How much are women able to carry?

Janne

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I'm not. More about unacceptable and out dated attitudes.


Attitudes? Anatomy and physiology.
You can not change those....


I hope you at least acknowledge that the female pelvis is of a different form than the male one, and needs a differently shaped hip belt for it to be comfortable and efficient?
Fyi, the crest is lower, wider and has a different angle.
 
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Janne

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So, I got the impression that maximal 1/5 of the body weight of an athletic person is the right thumb rule for healthy men and women of every age for a comfortable trekking tour, higher weight is possible and only a question of careful training, lower weight is of course more comfortable for everybody and recommended to less athletic persons.

There is a difference in the muscle structure of men and women that should be counted in, but training and motivation are much more important.

For women the use of a hip belt could be more important than for men, because the female body strength is mainly concentrated in the lower body.

The different skeleton architectur is important and requests special rucksack constructions for women, like funktional clothing for women has to be constructed different as expedition clothing for men.

Our beloved military surplus rucksacks aren't the best recommendation for women so long the armies do not develop special rucksacks for female soldiers, what they seem to discuss currently.

Because women are round about 20% smaller than men, a very rough thumb rule says, that women should carry round about 20% less than men.
But the rule that with maximal 1/5 of the body weight of athletic persons most people feel comfortable is the better way to calculate the weight of the rucksack.

Because the muscle structure of men and women is different, it is probably intelligent to give a man maximal 20% of his bodyweight but the women maximal 15% or 18%.

Careful training allowes both, men like women, to carry much more, but for civilians with probably office jobs this seems to be the right recommendation.

Did I understand it right?

Does that fit together with your experiences?

I think you nailed it here.

Best Regards
The outdated Dinosaur.
 
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GuestD

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Attitudes? Anatomy and physiology.
You can not change those....

I hope you at least acknowledge that the female pelvis is of a different form than the male one, and needs a differently shaped hip belt for it to be comfortable and efficient?
Fyi, the crest is lower, wider and has a different angle.

you know something ? I don't care. My nose is probably a different shape to yours.
 

santaman2000

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Jan 15, 2011
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See how Muskie assists Vince, without making a fuss.
Still watching cartoons? I think we’ve found the problem. Back when I watched that cartoon I still needed my Mama to take care of me too. Of course it was still black & white back then.
 
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Nomad64

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Nov 21, 2015
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So, I got the impression that maximal 1/5 of the body weight of an athletic person is the right thumb rule for healthy men and women of every age for a comfortable trekking tour, higher weight is possible and only a question of careful training, lower weight is of course more comfortable for everybody and recommended to less athletic persons.

There is a difference in the muscle structure of men and women that should be counted in, but training and motivation are much more important.

For women the use of a hip belt could be more important than for men, because the female body strength is mainly concentrated in the lower body.

The different skeleton architectur is important and requests special rucksack constructions for women, like funktional clothing for women has to be constructed different as expedition clothing for men.

Our beloved military surplus rucksacks aren't the best recommendation for women so long the armies do not develop special rucksacks for female soldiers, what they seem to discuss currently.

Because women are round about 20% smaller than men, a very rough thumb rule says, that women should carry round about 20% less than men.
But the rule that with maximal 1/5 of the body weight of athletic persons most people feel comfortable is the better way to calculate the weight of the rucksack.

Because the muscle structure of men and women is different, it is probably intelligent to give a man maximal 20% of his bodyweight but the women maximal 15% or 18%.

Careful training allowes both, men like women, to carry much more, but for civilians with probably office jobs this seems to be the right recommendation.

Did I understand it right?

Does that fit together with your experiences?

Some of my experiences comes from rural areas in sub-Saharan Africa where almost all the daily drudge work is performed by women who spend hours each day trudging along, often steep roads (dusty in the dry season, muddy in the wet) carrying water, firewood, bricks etc. usually significantly more than 20% of their bodyweight (based on the weight of a full 15, 20 or 25 litre container).

Typically the menfolk don’t get involved in this work and seem to spend much of the day sitting in the shade watching the world/their wives go by. Sadly I speak very little of the local languages and I had always assumed that the conversations these guys were having were about football (most places seem to have satellite TV showing the English Premiership games even if water comes from a well, miles away), but having read this thread, I realise that they are probably having learned discussions about how the male anatomy is inherently better suited to carrying heavy weights than that of females.

