Knife making

[Spunyarn]

I know a little about woodwork, and a little metalwork, and have some experience with both. My father has a workshop of tools, so space, and tools aren't a problem.

I've read a bit about knifemaking. Making a handle, and attaching a blade is pretty straightforward, but I'd like to make a blade too.

I know mild steel is usually avoided as it is so soft that it needs resharpening often, however it's nice and cheap, and might be good for me making my first one, as if it goes well, I'll use it to show friends more than cut stuff, and if it goes terribly, then it's not cost so much to waste.

Two questions though;
I'd like to make the handle out of wood I find, but in the interest of being green, where do I get my wood from within nature? I don't want to pick up fallen wood, as it may be rotting or infested. I don't want to cut it necessarily as it's naughty. So if I walk into a woods, what sort of wood am I looking for to make a handle, and where do I find it?
Also, can you buy knife blades by themselves? As I'm thinking of making a few handles, attaching them to pre-bought blades, and giving them as gifts?

Cheers in advance chaps

 

[Dannytsg]

You would be better off buying wood that is pre cut for making handle scales until you get the hang of the process. You can also buy blade blanks. Just search for "knife blade blank" in google and you will find a few websites that offer them.

 

[Angst]

hi....dont cut and use green wood....as a general rule (as far as i've been told) green wood needs to be air dried about a year per inch of thickness....go on ebay and search for knife scales....most has been kiln dried for quickness....

if you want good cheap steel try cromwells ground flat stock

and for a 'handling' tutorial google mammoth blades

or if you want to buy a cheap and good quality ready to go blade theres this....

http://www.ronniesunshines.com/mora-scandvik-12c27-knife-blank-1.html

just 20 minutes ago i nearly cut my arm off with one of these blades at the essential stage of cleaning the leading edge and blade with alcohol...not fun trying to finish a blade off one-handed and with blood squirting in your eye (come on hillbill....wade in!!! i expect no sympathy this time....just a ton of grief....lol!)...the alcohol in it hurt more than the cut!

 

[swright81076]

There used to be a place called 'good timber' who sold bowl and pen blanks.
I bought quite some a few years ago. They were nice and cheap.

As for green wood, I once turned a piece of green walnut to a bowl. Within a few weeks it looked like someone had melted an old vinyl lp.

sent from my Jelly Bean'd galaxy nexus.

 

[Angst]

.....and i ate it with a nice chianti....

There used to be a place called 'good timber' who sold bowl and pen blanks.
I bought quite some a few years ago. They were nice and cheap.

As for green wood, I once turned a piece of green walnut to a bowl. Within a few weeks it looked like someone had melted an old vinyl lp.

sent from my Jelly Bean'd galaxy nexus.

 

[Ogri the trog]

Greenpete, a highly regarded member here, had a series of four videos about knife making, they used to be on Youtube but I believe they messed him about over them and they are now available on his website - http://www.greenpete.co.uk/knife-making/knife-making-video/

As to your scale query, I use broken axe/hammer shafts or recycled woods sourced from anywhere I can get them - already seasoned, already cut and used and ready to be used again for another project.

Go careful though, knife making does get very addictive very quickly!

ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[HillBill]

Can't lose concentration for a second mate with this game, you were lucky
I've only cut myself once, on a little carver when i was hand sanding the handle. I was gripping the masking tape and the blade came out of it when i was sanding and stabbed straight through my left thumb. All good fun lol.

just 20 minutes ago i nearly cut my arm off with one of these blades at the essential stage of cleaning the leading edge and blade with alcohol...not fun trying to finish a blade off one-handed and with blood squirting in your eye (come on hillbill....wade in!!! i expect no sympathy this time....just a ton of grief....lol!)...the alcohol in it hurt more than the cut!

 

[HillBill]

Two questions though;
I'd like to make the handle out of wood I find, but in the interest of being green, where do I get my wood from within nature? I don't want to pick up fallen wood, as it may be rotting or infested. I don't want to cut it necessarily as it's naughty. So if I walk into a woods, what sort of wood am I looking for to make a handle, and where do I find it?
Also, can you buy knife blades by themselves? As I'm thinking of making a few handles, attaching them to pre-bought blades, and giving them as gifts?

Cheers in advance chaps

Firstly, nothing wrong with cutting branches from live trees. It does no harm as long as the cut is clean and at the area where the branch joins another. Some trees positively benefit from it.

Dead standing wood is your best bet for pre-seasoned. Any species will do, though the harder the better, so Oak, Yew, Ash, Birch, Beech etc will all do the job. Avoid pines if possible and protect the steel with a liner between wood and metal if poss as some woods are detrimental to the steel. Oak being a prime example of this due to the tannin content.

