Planting with the Moon Phases

[Pandabean]

I was recommended In Tune with the Moon book by a friend on here and I must say I bought it and accidently forgot about it (Sorry Doug). Now I am quite a bit along with the crops. Not doing to great this year with a few things. The strawberry plants are now to old and we have quite alot of bad ones so time to replant I guess and the peas are coming along slowly.

I was wondering if anyone else on here has tried this and if there is any basis for how it works?
It does have a few oddities like when it is best to get a hair cut, but there is quite alot on growing/harvesting by the moon phases.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Tune-With-M...5738/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1342691260&sr=8-3

I wonder if this is something that most of us have forgotten in our busy lifes and when coming to grow plants/food, that there are natural cycles on the planet and doing certain things at certain times seems to help.

 

[ged]

... I wonder if this is something that most of us have forgotten ...

Certainly there's a lot that we've collectively forgotten, and there's a lot that's baseless superstition and folklore and is better forgotten -- or never taught in the first place.

I don't know which parts of this stuff fall into which category, but the guy who made the window frames and doors for my place in France is adamant that to have the right properties for his purposes, wood must be cut at the right phase of the moon. He calls it "la belle lune".

 

[HillBill]

Yeah i harvest crops by the moon. Its all to do with moisture content and where the moisture is within the plant.

For example, At full moon or approaching full moon the moisture in the plants will all be high in the plant so this is the best time to pick fruiting plants for best flavour, its also the best time to pick roots for storage. When the moon is waning the moisture drops lower in the plants and is the best time to harvest root crops for eating.

Its not a complicated thing, its just based on the moons effect on water/moisture on earth.

 

[Pandabean]

Yeh Ged, I know what you mean. Some of the stuff that comes out nowadays has been a recent invention. New age stuff. But there are some things that seem to have been passed down through the ages that still remain with us.
Interestingly in that book it also mentions something about the best time to chop wood. I will have to have a look at it again and see what it says.

HB, have you got any other examples of using the moon?

Its one of these subjects that fascinate me but I never get around to investigating it further.

 

[wattsy]

the best time to pick fruit and veg is when they are ready. if i see a crop of strawberries all big fat and juicy i'm not going to wait for the moon to tell me to go and pick them, might as well start sacrificing chickens as well

 

[HillBill]

the best time to pick fruit and veg is when they are ready. if i see a crop of strawberries all big fat and juicy i'm not going to wait for the moon to tell me to go and pick them, might as well start sacrificing chickens as well

You will find that they are ready mainly when the moon is in the ascent. Its the gravitational pull drawing the energy/moisture up through the plant that forces them to ripen. The energy is directed up and outwards which causes growth. In the 2 weeks the moon is in the descent, the top growth slows down and root growth increases. Simple facts on how the moon affects water on the planet.

Wattsy, you always extend an argument into silly proportions, its not needed, nor wanted. If you don't understand something then thats fine, but it doesnt mean others don't. You shouldn't mock that which you don't understand. Its the sign of weak character.

Humanity has planted by the moon for millenia, the knowledge has been mainly forgotten over here, but that doesn't mean the knowledge was bad.

Its a fact that the moon has an effect on moisture here on earth, it controls the tides after all. Its a fact that plants are a very high % of moisture, so the moon will effect it.

Pandabean - I mainly harvest by the moon phase and plant by it too. Planting works in the same way as harvesting. Seeds should be planted just before a new moon so that over the next 2 weeks all the energy is being drawn upwards so the seeds will sprout quickly and emerge from the soil, then they will settle for a couple of weeks and grow strong roots while the moon is in the descent. When taking cuttings you should do it just after full moon, so that the energy will be being drawn down through the plant and encouraging root growth. Its really very simple and is totally based around the rise and fall of the energy/moisture within the plant.

The wood to be cut at a certain time will also be based on this principle. At certain times of the month the moisture content in the wood will be less than at other times. There may be a time in the annual lunar calendar when the moon is at its furthest point from earth and this would be the ideal time ( in conjuction with the moons descent) to cut wood as the wood will never have a lower moisture content while its still alive. The difference in seasoning times could be massive.

I've never really paid any attention to it but i bet the birch sap rises in conjunction with the rising moon too. It only rises properly for a good couple of weeks so this supports the theory.

Just a thought, but where is the moon normally during the spring and autumn equinox?

Also, i've been noting that my plants are actually growing at night rather than during the day, they rest during the day, gathering energy from the sun and put that energy into growth during the night. This year i have been marking off the heights of the plants ( specifically to check growth spurts in conjunction with moon phase) But have also noted the day/ night growth cycle.

If you have an iphone or mac there is an app called deluxe moon thats well worth getting.

New moon was yesterday, watch your plants over the next 2 weeks, especially with all the rain we have been having. They should go for gold.

