POLL: Should bushcraft get professional?

[Firebringer]

I'm saying no but I think all bushcrafters should be required to wear a helmet.

A good old fashioned pith helmet perhaps, to remind us all of the good old days before the colonials started their treasonous insurrections against the lawful authority of the crown.

Does anyone know if any foreign state uses certificates for Bushcrafters?

 

[Melonfish]

if we restrict access to people who've been trained what about those that can't afford to be trained, or those that are interested in learning but don't know where to start?

what about the people who just want to enjoy the countryside without the hassle of having to jump through hoops.
emphatic "No" on this one i'm afraid, i understand where your coming from but no thanks.

 

[teflon]

...what about the people who just want to enjoy the countryside without the hassle of having to jump through hoops...

Exactly - because the very nature of this is all about exclusion, not protection. I personally want to learn by my own mistakes. I don't want a certificate. I mean, where would I hang it? On a tree?

If I take myself off somewhere, I want to be alone and not have some nazi creeping up on me in the woods to see if I'm doing it right. They wanna see a badge? Well I've got one - and it says f**k off. 8]

 

[Tiley]

Thinking about it a bit more, you can argue that it already is professional: there are folk out there who make a living from it in bushcraft schools and retailers. What hasn't happened is all the different schools getting together to agree on what is required to become an instructor. This has happened in the climbing community with the various awards from ML up to IFMGA but that hasn't stopped the vast majority of climbers who do it for the love of the activity getting out there and nipping up routes.

I don't understand quite why people on this discussion are getting so unnecessarily heated about it. When ideas like people popping out from behind a tree to check your fire and words like 'nazi' are bandied about, it seems that folk are beginning to bark up the wrong Fagus sylvatica.

As with the climbing fraternity, I don't see that having a universally agreed professional qualification would be harmful - it might even improve the quality of teaching that clients who want to go on courses receive. If it is that that we're talking about, then amateurs (i.e. the VAST majority of us) have nothing to fear - we'll be able to carry on as before, learning from our mistakes (assuming they're not massive blunders!) and enjoying - and looking after - the countryside and woods we love so much.

 

[tobes01]

I guess our big problem would be who accredits the trainers? In safety-critical sports such as diving or climbing, there's a clear need for common standards so that folk can move between different clubs and trust each others' skills wherever they are.

My point with the original (not well-worded) idea was that a simple certificate that says "This person's shown that they're capable of not screwing up your land (although we can't promise they won't)" might assist with land access. Not an issue for those of us who already have such access, but useful for those who are struggling?

Tobes

 

[Big Geordie]

No.

We can all cite evidence of "mission creep" in our lives. At one point something seems sensible & helpful, then it becomes mandatory.. or no access at all. Look at how knife legislation is going.

And the principle behind it? What motivates the original author? Is it an attempt to limit the use of woods to select groups of people? That goes against what many us believe to be the ethos of bushcraft freedom. We also know that certification/ licences can never be relied upon to alter behaviour.

OH NOOOOO :aargh4: :aargh4: :aargh4: :aargh4:
G

 

[hog]

One of the joys of bushcraft is you dont need a certificate signed by someone who thinks they are the best.

 

[Draven]

Figured I'd chime in again because I'm currently having an issue with the standardisation of another traditional skill...

Archery! Nice, big bits of open land behind my house I can't shoot on because of the yobs in the area, and my local archery club requires £110 to join plus I have to be a GNAS member which averages about £100 per year I need to make friends with a farmer, methinks.

Certainly hope nobody tries this nonsense with Bushcraft.

 

[rik_uk3]

NO

What next, certificates to use a caravan, use a tent, book into a hotel in an appropriate manner?

Ridiculous idea.

 

[Karl5]

I'm saying no but I think all bushcrafters should be required to wear a helmet.

One of these would certainly make bushcrafters stand out from the crowd, thereby giving us more of a group identity.
And at the same time showing that we're all "Safety First" minded.

