Semi- poisonous plants

[falling rain]

There are some plants that are described as edible, but if eaten in too larger quantities can prove dangerous to us. In the book 'Into the wild' Chris McCandless dies from eating a plant root (can't remember which plant off the top of my head, but I think it was in the potato family) that was described as edible in his survival book, but it failed to point out that if eaten in large quntities or over a period of time it isn't good for you. I'd imagine the author wasn't aware of this, and consequently Chris became so ill that he was incapacitated and could no longer look after his needs and get out to look for food and water etc. If you havn't read the book it's a good un by the way. Anyway which plants would come under that category here in the UK. I can think of Wood sorrel and sheep sorrel because the Oxalic acid and I believe you can actually do something with Arum root although I never have as most books describe it as poisonous but is in fact in the yam family (maybe wrong on that point) and am sure I've read somewhere that you can ingest it although it needs to be very carefully prepared. I don't really mean here that people may be possibly alergic to a particular chemical like salicin in willow for example, or obviously lethals like Hemlock or Henbane, but plants that are described as edible,but could be dangerous if eaten too much of.

 

[Biddlesby]

There seems to have been lots of past debate on whether or not dandylions are edible, with various people saying they are and some saying they aren't. Perhaps this could be added to that list when eaten in large quantities.

 

[jdlenton]

good question falling rain i'll be watching this thread with interest unfortunatly i have nothing to offer in way of answers

james

 

[bambodoggy]

dies from eating a plant root that was described as edible in his survival book, but it failed to point out that if eaten in large quntities it isn't good for you. I'd imagine the author wasn't aware of this

Ain't that just the problem with people writing books who haven't had the experience of doing things themselves... I'm certainly no expert in bushcraft but the number of times I've been trying to learn something and then having been shown it properly by somebody I look back at the book and think..."well he's obviously never tried that himself....he's missed a whole load of important info out".


Fiddle heads of young ferns are supposed to be ok in small ammounts but carsonagenic in larger quanities I believe.
Another one I know of is a complete opposite....most books I've got discribe Horse Chestnuts (conkers) as poisinous but I believe if prepared properly and eaten in moderation then they are just fine to eat and where indeed a well known "famine food" in times gone by.

Bam.

 

[falling rain]

There seems to have been lots of past debate on whether or not dandylions are edible, with various people saying they are and some saying they aren't. Perhaps this could be added to that list when eaten in large quantities.

Talking about conflicting information, lesser celandine I have seen described as edible and poisonous in different books. I believe if cooked by boiling or in embers it's edible but another book which I can't remember now says NO definately poisonous as it's a memeber of the buttercup family. I've also seen conflicting information on thistles, that ALL thistles are edible and that only SOME thistles are edible

 

[falling rain]

Ain't that just the problem with people writing books who haven't had the experience of doing things themselves... I'm certainly no expert in bushcraft but the number of times I've been trying to learn something and then having been shown it properly by somebody I look back at the book and think..."well he's obviously never tried that himself....he's missed a whole load of important info out".


Fiddle heads of young ferns are supposed to be ok in small ammounts but carsonagenic in larger quanities I believe.
Another one I know of is a complete opposite....most books I've got discribe Horse Chestnuts (conkers) as poisinous but I believe if prepared properly and eaten in moderation then they are just fine to eat and where indeed a well known "famine food" in times gone by.

Bam.

Good point about the ferns fiddle heads. The Chinese and Japanese eat these as a vegetable but I believe current opinion is that they can cause throat cancer. Maybe they are a slightly different variety in Eastern Asia. Can't you make flour from conkers, or am I getting them mixed up with sweet chestnut? As far as I know sweet chestnut was introduced by the Romans and they used the nuts ground down for flour, and I think I've heard/read you can do the same with Horse chestnut (conkers) but wouldn't bet my life on it

Excellent link stickie - cheers for that. How's tricks by the way? I'll PM you.

 

[falling rain]

In the recent - Is this Pignut - thread startet by Biddesby I wrote - 'There's not a lot you can mistake pignut for but still be a little careful to check you've got the right one'

In stickies link for country lovers on Arum (lords and ladies) next to the second photo of the scraped Arum root it says - 'The starch extraction process starts by removing the smaller roots and peeling off the ***scale-like brown skin*** to reveal the starchy material inside. Make sure to remove any stalk material - it is the starch, not plant material, that is needed.

It's the 'Scale like brown skin' bit that worries me here, because pignut has this scale like brown skin too so as mentioned in the pignut thread be careful to check you've got the right one and if you're grubbing for pignuts and break the thread make absolutely sure there's no Arum about.
Wild cherry stones contain cyanide too, but I don't know if one or 20 would be needed to do you harm. Unlikely anyway as most people spit them out. The Yew berry thread we had a while back was interesting too, but I can't say I'd want to risk it myself.

 

[bambodoggy]

My first question when I hear anyone say that so and so plant is edible is whether or not they've eaten it.

Lol....that's a very good idea, must remember that one! :You_Rock_

Cheers,

Bam.

 

[ilovemybed]

Too many coconuts can be pretty dangerous. Although tasty and a good source of energy, they have a laxative effect , which leads fairly quickly to dehydration. But then concentrating on any one food source is probably dangerous. I think I heard of someone dying after eating only carrots. Too much water can even kill you.

