Heading Forwards, Moving Backwards

[Emdiesse]

As I head forward in Bushcraft, and learn more. I feel my kit moving backwards. I have my ferro rod steel, however presently I am learning the art of the flint and steel I want to start using that more.... Soon, I'd love to move away from this and become at one with the bow drill. I have a knife, I want to make my own, then learn to flintknap... I am moving backwards.

Presently I walk around with my 60 litre rucksack, my synthetic sleeping bag, clothes, gear. yet more and more I am wanting to substitute that light ferro rod for the heavier flint and steel. That light laplander saw for a handy hatchet.

After being lazy and rolling my mat, sleeping bag, bivy bag up together I realised something... I want a bed roll. So I went and bought some canvas material from the fabric shop to make my own bed roll. I had in mind to make a canvas bed roll with leather points where straps can be placed to hold it all together, and to the bottom of my bag. Then to line the bed roll with an old woolen blanket. Maybe even wax the canvas with a technique I saw on here (Greenland Wax)

A homemade pack became next on my list of things to do and the purpose of this is to quench the lust of moving backwards. So I can use homemade gear, so I can used natural materials, not for the style however more so for the satisfaction that I am moving that little bit further away from the dependence of modern manufactured goods after all something homemade I'd know every intricate detail such that any wear or tear I will know how to repair, and will want to do nothing other than repair.

Then I have to stop myself... this would get so heavy!

Anybody else out there walk with tradition, shun the new lightweight kit for the satisfaction of using something old, something natural?

Anybody out there take a hike with a heavy canvas and leather pack, bed roll, wooden pack frame all for the sake of moving backwards?

Any body else beyond even this and walking around like a thawed out Ötzi?

How do you find it weight wise, or is your pack weight relatively the same as those who are modern tech gear junkies (obviously excluding those who are lightweight, for real); whilst they carry a few grams of titanium cutlery are you carrying none as you whittle a quick fork from a twig using nearby knapped flint. Have you managed to offset the weight of your gear with knowledge, by being able to carry less.

Did the bushcrafters of the past suffer with heavy packs, or did they just carry less crud?

 

[oldtimer]

Mors Kochanski, "The more you know, the less you carry."

 

[Emdiesse]

Mors Kochanski, "The more you know, the less you carry."

Indeed, so those who do know more however choose to use homemade heavier canvas and leather gear over the modern synthetic counterparts for the gear you absolutely must carry how do you fair?

Say for example, you have your modern silnylon tarp, but for a traditional and a naturalistic sake want to carry a waxed cotton tarp.

Some might say, an essential item. You could carry less (i.e. use natural shelters). Although again this is a compromise for having to A) find the shelter/site, B) Gather the materials for the shetler C) Make the shelter against the energy otherwise spent carrying it with you. Swings and round abouts

So, who is a traditionalist. What do you carry? how far dare you walk carrying it... Do you have any back, knee, joint problems as a result . Or, do you find carrying the heavier gear actually is making you fitter for the days when you don't carry anything at all!

 

[Mesquite]

Did the bushcrafters of the past suffer with heavy packs, or did they just carry less crud?

They had mules to help carry the load

 

[oldtimer]

Yes, I have trouble with that Mors Kochanski quote too. My own practice is that of minimum impact lightweight travel. I'd rather have a reliable set of light kit in my pack than have to build shelter every night. Now I'm in my seventies, the comfort/security equation seems more important and lower fitness levels have to be considered. Then there is the matter of strength and reliability of kit. I cherish my nylon tent and pertex covered down sleeping bag and would not like to go back to the blanket roll, egyptian cotton tent, gilwell canteen and paraffin Primus stove I started out with.

However, I'd like to think that I have the knowledge to make and improvise if I had to. Kit can let you down at inconvenient times, and there are things I carry although a lighter alternative exists. Sometimes this is habit, like my stainless steel sierra cup rather than a titanium mug, sometimes sentiment like a too heavy knife. Pride plays its part: I use the wooden spoon I made in preference to a plastic spork.