Yep you can buy blades, there are a few good makers on here who can make you one or you can buy online. Depends what you want really.

 

[Angst]

yup yup....first time i've cut meself.....happened so quick and dont really even know how it happened....barely felt it....now gotta have a bath in a minute....gonna be fun not!....for a split second i thought it was a hospital job....the fat is actually hanging out this morning....do i get noob of the week award?

and ta for info on the oak/tannin thing....a friend of mine (he does heavy timber framing) mentioned it when he gave me the oak scales that are on the (nasty) blade that cut me....and thanks for the link ogri.....will check out later,

a

 

[Perrari]

I wouldnt bother with mild steel, it is just too soft it will be a useless knife, the edge will blunt instantly. You could use mild steel just to practice shaping & grinding the blade, but I cant see the point of fitting a handle to it as it would never be a good knife.
Whatever wood you use it needs to be seasoned otherwise as it dries out it will shrink & the pins will be proud and the steel will be proud of the sides of the handle resulting in an ugly knife.
O1 tool steel is not as expensive as people think, but you need to be able to heat treat it otherwise it is no better than mild steel.
Look at this http://www.buckandhickman.com/find/keyword-is-ground+flat+stock/Thickness-is-3/product-is-233745 it's + VAT + Shipping(Probably around £13-£14 total) You could make 2 woodlore sized knives from it or 3-4 smaller knives. I suggest that you start with smaller knives as your results will be better, then work up to larger knives.

Alternatively buy a cheap blank to start with then get a custom blank later when you get the hang of it. Heinnie do some reasonably priced stainless blanks.

I know a little about woodwork, and a little metalwork, and have some experience with both. My father has a workshop of tools, so space, and tools aren't a problem.

I've read a bit about knifemaking. Making a handle, and attaching a blade is pretty straightforward, but I'd like to make a blade too.

I know mild steel is usually avoided as it is so soft that it needs resharpening often, however it's nice and cheap, and might be good for me making my first one, as if it goes well, I'll use it to show friends more than cut stuff, and if it goes terribly, then it's not cost so much to waste.

Two questions though;
I'd like to make the handle out of wood I find, but in the interest of being green, where do I get my wood from within nature? I don't want to pick up fallen wood, as it may be rotting or infested. I don't want to cut it necessarily as it's naughty. So if I walk into a woods, what sort of wood am I looking for to make a handle, and where do I find it?
Also, can you buy knife blades by themselves? As I'm thinking of making a few handles, attaching them to pre-bought blades, and giving them as gifts?

Cheers in advance chaps

 

[Perrari]

OOPS ! Calamity Angst strikes again. Sewing machinists reckon you are not a 'proper' machinist until you have had a needle through your finger. Maybe that theory could be applied here ?
Not to worry though mate, it's all part of the learning curve. At the end of the day if you play with knives you are bound to get hurt at some point.
Eifion

hi....dont cut and use green wood....as a general rule (as far as i've been told) green wood needs to be air dried about a year per inch of thickness....go on ebay and search for knife scales....most has been kiln dried for quickness....

if you want good cheap steel try cromwells ground flat stock

and for a 'handling' tutorial google mammoth blades

or if you want to buy a cheap and good quality ready to go blade theres this....

http://www.ronniesunshines.com/mora-scandvik-12c27-knife-blank-1.html

just 20 minutes ago i nearly cut my arm off with one of these blades at the essential stage of cleaning the leading edge and blade with alcohol...not fun trying to finish a blade off one-handed and with blood squirting in your eye (come on hillbill....wade in!!! i expect no sympathy this time....just a ton of grief....lol!)...the alcohol in it hurt more than the cut!

 

[TurboGirl]

Greenpete, a highly regarded member here, had a series of four videos about knife making, they used to be on Youtube but I believe they messed him about over them and they are now available on his website - http://www.greenpete.co.uk/knife-making/knife-making-video/

what a great linky

As a noob knifemaker, I got the ground flat stock from Cromwell too, MUCH cheapness and I found some standing wood which we were chopping for the campfire at a freinds meet... selected the hardest areas with least wormholes, bandsawed it into 1cm widths and left them for a few days then burned any that were warped... I did 2 knives but one did warp a wee bit on the blank and I had to fill the crack and an unforeseen wormhole with aeroldite n sawdust. They're functional and I'll learn more from the mistakes than if I'd bought the scales but I'm not fussy on looks so it suited me

Good blade karma to you, love

 

[Spunyarn]

Cheers for all the advice guys. Much appreciated. I've read up about the whole subject of home-made knifes. Some require alot of skill, and patience. Some are much more simple to the point that one guy's tutorial simply showed that he cut a metal file to shape, smoothed the edges down, sharpened one edge into a blade, and then wraped paracord around about 4 inches of it to make a handle. He even left the edge square because he said it would be easier to pry stuff, without it snapping. There seems to be two distinct methods. One by created a blade blank, which you put a handle on by sandwiching it between two bits of wood. The other method is where you create a blade with a long tang, which a handle is then hammered onto. The second I think looks easier, but most people seem to go for the sandwich method.