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/ Karl

 

[spamel]

What would it achieve? Nothing but lining the pockets of the people who test and examine those applying for the licence. Even if you do get the licence, doesn't mean you will play by the rules. Look at how many licensed drivers get points for speeding. They are breaking the law, no two ways about it yet they have a licence saying they are responsible and worthy to drive on our roads. A licence doesn't mean anything.

I have three points by the way, just in case any habitual speeders take umbrage at me using them as an example!

 

[Pandabean]

I say no, as people have said when the government get wind of this there will be all sorts happening. Tax etc. Then there will be the Health and Safety brigade coming along and taking away our sharps and giving us machines where all we have to do is push a button and the wood will be carved into nice finished pieces all that without getting a splinter or cut. Axes wont be able to be used unless you have two people watching, one of them being first aid trained and the other making sure your posture is correct. And think about the landowner who will be worried about getting sued. Sorry getting carried away now.

If you have someone take the test and get the certificate whats to stop them from doing the opposite of what they did on the course? Nothing. They may just do the course to get the certificate to get access to land and then have a massive fire festival on that land.

 

[Hoodoo]

One of these would certainly make bushcrafters stand out from the crowd, thereby giving us more of a group identity.
And at the same time showing that we're all "Safety First" minded.

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/ Karl

That would be a good one for bear country.

 

[spamel]

That would be a good one for bear country.

Why, is that a long standing tradition at Eton?

 

[teflon]

Had to Google 'Fagus sylvatica'. Does that mean I failed the 'tree test' and I'm now banned from the woods? Sorry - couldn't resist. 8]

 

[Tiley]

Had to Google 'Fagus sylvatica'. Does that mean I failed the 'tree test' and I'm now banned from the woods? Sorry - couldn't resist. 8]

Ha! Not just banned from the woods but to be beaten with branches of Ilex aquifolium if you're seen even looking at a tree in a peculiar way...

 

[charadeur]

I vote no. Can't there be anything in my life that no one tries to consumerize? I feel like we suffer enough from afluenza as it is.

 

[Leigh Robinson]

Having just copleted the excellent Woodcraft School instructor's course, I'm shooting myself in the foot here.

I agree that bushcraft is all about independence, freedom to do what you will in the woods and so on but where instructors and companies supplying tuition can help is in developing a keener sense of preserving the woods in which we play. With ever increasing numbers of us all wanting to live that bushcraft dream and with less and less readily accessible woodland available for us to pursue our activity, it is increasingly important that we look after the assets that we do have so that they are there for the future.

Everyone enjoys a fire, making a shelter, having a brew in the woods, spending a few nights there but all this has an impact. I am not suggesting that companies and/or professionals are the only people who can ensure the long term welfare of the woodlands but, with a burgeoning number of people going off to do courses and then launching themselves into the forests under their own steam, it is vital that some aspect of conservation and preservation is taught by 'schools' giving instruction on bushcraft.

I've drifted off the point somewhat. Should bushcraft go professional? No - that is the very antithesis of the activity. Should the various schools continue to do what they do? Yes, absolutely. The poor providers will soon go to the wall; in the meantime, the good ones should make sure the their conservation ethos is, as far as possible, faultless.

looking at the original post and replying to it, trying to not get sidelined:
Independence, freedom and the will to do what you want in the woods. Cannot come from legislation. More rules do not equal more freedoms. The only people who will do a certified course are the ones that already have respect for the woods. Do the people who use my woods as a quad/motor cross track have any interest in paying for a course telling them not to rip the woods up? Of course not.

Instructors and companies helping to develop woodland preservation values - At a cost? You would be preaching to the converted. You want to get to the people who are most likely to damage woodland? Teach in schools, run workshops, Teach to the underprivileged, teach to the estate kids, teach to those with drug, alcohol, mental health. All those hard to reach groups that would not have the money or inclination to pay for a course but will still use the woods freely and how they want to.

You want people to respect and look after the woods? Give them a sense of ownership and responsibility.

If the State or other Organisations can't do this. Give me the freedom to take my kids to the woods and teach these values myself without the fear of prosecution.

 

[Toddy]

Oh very well said

atb,
Toddy

 

[smoggy]

....and how would the land owner know what the chuff this certificate was or was not?

smoggy