Hammock underblanket --- Group Buy
- Thread starter wanderinstar
- Start date
Hey all - this is my first post here...saw this thread mentioned at whiteblaze.net.
Just wanted to point out that I have pics and info about the JRB, KAQ and PeaPod on my site for those who may be unfamiliar with these products. Start here if you're interested:
http://www.tothewoods.net/HammockCampingWarm.html
I also wanted to ask a question. I'm not sure what the norms are in this forum, but I'm interested if anyone has asked Patrick how he feels about Snugpac manufacturing his design for profit. I know how much work he put into making his quilts the quality product you're using for the Snugpac prototype, and it seems to me that asking a company to copy his design without his involvement is, well, stealing. If he's involved or has given his permission, I may be wrong on this - but basing my knowledge only on what's been discussed in this thread it looks like Snugpac is about to profit from Patrick's hard work without compensating him. Personally, I'd have hesitations about doing business with a company with those ethics. Am I misunderstanding what's going on here?
Just wanted to point out that I have pics and info about the JRB, KAQ and PeaPod on my site for those who may be unfamiliar with these products. Start here if you're interested:
http://www.tothewoods.net/HammockCampingWarm.html
I also wanted to ask a question. I'm not sure what the norms are in this forum, but I'm interested if anyone has asked Patrick how he feels about Snugpac manufacturing his design for profit. I know how much work he put into making his quilts the quality product you're using for the Snugpac prototype, and it seems to me that asking a company to copy his design without his involvement is, well, stealing. If he's involved or has given his permission, I may be wrong on this - but basing my knowledge only on what's been discussed in this thread it looks like Snugpac is about to profit from Patrick's hard work without compensating him. Personally, I'd have hesitations about doing business with a company with those ethics. Am I misunderstanding what's going on here?
wanderinstar said:
Jeff,
If you had fully read the thread you would have found the above. Patrick was contacted and didn't want us to use his design. Hence.
"Now have a new design"
Patrick was sent a copy of new design for his comments, but to date has failed to comment.
Ian.
Ian, I got information from MagiKelly about your design, which I responded to. I had a few suggestions, some based on me going down a couple of the same roads as you guys were looking at. After that, John sent me a sketch that I believe you had drawn. I haven't responded to that yet, but will send you a private message.
I'm interested to see how the finished product turns out. As always, a great way to save money on an underquilt is making your own. I have plans on my site for free. It's really satisfying to make your own gear. Stop saying you don't have time! You'll have something you can use forever and you'll be glad you made the time. Three or four evenings should be all it takes.
Whichever you end up with, it's good to see so many people interested in hammocking and realizing that insulating them doesn't have to be prohibitive or complicated.
I'm interested to see how the finished product turns out. As always, a great way to save money on an underquilt is making your own. I have plans on my site for free. It's really satisfying to make your own gear. Stop saying you don't have time! You'll have something you can use forever and you'll be glad you made the time. Three or four evenings should be all it takes.
Whichever you end up with, it's good to see so many people interested in hammocking and realizing that insulating them doesn't have to be prohibitive or complicated.
I'm going to stick my oar in here!
Timewise I could have had a professional kickass quilt made by Patrick, BUT, the uncertainties of buying from the USA quite put me off with the customs charges etc. I'm very impressed with his design and looked at it with serious interest with regard to making it here. My wife runs a professional sewing manufacturing business...She looked at me in horror that she should spend a whole day doing the sewing on this lovely design when she is very busy, and, the last thing she wants in her workshop is her useless husband forever asking questions!!! So the next best thing was to ask Wanderinstar to continue with his quest for a UK version using a BCUK group buy. So far this has proved the best option for me.
I hope that Kickass Patrick and Wanderinstar will resolve any copyright issues that may arise from this. I hope that this all remains above board to the mutual benefit of ALL involved. Swyn
Timewise I could have had a professional kickass quilt made by Patrick, BUT, the uncertainties of buying from the USA quite put me off with the customs charges etc. I'm very impressed with his design and looked at it with serious interest with regard to making it here. My wife runs a professional sewing manufacturing business...She looked at me in horror that she should spend a whole day doing the sewing on this lovely design when she is very busy, and, the last thing she wants in her workshop is her useless husband forever asking questions!!! So the next best thing was to ask Wanderinstar to continue with his quest for a UK version using a BCUK group buy. So far this has proved the best option for me.
I hope that Kickass Patrick and Wanderinstar will resolve any copyright issues that may arise from this. I hope that this all remains above board to the mutual benefit of ALL involved. Swyn
wanderinstar said:
Wow - a bit more presumptuous and defensive than I expected, but if that's your style, it's cool. Just b/c I read it doesn't mean it answered all of my questions.
It's Patrick's design, so as long as he's going along with it my questions are answered. I just don't like to see the big guys come along and pressure the cottage manufacturers out of business - especially when the innovative designs usually come from cottage manufacturers like Patrick. So I asked the question.