 

[wattsy]

You will find that they are ready mainly when the moon is in the ascent. Its the gravitational pull drawing the energy/moisture up through the plant that forces them to ripen. The energy is directed up and outwards which causes growth. In the 2 weeks the moon is in the descent, the top growth slows down and root growth increases. Simple facts on how the moon affects water on the planet.

not really the Earth spins every 24 hours so logically every day the moon is at some point above and at some point below a plant, whereupon the gravity from the moon could exert an effect on molecules in the plant. I get that, and I believe that it probably does have an effect on a plant. However, that happens every day, and basing sowing and growing by the moon being 'in the ascent or descent' is pseudo-science. the portion of the moon that's visible changes day to day, but not its mass. the only references I can find to moon ascent and descent is on astrology websites

 

[HillBill]

Moon planting is an old art that was used extensively. When those folk growing their food had to survive on their food, then it makes no sense to use a method that doesnt work. They would have used the most effective method, this was it. I'm relatively new to lunar gardeneing so i'm no means an expert. You can succesfully grow crops in disregard to lunar phases. But its just better to go with it. Harvesting crops for storage when moisture content is lower, harvesting fruits and surface crops for eating when the moisture content is higher and all the nutrients are in the leaves and fruits ( jucier berries, more flavourful and healthier foods) etc etc.

 

[mrcharly]

not really the Earth spins every 24 hours so logically every day the moon is at some point above and at some point below a plant, whereupon the gravity from the moon could exert an effect on molecules in the plant. I get that, and I believe that it probably does have an effect on a plant. However, that happens every day, and basing sowing and growing by the moon being 'in the ascent or descent' is pseudo-science. the portion of the moon that's visible changes day to day, but not its mass. the only references I can find to moon ascent and descent is on astrology websites

I suggest you look up 'spring' and 'neap' tides. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_tide#Range_variation:_springs_and_neaps

Whether the moon affects plants growing and sap, I have no idea. But it is a simple fact that the moon affects things on the earth.

 

[HillBill]

From the article that mrcharley posted

The semi-diurnal range (the difference in height between high and low waters over about half a day) varies in a two-week cycle. Approximately twice a month, around new moon and full moon when the Sun, Moon and Earth form a line (a condition known as syzygy[SUP][8][/SUP]) the tidal force due to the sun reinforces that due to the Moon. The tide's range is then at its maximum: this is called the spring tide, or just springs. It is not named after the season but, like that word, derives from the meaning "jump, burst forth, rise", as in a natural spring.
When the Moon is at first quarter or third quarter, the sun and Moon are separated by 90° when viewed from the Earth, and the solar tidal force partially cancels the Moon's. At these points in the lunar cycle, the tide's range is at its minimum: this is called the neap tide, or neaps (a word of uncertain origin).
Spring tides result in high waters that are higher than average, low waters that are lower than average, 'slack water' time that is shorter than average and stronger tidal currents than average


This is basically saying the same as what i am, only it refers to tides, but it is the same thing that effects the planting/harvesting schedule.

not really the Earth spins every 24 hours so logically every day the moon is at some point above and at some point below a plant, whereupon the gravity from the moon could exert an effect on molecules in the plant. I get that, and I believe that it probably does have an effect on a plant. However, that happens every day, and basing sowing and growing by the moon being 'in the ascent or descent' is pseudo-science. the portion of the moon that's visible changes day to day, but not its mass. the only references I can find to moon ascent and descent is on astrology websites

 

[sandbender]

Over in Transylvania, where a few folk are still working the land as they have done for the past few hundred years there is some 'superstition' regarding the moon and the ideal time to sow. I cannot comment having had no direct experience of any results. However many of my near relatives were Police officers, mostly in and around Edinburgh. It was a common thought that they all held to that a night shift during the full moon was ALWAYS a very interesting night shift.

 

[zarkwon]

I've never seen you take contrary evidence without attempting to co-opt it into your pseudoscientific view HillBill. The article mrcharlie posted does not say, basically what you were saying. There is no way the gravitational effect of the moon can have the described effects on water in plants. The moon only affects unbounded bodies of water, while the water in plants is bounded. The lunar tidal force is a very weak force (a mosquito on your arm would exert more gravitational pull on that arm than the moon does), certainly not enough to overwhelm plant capillary action.
The tidal force of the moon on the earth depends on its distance from earth, not its phase. Whereas the synodic period is 29.53 days, it takes 27.5 days for the moon to move in its elliptical orbit from perigee to perigee (or apogee to apogee). Perigee (when the moon is closest to earth) can occur at any phase of the synodic cycle. Higher tides do occur at new and full moons, but not because the moon's gravitational pull is stronger at those times. Rather, the tides are higher then because the sun, earth, and moon are in a line and the tidal force of the sun joins that of the moon at those times to produce higher tides.
The idea of "planting with moon phases" is pseudoscience.