But with all the advances and increased availability of lightweight kit it remains a mystery as to why my basic kit at 12 Kilogrammes weighs the same as my old gear did when my canvas pack and contents weighed in at at 28 pounds. I guess security weighs heavy: 55 years ago I didn't carry a mobile phone, Kindle GPS, spare batteries etc. or medication. Clearly I need to know more!

 

[Man of Tanith]

i trek around with a rugged river wilderness explorer pack-heavy weight canvas and leather
on top is a czech bed roll which whilst not canvas is blanket etc and weighty( i intend to get a canvas one at some point)
inside is blankets if i feel inclined that way
so yes some of us still feel the call of older times kit

(check out RonW's posts for more inspiration)

 

[Emdiesse]

They had mules to help carry the load

Speaking of which, anybody got a mule for sale?
However, seriously, on many occasions I have considered turning an old bike I have into my 'bushcraft bike'. I think that is what I need, a trusty iron steed. A small daypack on my back and the bed roll strapped to the top of a rack and the rest of the clutter in panniers.

Pride plays its part...I guess security weighs heavy...Clearly I need to know more!

I suppose that's what I am also foreseeing, the sense of pride from homemade kit, as well as the maintainability, 'traditional', and natural sense.

Perhaps you already know more, and that security is the learning of times when a gung-ho and optimism have caused necessary suffering!

...
so yes some of us still feel the call of older times kit
...
(check out RonW's posts for more inspiration)

Cheers, I'll check them out. I guess there will be no harm in putting the effort into making my own hand made 'traditional' kit. For the times when I am feeling brave, or even for the satisfaction of doing so. Although, I feel with a trusty iron steed perhaps I'll be able to get some good use out of the kit.... after all, I could push it uphill on a bike probably easier than carrying my modern kit up!

I guess the trad kit will do away with all commodities, especially modern ones, maybe 'cept a phone for emergencies!

 

[Retired Member southey]

I think its just one of the phases people go through, you might start light, because you have cobbled your gear together from gifts, finds hand me downs and not have or want to spend your cash, then you get the easy side of things bug which is kit, you can buy lots of kit from lots of places with great ease using the web, but with out handling this kit when it arrives you may find it only travels with you for a few trips then either be replaced\discarded or modified, then once you mod one thing you start to get ideas for other kit to make or mod, you find out how easy it is, and so your whole ethos changes and you hit the buy cheap and cut it up phase(the skills are still being practised but you are still in the phase of going out to practise skills instead of relying on them to be out(I reckon this is the going to the woods to carve a spoon phase, not carving a spoon because yours has broke\is lost\could be better)) then you may save up or circumstances change or your home making skills get good(through practise) and your kit becomes what you always wanted it to be, you can go out in any weather, wood or glen, winter or summer,and the biggest weight will be your food, repair kit and maybe water the rest pack, shelter, cook set, tools and shelter will be the weight you want, then you will be practised in the skills and knowledge required to remain out where ever you want to be, but don't get hung up on replaying some older time or shunning the new expensive or cheap heavy or light, don't worry you will get to where you need but make sure its fun, if it isn't putting a smile on your face every single day then sit down, get some paper and plan where it is you want to be, on a mountain or bottom of the garden as long as its fun don't worry

Five cups of coffee!!!! FIVE!!!!!

 

[Chris the Cat]

Yes, I have trouble with that Mors Kochanski quote too. My own practice is that of minimum impact lightweight travel. I'd rather have a reliable set of light kit in my pack than have to build shelter every night. Now I'm in my seventies, the comfort/security equation seems more important and lower fitness levels have to be considered. Then there is the matter of strength and reliability of kit. I cherish my nylon tent and pertex covered down sleeping bag and would not like to go back to the blanket roll, egyptian cotton tent, gilwell canteen and paraffin Primus stove I started out with.

However, I'd like to think that I have the knowledge to make and improvise if I had to. Kit can let you down at inconvenient times, and there are things I carry although a lighter alternative exists. Sometimes this is habit, like my stainless steel sierra cup rather than a titanium mug, sometimes sentiment like a too heavy knife. Pride plays its part: I use the wooden spoon I made in preference to a plastic spork.