I hope you all enjoy your hammocks! Like Patrick said, it's really not hard to stay warm in cold temps, and his underquilts are a great way to do that.
(FWIW, I have one of his quilts but have no business relationship or financial interest in Kickass Quilts.)
Ian.........I want to say thanks for all the hard work you are doing, trying to do us a service and I hope it all ends up ok................Jon :You_Rock_
Has the design been published then? I'd be interested in seeing what you came up with? (I (read my wife) recently made one based on Patrick's design.)
Scanker,
No the design hasn't been published. Don't know how Ade has seen it , unless Magikelly has shown him my rough drawing I sent to him.
Ian.
No the design hasn't been published. Don't know how Ade has seen it , unless Magikelly has shown him my rough drawing I sent to him.
Ian.
M
mikehill
Guest
MagiKelly
Making memories since '67
Just back from a weekend outdoors so catching up here. Unfortunately my Kick *** Quilt arrived back after I left so I ended up testing the Reindeer Skin instead. This also slightly delays me in doing a full review of the underquilt but does let me know how it compares to a reindeer skin (the underblanket is better 
)
Just for clarity I would like to explain how this group buy process went, just so everyone is clear that we have not been trying to rip off Patrick. Patrick as an absolute stand up guy and I would not under any circumstances participate in undermining him.
The plan was to see about getting some underblankets made for a group of us to save ion manufacturing costs and to avoid the uncertainties of ordering from abroad. The actual design of the underblanket was not settled at this stage as it was expected that the manufacturer may have a large input into design. My underblanket (one of Patrick's) was shown to the manufacturer to give them an idea of the sort of thing we were talking about. The manufacturer thought we were asking for a direct copy but this was not the case, however, I suggested it might be worth asking Patrick if we could use his design, before we got into the design process proper. Patrick was understandably not keen and we moved on the the design process proper.
Ian sent me the first rough sketch which I commented on and forwarded to Patrick for his comments. I also gave my comments to Ian (who is is really running this, I am just helping / hindering [delete as appropriate ]). Ian took on board the comments and send me a revised sketch which I forwarded to Patrick.. Patrick has not yet commented on this design to me but he has already been more than helpful with comments and this is extremely generous of him since he is helping to reduce his market in some ways.
I have also spoken to Patrick about supplying his underblankets on a group rate and this may still be a possibility, depending on Snugpak's price but there are issues of volume of work, postage and duty to be taken into account.
I hope this clarifies things and lets everyone see that we are not in any way trying to undermine or rip off Patrick (Patrick already knows this). I have one of Patrick's underquilts and highly recommend them. I have dealt with Patrick and I highly recommend him too .
)Just for clarity I would like to explain how this group buy process went, just so everyone is clear that we have not been trying to rip off Patrick. Patrick as an absolute stand up guy and I would not under any circumstances participate in undermining him.
The plan was to see about getting some underblankets made for a group of us to save ion manufacturing costs and to avoid the uncertainties of ordering from abroad. The actual design of the underblanket was not settled at this stage as it was expected that the manufacturer may have a large input into design. My underblanket (one of Patrick's) was shown to the manufacturer to give them an idea of the sort of thing we were talking about. The manufacturer thought we were asking for a direct copy but this was not the case, however, I suggested it might be worth asking Patrick if we could use his design, before we got into the design process proper. Patrick was understandably not keen and we moved on the the design process proper.
Ian sent me the first rough sketch which I commented on and forwarded to Patrick for his comments. I also gave my comments to Ian (who is is really running this, I am just helping / hindering [delete as appropriate
]). Ian took on board the comments and send me a revised sketch which I forwarded to Patrick.. Patrick has not yet commented on this design to me but he has already been more than helpful with comments and this is extremely generous of him since he is helping to reduce his market in some ways.I have also spoken to Patrick about supplying his underblankets on a group rate and this may still be a possibility, depending on Snugpak's price but there are issues of volume of work, postage and duty to be taken into account.
I hope this clarifies things and lets everyone see that we are not in any way trying to undermine or rip off Patrick (Patrick already knows this). I have one of Patrick's underquilts and highly recommend them. I have dealt with Patrick and I highly recommend him too
.John, thank you for the kind words. I'm not necessarily averse to a group buy. It's just that, being as I'm a midnight and weekend seamster, I worry about getting overwhelmed. But if there's interest, we can talk about prices, times, quantities, etc. Thanks, again.
MagiKelly
Making memories since '67
gregorach said:
The sixth has been and gone. Names are already building for the 7th
Patrick I will email you again about the posability of a group buy but be warned if we could sort out a good price you could be spending every spare moment making underblankets for the next six months.
Sounds good. If we can work it out, that would be great. If it doesn't happen, at least my girlfriend won't leave me.