 

[Rod]

I've always found Lofty Wiseman to be very good on plants that can be eaten, or not

As to fiddle heads - Lofty's advice is to pick 'em young, boil them and eat them as a green veg. (I found them OK). I spent a morning on an intro to bushcraft course and was told not to overdo it with wild foods as your digestive system isn't used to eating them: so too much can at least make you sick, and at worst give you the galloping trots :yikes: Not fun if you're in the bush for more than a day or so.

I find the best advice is to eat in moderation and not to get your system too reliant on any one wild food too quickly, get used to things over time.

I dare say there will be some plant foraging / ID session at the Bushmoot in July - any of you Mods able to confirm this?

hope this helps

 

[Ketchup]

fiddleheads are eaten in large amounts in the Pacific Islands (Fiji, Tonga, Niue...). I used to love them when I lived over there. They kook them 'vakalolo' (in coconut cream). The bird nest fern (Asplenium nidus -avis) was particularly popular in the kitchen

I know horse chestnuts were consumed here during the war, leached, grated and cooked.

As for arum, we used them as a practical joke. We tought the more 'talkative' eager students to munch a arum stalk ("don't swallow" we explicitely said, "just taste it") The result would be that the victim had his mouth paralysed within a few minutes, incapable of speaking for the next half hour or so.
Ah!!! the innocent jokes of youth...

 

[sxmolloy]

I must get some Arum for the Wife

 

[Pappa]

While they're not plants, I suppose it's relevant to the discussion:

I have read that eating too much rabbit can cause death by malnutrition. Rabbit meat provides less vitamins than it takes to digest, so slowly leads to vitamin deficiency (I forget which vitamin). Apparently, it was quite common for rabbit trappers to die this way. Can anyone confirm this, as I can't remember where I read it?

[Edit: I just found a quote]

"Rabbits can provide the easiest of meals but their flesh lacks fat and vitamins essential to man. The Hudson Bay Company recorded cases of trappers dying of starvation although eating well on an easily available diet of rabbit. The body uses its own vitamins and minerals to digest the rabbit and these are then passed out in the faeces. If they are not replaced weakness and other symptoms of vitamin deficiency appear. If more rabbit is eaten, the condition becomes worse. Trappers literally ate themselves to death when eating vegetation would have ensured their survival. This situation often occurs when vegetation has been buried by snow and survivors rely on rabbits for food."
From the SAS Survival Handbook by John 'Lofty' Wiseman

Pappa

 

[Ketchup]

Don't know, but I read it is unhealthy to eat too much polar bear.
The meat of polar bear contains too much vitamine A. An overdose of this vitamine can make you ill cq provoke death.

 

[led]

That's polar bear liver isn't it? Really quite toxic. Other parts appear to be quite nutritous

 

[jdlenton]

While they're not plants, I suppose it's relevant to the discussion:

I have read that eating too much rabbit can cause death by malnutrition. Rabbit meat provides less vitamins than it takes to digest, so slowly leads to vitamin deficiency (I forget which vitamin). Apparently, it was quite common for rabbit trappers to die this way. Can anyone confirm this, as I can't remember where I read it?

[Edit: I just found a quote]


Pappa

yes i can confirm this is true i believe the Indians have folk lore about eating too much snow shoe hare the there are records of frontiers men dieing in this way

if we wait Stuart should be along soon and he can do the science bit

James

 

[Seagull]

Yeah, this thread has me "all ears" with interest , as I have but little knowledge,beyond plant books.

Even after stumbling through the Latin words and likely sites, I can,t help but think that I,ld need to be at the very brink, before I tried my hand at wild veg.

Knowledge, as ever, is the key to understanding, so, I will be a miserable bu88er again, and caution that no-one attempt any experiments, without really knowing the form and procedures.

And, best of luck to them.
I get the heebies just thinking that dogs may have wee,d on the edible fungi!

As for the Polar bear, yes, well, sailors used to get warned off their livers, in the Pilot Books. Again, I would need to be ploddy desparate to be looking at eight foot of bear, in the sure knowledge that he had ,in mind, the same thought as me!

Nettle tea anyone? Or, even Stickie,s rabbit alternative...yuck!

Ceeg

 

[Ketchup]

That's polar bear liver isn't it? Really quite toxic. Other parts appear to be quite nutritous

I stand corrected. Where can I buy a Lb or two?

 

[BOD]

...am sure I've read somewhere that you can ingest it although it needs to be very carefully prepared. .

Skin cut off and discard. Boil rest to break down the cyanide - I believe.

A problem also is that "yam" is used to describe a number of different plants

 

[locum76]

There seems to have been lots of past debate on whether or not dandylions are edible, with various people saying they are and some saying they aren't. Perhaps this could be added to that list when eaten in large quantities.

dandilions are edible and can be a very tasty addition to a salad, no cooking is neccessary. the only problem is that they are diuretic. this is why the french call dandilions 'pee the bed'.

comfrey is a grey area though - comfrey contains a lot of oxalic acid but i know people who have eaten it and used it in some way for medicinal purposes.