But with all the advances and increased availability of lightweight kit it remains a mystery as to why my basic kit at 12 Kilogrammes weighs the same as my old gear did when my canvas pack and contents weighed in at at 28 pounds. I guess security weighs heavy: 55 years ago I didn't carry a mobile phone, Kindle GPS, spare batteries etc. or medication. Clearly I need to know more!

Very, very well put sir.
A nicely written post that gets some of the ambiguities of the kit debate over clearly ( that said, there is no 'debate' as far as I am concerned, you use what ever floats your boat! )
For what its worth, I mix the old with the new.
My best.
chris.

 

[Emdiesse]

I think its just one of the phases people go through, you might start light, because you have cobbled your gear together from gifts, finds hand me downs and not have or want to spend your cash, then you get the easy side of things bug which is kit, you can buy lots of kit from lots of places with great ease using the web, but with out handling this kit when it arrives you may find it only travels with you for a few trips then either be replaced\discarded or modified, then once you mod one thing you start to get ideas for other kit to make or mod, you find out how easy it is, and so your whole ethos changes and you hit the buy cheap and cut it up phase(the skills are still being practised but you are still in the phase of going out to practise skills instead of relying on them to be out(I reckon this is the going to the woods to carve a spoon phase, not carving a spoon because yours has broke\is lost\could be better)) then you may save up or circumstances change or your home making skills get good(through practise) and your kit becomes what you always wanted it to be, you can go out in any weather, wood or glen, winter or summer,and the biggest weight will be your food, repair kit and maybe water the rest pack, shelter, cook set, tools and shelter will be the weight you want, then you will be practised in the skills and knowledge required to remain out where ever you want to be, but don't get hung up on replaying some older time or shunning the new expensive or cheap heavy or light, don't worry you will get to where you need but make sure its fun, if it isn't putting a smile on your face every single day then sit down, get some paper and plan where it is you want to be, on a mountain or bottom of the garden as long as its fun don't worry

Five cups of coffee!!!! FIVE!!!!!

Hahaha, Never really stopped to think about it before however I have definitely gone through some of those phases. Presently, perhaps, spurred on by the recent adoption of leathercraft I am noticing the beauty of the older kit. Perhaps I should have bought a sheet of kydex and be looking towards all the latest tech, anything that's lightweight or digital.

One phase I am glad I am past is the buy cheap tat from poundland and a few nuts and bolts from B&Q with the hope to combine it together into a useful multifunctional heap of (deadweight) tripe.

Now it's the hope to craft something beautiful, yet probably left behind for favour of my lighter kit!

An alternative I suppose would be to combine the techniques I like from the old kit with the bits I like from the new kit. Modern materials, with the old way of doing things; a 'Mummy Bed Roll', perhaps...

Bad thing now is, I want to do both. Doh!
Feeling like an ADHD Bushcrafter...
However, that's probably because I avoiding work...

[edit]Gotta be old school, after all no matter how hard I try I am not sure I'd ever be able to make something better than what can already be bought on the market. If I really wanted to worry about how light I was I'd do better saving the money I'd waste making kit and to spend it on all the latest gadgets! At least with old school having bushcraft kit laying around the house would almost turn it into a gallery rather than a load of clutter![/edit]

 

[Man of Tanith]

cheese southey ever heard of a paragraph?
a blend of both is always nice

 

[dwardo]

I am lucky enough to have collected all sorts of kit over the years and can tailor what I need to the trip its self.
If just plodding up to my local haunt i take a bigger tarp, loads of toys and craft gear, my bigger sleeping bag and mat for the extra comfort. I take a bigger selection of cutting tools to make the tasks at hand easier and enough gourmet food and coffee to feed a small army.
If I have more of a walk involved then I take slightly lighter stuff and lose some of the toys and tools.
Heading up a hill I will cut the ends of my shoe laces and take only what I need. I will take a gas stove, dry food and try to save every gram I can. The shelter is usually the terra nova tent would be split between me and our kid and any extra space would be food, water and clothing.

Horses for courses I suppose.