Anyways, the one I've opted for is to make it out of an old file and I'm going to use the sandwich method for the handle.
The file I've used is an old one of my Fathers or Grandfathers, and the wood from the handle is coming from the base of a really old chair that was kept from Grandfather's house when he died. He was a carpenter, and the knife I make I'm going to give as a birthday gift (assuming that it all goes okay, and looks at least half decent), to my brother who does alot of wood-turning. I think he'll appreciate something crafted, and the fact it's made from tools and stuff that belonged to my Grandfather should add to the sentimental value. On the other hand, it may turn out to be a complete fcuk-up, but all I will have lost is a warped old chair that may have been burnt anyway, and an old file probably worth 50p, so hey ho.

Started off with a file like this one:

Used an angle grinder with a cutting disk to cut the rough shape out, and then a flap disk to grind all surfaces down until flat.

Then ground some more, and shaped as best I could. Notice that the end with the tang on, is left on. This is so that if I harden it I'll have a longer area to hold onto with mole grips.

Tomorrow I will sandwich the handle area between two blocks of wood, and glue them in position, then sand and shape the handle. Finally I will drill two holes, and then bung them by hammering a short length of the appropriate sized diameter brass bar through them. Hopefully this will be enough to bung the holes and thereby attach the handle and blade all together so it doesn't fall apart. Most people use rivets, but I've seen a tutorial where just brass bar was hammered through, and it seemed to work. Then will sharpen the blade, oil the handle, and hopefully it won't look too bad.

A couple of quick questions for you though;
Is it possible to have this kind of steel engraved? I suppose it's toughened already being a file, but can I still take it to a high street engravers and get them to put a name on it or something.
Anyone know any nice methods of presenting a knife as a gift? I thought about buying a sheath, or having one made, but unfortunately I only have until this Sunday. I reckon the best way is to find a wooden box that roughly suits the size of the knife, then line it with some sort of felt or foam, and set the knife within it. I may also include a silver coin in the box, so that when I give him the knife, he can give me back the coin in-keeping with the superstition.

 

[abominable_scouse_monster]

You should be able to etch it fine rather than engraving it, if you google simple (or basic) knife etching, you will find ton's of stuff the one on instructables is quite good.

 

[Gythral]

I'm suprised that no-one has suggested looking at British Blades, given how so many of the helpful members here are also members there!

Everything you want to know but were afraid to ask has probably been answered & stickied, including an etching tutorial.


As for a makers mark, if you are doing it before hardening, stamping is a good method, after hardening ecthing. Etching before hardening may get removed when cleaning the blade.

 

[HillBill]

Did you anneal the file? As in - heat it up to cherry red and let it cool before you started working on it? Anneal = Soften.

 

[richardww]

[/QUOTE]

Angst
what the heck are you doing,?
try sharpernig the blade after you have a handle on,
but wish you well, just keep checking you got all your fingers

 

[Stew]

I think you need to slow down.

You mentioned leaving the tang on in case you need to harden it, but then you say about gluing the handle on - the hardeing process will kill (burn to bits!) your handle.

If as Mark suggests, you haven't annealed it, it will be too hard for a knife. You'll struggle to drill your holes in it and it will be brittle if you manage to sharpen it. Rather than annealling it, I would suggest that you just try drawing the temper down in the oven, if you can cope with drilling and grinding hardened steel (though not as hard as a fully hardened file, if that makes sense!!) as that will save you having to re-heat treat it again after.

 

[TurboGirl]

I had a recent etching obsession and banged up a thread, post 1 has a list of interesting linkys which might be helpful... tis great fun to do although you need patience for big areas

 

[Spunyarn]

Cheers for the points on ethching fellas. Will look into it.
Stew I wouldn't harden it after the handle is attached, I'm not a complete moron lol. I meant I would harden it, then grind any excess off, and finally attach the handle bits and shape it.

Although, something I hadn't considered was how hard it would be to grind the tang off once it is hardened. I think the answer is to anneal it, sharpen it, and shape the blade blank completely, drill the holes, and then attach handle.

Will update with progress as it continues.