Little Bow n Arrow help

[xairbourne]

I have just volunteered my services for the local Duke of Edinburgh scheme, the lads are really keen and up for learning survival skills and bush craft skills. One of the things they requested is making a bow and arrow. Now as a kid I just used the holly to make mine very basic. If anyone can help me with a good basic easy first time set up to teach the lads while out in the woods I would be very grateful. (and pics would be nice)

 

[yarrow]

Tiz a very deep subject, for basics have a look here. http://www.xsorbit4.com/users/buildabow/index.cgi?board=FTB
Try making a few first, also try and get hold of a copy of The Bowyers Bible, full of tips.

All the best
Yarrow.

 

[xairbourne]

Cheers i will make a point of looking out for it

 

[torjusg]

I demonstrated bowmaking to a bunch of kids last summer. We used proper staves from elm and ash. That was just a waste of materials and time. I had to carve out most of the bows, in order to finish them in time. My advice is: Make simple branch bows, they are more than good enough. The older ones can make proper ones, but if they are under 12 years, don't bother.

Make simple one day arrows on a fire. Very easy and fun. Fletch them with grass. A point for them is probably that they feel like they could make some more arrows when they loose the ones they make at the course.

Torjus Gaaren

 

[xairbourne]

Thats what i had in mind just keep it simple due to the time limit (one night), if they do get in to it then maybe take time and point them in the way of making a better one.

 

[Ogri the trog]

I know its not exactly a bow and arrows,
But how about skewing the lesson into an "atlatl" they must be easier to make in just one night.

Just a thought.

Ogri the trog

 

[stovie]

The atlatl is a good idea 9dutch arrows we called them as kids). hazel wand, card fletch slid into cut at end and tied with a bit of cordage (natural or otherwise). To launch use string about the length of the dart, with a knot in one end. Wrapped around the shaft with the string placed over the knot and pulled tight. Hours of fun.

If they insist on bows, branch bundles are probably your best bet. Hazel again for ease of cutting and bundling. Arrows from hazel will work too.

I agree about staying away from carving for such a short space of time, unless there are some older ones can manage.

 

[C_Claycomb]

I would avoid trying to teach bow making to a group like that. I have tried showing both adults and kids to make a bamboo bow, as shown in the crafts area, or Stovie's version. I was really amazed at how hard it was to explain what I took to be simple tasks, and that bow required little in the way of tool use, just cut cane to length and lash together. Maybe using duct tape would have been easier.

After the bow, you need to make the string. This is comparably easy when using pre-waxed Dacron bow string material, but still requires a little knowledge and ability at cordage making. Again I have been amazed at how hard it can be to explain how to twist in a flemish style loop.

Anyway, a bow is way way way way down the list of things that you might want or need to make in the wilderness. A atlatl is a much more useable item.

 

[torjusg]

Anyway, a bow is way way way way down the list of things that you might want or need to make in the wilderness. A atlatl is a much more useable item.

Don't agree with you there Chris. First of all, get hay bale string and you don't have to make strings. And if one keep it simple a branch doesn't need much carving to make a suitable bow.

In a survival situation, I would prefer something I could hit a target with. I think that is a little easier with a bow than an atlatl, though I have never tried the latter.

Torjus Gaaren

 

[Salix]

I know its not exactly a bow and arrows,
But how about skewing the lesson into an "atlatl" they must be easier to make in just one night.

Just a thought.

Ogri the trog

Ogri you beaut

Iv'e been fagging my brain for the name for ages, I used ti make them with my kids at work out of hazel, and they loved it. I made one recently out of a broom handle, but couldn't remember the name for my colleagues.....................i said it would come to me...................................given enough time

mark

 

[xairbourne]

Thanks chaps :You_Rock_

 

[C_Claycomb]

Torjus,
Well, if someone were to hand me a bow, vs an atlatl I would go for the bow because it is something that I have used and am more familiar with. I am not however practiced enough to use one for hunting anything but large, dumb, animals

I have read, from several sources, that the action of throwing a spear with enough accuracy to hunt is more easily aquired, for a novice, than shooting a bow. I can't speak about the atlatl from personal experience, but having watched beginners try to hit a straw boss from 10m with an arrow, I wouldn't be surprised.

I think you are mixing your situations a little. If it is a survival situation, and you are close enough to find baling twine, do you need to hunt, or could you not just walk to the farm? If you happen to be carrying the twine, see next paragraph...

Lastly, I have been following Stuart's excellent articles and talks about the body's energy needs and when combined with my experience of hunting, I would say that trying to build a bow plus all the trimmings, even a really basic one, then go hunting with it, would be a very poor way of meeting your dietary requirements.

Trapping is more efficient for getting food. I don't see any need to learn bow craft as a "survival skill". Making and shooting bows is enough fun that I don't think it needs to have any false tags attacthed to make it worth doing. I just reckon that if you are going to do it, do it properly, or not at all. What is the point of showing youngsters how to make a "bushcraft survival" bow, if the whys and hows are neither bushcraft, nor survival?

Anyway, its probably better not to pay any attention to me on this. I have already been told that I have a rather unique way of looking at this sort of thing.

xairbourne,
Whatever you decide to make, be sure you have practiced it, exactly like you will demo, before doing the demo. There is nothing so disconcerting as trying to make changes on the fly with a group asking questions!

 

[xairbourne]

Trapping was an option but they didn’t seem so keen on the killing and gutting of wild animals which is understandable I don’t want to mentally scar them on there first trip out with us.
Im just thinking along the line of a holly or hazel staff n arrows with the bailing twine that’s been mentioned.
I may show a few trapping options but im not going to leave them out (just to show them). Head shot from my S410 is my preferred option but no guns allowed. :AR15firin
But thanks agian you have been most helpful

 

[Woods Wanderer]

a real easy bow is in the bowyers bible easyer than the lashed sticks bow take two sticks with a very obveose taper the thick ends being 1 inch thick the thin 1 cm thick now carve a taper/slope on the thick ends hold both thick ends together with the carved tapers like this// the carved tapers need to be about 15 cm long now lash together now cut notches on the thin ends and string (but string it low about 4to5 inchs) hope that helps

 

[torjusg]

I think you are mixing your situations a little. If it is a survival situation, and you are close enough to find baling twine, do you need to hunt, or could you not just walk to the farm? If you happen to be carrying the twine, see next paragraph...

That about bailing twine was really a statement seperate of the comment directed at you. Managed to mix the order of the sentences up a bit. I am of course aware that one has to be capable of making usable bowstrings (which is perhaps the greatest challenge) if one is to rely on a bow in a survival situation.

The bailing twine was a suggestion to xairbourne. Easy strings for kids.

Torjus Gaaren

 

[C_Claycomb]

Sorry, my mistake.

Making spring traps is always good fun. They aren't legal, but they are something that is much easier for people go get on with, and not so demanding on tool use.....and you don't have to let them catch anything.