I’m also now wondering whether the three fit young European lads I watched handing their state of the art 65-80 litre rucksacks to a guide who then put them all in a wicker basket to be carried by a tumpline up a mountain by a tiny Indonesian woman were medical students or junior doctors and the intense conversation they were having (in another language that I don’t speak) was about how although the female pelvis might be OK for reproductive purposes, the male pelvis is vastly superior for load carrying! :)

At the risk of sounding a bit PC, rather than asking a bunch of random blokes on the Internet, you could just suggest that the woman in question loads up her rucksack (obviously she should be closely supervised - all those straps and clips etc are likely to confuse her fluffy little brain), with a succession of increasing loads and goes on a series of walks to gauge what she feels comfortable with. ;)

PS Would love to see some pix and a trip report of your 400km French trek! :)
 
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GuestD

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Still watching cartoons? I think we’ve found the problem. Back when I watched that cartoon I still needed my Mama to take care of me too. Of course it was still black & white back then.

My mother passed away before I was old enough to understand who she was.
 

SaraR

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Biology being what it is, men tend to have more muscle mass and be stronger than women and there are also difference in joints and bone structure, all of which affect the load bearing ability. So you can't just scale it down based on height or weight, since *on average* if you had a woman and a man of the same size you could expect the man to be stronger.

Obviously hiking with a pack is not all about muscle strength, but also agility, stamina, aerobic and anaerobic ability, balance, technique, bloody-mindedness and so on. And sometimes the lack of (or perceived lack of) upper body strength especially can be a benefit, as it stops you from relying on your arms and rely more on your legs, which have bigger muscle groups.

As been pointed out several times already, both women and men are able to push themselves to carry loads that are perhaps heavier than physiologically healthy, for various reasons: survival, everyday chores, work, recreational activities and so on. But I took the OP's post to be more of a question on what would be a comparable load in terms of effort and enjoyment when taking gender into account. I think this is an interesting question and even if it's almost impossible to answer it might make us better hiking partners if we consider that others might have other constraints to ourselves. If I have to carry 15 kg (or 10 or 20 or 40) what would be "fair" to expect my colleague or companion to carry, if I wanted us to suffer equally? :)

I thought the paper on female soldiers in a previous post was really interesting, especially the bit about stride frequency and length. As you up the weight of the pack, you shorten your stride and if you then need to keep up with a taller person, you can get in to a situation where you risk injury by overstriding when you can no longer walk any faster.

I get this when out with my DH. Normally I have to take three steps for every two he takes, but can keep up. When carrying really heavy loads, I take shorter steps and end up going comparatively slower and lagging behind, despite keeping up a decent pace.

There are plenty of women doing solo long-distance hiking and they are obviously capable of carrying heavy loads (including tent, stove, food etc) over long distances, but perhaps the difference there is that they can pick their own pace.

So perhaps the best advice is to weigh down the strongest/fittest/fastest member(s) of the group by letting them carrying a bigger share, so that everyone ends up walking at a similar speed. Surely that would make it a more enjoyable experience all around and can be adapted for any group composition.
 

oldtimer

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Thank you SaraR for a sensible and balanced answer to what I took to be a sensible question by the OP!
I had already worked out that my small wife had to carry less in weight because of her small size, but had never taken into account out differing stride lengths. If only I had realised this years ago it would have avoided a row half way up Snowdon some years ago towards the end of a tiring day, not to mention many bickerings over the years!
 

Janne

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How do they do in the armed forces?

(Women were not allowed to enroll in my unit, so I have no clue.)
1: The pack must contain the same equipment = same weight
2; The rest of the equipment is the same weight.
3: The expected speed of walking is the same ( differs between type of unit)

I have seen British female soldiers march together with males, and now understand why they seem to walk strangely.
Same length stride as the guys!
 
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GuestD

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There is some useful info here, which is pretty much what I do.
http://www.outdoorsfather.com/2016/05/walk-40-km-day/

Over the years I have organised (successfully) long distance trecks, and motorcycle journeys. Just as important as the physical aspect, is the psychological aspect, travelling long distances with someone you don't get on with is just as tiring as carrying too much weight.
 
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santaman2000

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......I thought the paper on female soldiers in a previous post was really interesting.......

There are plenty of women doing solo long-distance hiking and they are obviously capable of carrying So perhaps the best advice is to weigh down the strongest/fittest/fastest member(s) of the group by letting them carrying a bigger share, so that everyone ends up walking at a similar speed. Surely that would make it a more enjoyable experience all around and can be adapted for any group composition.
With your points regarding stride n mind, it might be worth noting that when marching to in formation we normally had the shortest person in the guide spot setting the pace.
 
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