 

[HillBill]

Well, whichever you way you want to paint it, whether its sun and moon in combo it makes no difference to the effect it has on water on this planet. At new and full moon the water levels on this planet are affected, they rise and fall. This affects the cropping and planting of plants. The indications are in the moon phases then....that better for you? Its all cycles within cycles. The plants respond to it, my own studies show this. History tells us that humanity believed it for millenia. I believe it now.

 

[zarkwon]

What do the plants respond to? You now seem to be moving the goalposts to say that the plants are responding to tidal changes outside of themselves (in the earth's seas and oceans) rather than the moon directly causing tidal changes inside the plants capillary system as you said before? How do the oceans' tides affect cropping and planting?

My last post explains why the phases of the moon are not indicators of tidal strength. It's not all 'cycles within cycles'. That is exactly the kind of imprecise, vague soundbite I would expect to hear as a defense of pseudoscience.

 

[HillBill]

Not really, you just expect every little detail explained and if someone cant explain every detail then they must be wrong. You seem to have an OCD with anything not yet included in science, you inhabit debunking forums and are generally an bottom to anyone who doesnt share your view.

You cant prove the plants dont respond to it, yet you come on here throwing opinion around as though you can. Are you even a gardener? Somehow i doubt it.

Nowhere did i mention tidal strength so you are debating with yourself - yet again i might add, you are also talking about tides as though they are a seperate thing to what i'm talking about. You are looking at effect, not cause. How can the tides effect the moisture levels in plants? they dont, its the thing which affects the tides which affects the plants.

It is all cycles within cycles mate, the discussion isnt about those though so why would i go into length about it?

Remove your head from the bottom of science for a few minutes, the world smells much sweeter.

What do the plants respond to? You now seem to be moving the goalposts to say that the plants are responding to tidal changes outside of themselves (in the earth's seas and oceans) rather than the moon directly causing tidal changes inside the plants capillary system as you said before? How do the oceans' tides affect cropping and planting?

My last post explains why the phases of the moon are not indicators of tidal strength. It's not all 'cycles within cycles'. That is exactly the kind of imprecise, vague soundbite I would expect to hear as a defense of pseudoscience.

 

[HillBill]

I've noticed the full moon comment on here on a few occasions in relation to "hot headed" behaviour. If what your friends say is accurate, then there could be a genuine correlation to full moon and the rise in moisture leading to "hot headedness" in people. Its only a thought and i'm not saying its fact, but those werewolf stories came from somewhere lol

Over in Transylvania, where a few folk are still working the land as they have done for the past few hundred years there is some 'superstition' regarding the moon and the ideal time to sow. I cannot comment having had no direct experience of any results. However many of my near relatives were Police officers, mostly in and around Edinburgh. It was a common thought that they all held to that a night shift during the full moon was ALWAYS a very interesting night shift.

 

[woodspirits]

Remove your head from the bottom of science for a few minutes, the world smells much sweeter.

 

[mountainm]

Some evidence points to it being more to do with light than gravity. Perhaps you're all howling up the wrong tree.

http://www.howplantswork.com/2009/07/25/does-the-moon-affect-plants-part-2-moonlight-and-biorhythms/

 

[HillBill]

You could be right. If the time of heightened growth peaks with a full moon, then it could be the extra light that the plants are gaining the upper hand with, or perhaps a combination of the two? Hmmm, gonna have to do some reading on this. Much obliged.

Some evidence points to it being more to do with light than gravity. Perhaps you're all howling up the wrong tree.

http://www.howplantswork.com/2009/07/25/does-the-moon-affect-plants-part-2-moonlight-and-biorhythms/

 

[zarkwon]

You did talk about tidal strength. Let me draw your attention to this bit of nonsense:-

"You will find that they are ready mainly when the moon is in the ascent. Its the gravitational pull drawing the energy/moisture up through the plant that forces them to ripen. The energy is directed up and outwards which causes growth. In the 2 weeks the moon is in the descent, the top growth slows down and root growth increases. Simple facts on how the moon affects water on the planet."

That is what you said. I'm not even going into what "energy" you might be talking about (the mind boggles). You are here talking about tidal strength. You do recognise that as being what you wrote I take it?

Let's try again. How does the moon affect the plant? By what mechanism?

I think the problem is that I don't know what the flip you're talking about and neither do you. You seem to have a problem with science as though it is spoiling things with all it's measurements and rigid constraints. Science is just the asking and testing of questions in a structured way so as to avoid the pitfall of surmising spurious clap trap from our so called common sense as has been demonstrated admirably as being a phenomenon by you in this thread.

The burden of proof lies with the proponent of the theory. I don't need to prove it doesn't work (although I could have a blooming good go) any more than I need to prove there is no such thing as an invisible pink unicorn if you say there is. I believe I am entitled to my opinions on the OP just as you are. Although in my opinion you should be the exception.