Now try and slice across the stone keeping the bevel flat and I normally do this for about 8 strokes.

I've now done 8 strokes in one direction now I do 8 the other way. Lie the blade flat, tilt it until the edge bevel is flat. Now slice back towards you.

Having done 8 away from me and 8 towards me I do 8 alternating the direction. I do this to make sure I keep the edge true to the centre of the blade, keeping everything nice and even.

The thing I'm going to do now is give this area Pointing to the edge of the blade by the handle is give this area which is the closest to the handle some special attention as this is the part of the blade that we use for carving. Ray now proceeds to sharpen that part of the blade with 4 slices away from himself and 4 towards himself.

What I do now is repeat the whole process with the medium grit stone, the 1200.

When the edge is absolutely flat and there are no light spots reflecting from the edge you can move onto the next stone which is the finest grit.

The last stone is going to really polish the blade and give it a fine edge and a fine edge lasts longer than a coarse edge.

The way we use this stone is slightly different. You have to create a slurry on the surface. Most of these stones are supplied with a little stone which has a wonderful name. The nagura stone.

Ray rubs the little stone over the surface of the thin grit stone.

You use this to create a slurry on top of the stone. It is the slurry that is abrasive and actually polishes the blade. It may seem like a lot of effort but you don't do this very often and doing this is keeping your knife in absolutely the best condition, beautifully sharp, beautifully polished edge and it's very satisfying.

The black streak that appears on the stone is the metal coming off the blade.

Basically you use this stone in exactly the same way as the previous ones, 8 strokes in one direction, 8 in the other and then 8 in alternate directions.

The slurry on the stone can also be used to polish up the face of the blade.

Ray dips his fingers into the slurry and proceeds to rub it into the blade, whilst saying: Just keep your fingers away from the edge of the blade.

In theory if you've done the sharpening on the stones properly you can avoid the next stage but I always like to put it in just to make sure the knife is prefect.

What I'm going to do is strop the edge. What that does is remove any tiny, almost molecular thin pieces of metal which may be wobbling on the edge of the blade.

To do that you use the inside of a leather belt and I'm going to drag the knife so the edge is coming the other way so that it's not trying to cut the belt and I give it fifty strokes.

Ray now goes on to explain how he uses the edge of a window to finish the edge however, I will leave that out for now. I apologise for the length, whilst it seemed like a good idea at the time, it hasn't really worked out, but I hope it will be helpful.

Finally if you find that some info maybe missing please read British Reds excellent £5 sharpening kit thread as this will certainly help.

Regards.

P

 

[stuartmac5]

nice bit of work mate,
even without the video, you can figure out what is required.

big help to people like me who seem to get most of the way to a nice edge then screw it up somehow
You must have heard every section 50 times as you were pausing, rewinding etc!

 

[pibbleb]

I swear to god I could here Ray saying, as I drifted to sleep 'Repeat the process' 'repeat the process' 'repeat the process'

Hope it helps.

P

 

[addyb]

.....I just realized that there's a very old brown waterstone sitting in my Grandparents basement. I think they sharpen it when it's dry which obviously is the wrong way to go about it.

If I were to use it, should I just do as your directions say with the soaking in water for 10 minutes? Or if it's been dry for years, is it not worth using?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Adam

 

[pibbleb]

Andy I'm reasonably new to the world of sharpening stones, but I believe you can get wet and dry stones so it may well be that the stone in the basement is to be used wet.

That said I'm not really 100% sure so hopefully someone else can confirm or deny for us both!

P

 

[fred gordon]

Great piece of work. 'Repeat the process' the Bushcrafters mantra?

 

[addyb]

Andy I'm reasonably new to the world of sharpening stones, but I believe you can get wet and dry stones so it may well be that the stone in the basement is to be used wet.

That said I'm not really 100% sure so hopefully someone else can confirm or deny for us both!

P

I know, I prefer to use my set of arkansas stones dry as opposed to oiled. I started doing that after reading a blurb from John Juranitch's 'Razors Edge Book of Sharpening." It makes a huge difference.

But as for Japanese water stones, well, they don't call them waterstones for nothing! I think I'll have to pay my Grandparents a visit and have a look at this thing. If it is what I think it is, I'll soak it in a bucket of water for ten minutes and then have a go.

Thanks for the info, Pibbleb.

Adam

 

[pibbleb]

I miss understood, I thought you didn't know whether they were wet stones.

But you are absolutely right, if they are or it is a wet stone, it is kinda in the name!

 

[Biddlesby]

Hey that's great, I was looking for this since I have just borrowed a fine waterstone to sharpen my knives. Rep!

 

[Andy]

Whet stones (or is it wet) aren't all used with water or oil, the term used for putting the final edge on a knife is called wetting. Arkansas stones are normaly used with oil but some think they are better used dry. I haven't had the chance to use them dry since the only ones I've got have been used with oil in teh past and once oil has been used there's no going back.
I've got a wide ceramic stone that seems to work best wet (water), Norton oil stones which work best with something on and a proper natural japanese water stone which I like to use

I don't go in for 8 strokes one side then 8strokes the other but if it works you you fair enough

 

[pibbleb]

Andy thanks for your comments I hadn't realised they can be used both wet or dry.

As for the 8 strokes. As I said in the first post this is a transcript of a video tutorial rather than my advice, personally I probably did 50 strokes, however the knife used had not been sharpened before so it needed some extra treatment.

P

 

[addyb]

Using Arkansas stones dry, like I already said, makes a huge difference in terms of how much time is needed to hone a blade, and also the overall results. The only trouble is that the stones clog fairly easily and need to washed quite often. Still, for my money it's better than using honing oil.

Adam

 

[cariboo]

Hi.

When you have oil on your Arkansas stone the metal grindings are being held in it as you sharpen. For putting the edge on this is fine because it creates a slurry you can use. For honing in a razor edge, these steel particles chip the fine edge -- working against your honing efforts.
Clean dry Arkansas stones for sure when your honing.
Scott

 

[addyb]

Exactly, and that opinion is also shared by John Juranitch. He might be dead now, though.

 

[Andy]

Hi.
When you have oil on your Arkansas stone the metal grindings are being held in it as you sharpen. For putting the edge on this is fine because it creates a slurry you can use. For honing in a razor edge, these steel particles chip the fine edge -- working against your honing efforts.
Clean dry Arkansas stones for sure when your honing.
Scott

ahh but if there's plenty of oil floating round it might take more metal away then you clean off with a dry stone. After all a dry stone still has bits of metal knocking about on the stone. Also the oil fills the dips in the stone meaning that you might have a more even wearing away of the metal
I'm not saying one method is better then the other as I've only used oiled stones.
I just don't think that oil on the stone means you can't get a really good edge

 

[Matt Weir]

Cheers for that Pibble,

A couple of points of vaguarity cleared up for me there.

Initially I was not soaking my stones for long enough (ooo-er missus) only giving them a couple of minutes.

I was probably over enthusiastic in the number of passes I made with the blade.

I strop with the inside of my belt but always had a slight doubt whether it was the inside and not the outside.

You get a rep from me (when I work out how to )

:You_Rock_

Matt.

 

[addyb]

Off topic, but I paid my Grandparents a visit and had a look at the waterstone. I soaked it for about ten minutes and fiddled around with the SAK I have in my trouser pocket. It did a very nice job. I didn't get much of a slurry though because the edge is extremely polished anyway. Still, I was impressed.

Adam

 

[pibbleb]

Sounds like a good result!

P