Habitat with most odds off obtaining all your wild food needs in the U.K.

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Poacherman

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Sep 25, 2023
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Have you met many hunter gatherers ? I have met a few. Most are very lean, but they freely admit that given the opportunity they'd get fat. They (well, the interpreters) said that they said that being here (they were visiting, part of a cultural exchange)that our lives were easy. They didn't want to lose their traditions or their culture but they would like reliable food sources......so, your 'noble savage' idea is based on false premise. Basically if they could access it, they'd eat it.



You are now insulting other members. Please go and read the rules and guidelines you agreed to when you joined the forum.


Mine are small, but there are so many of them, I can gather a handful in moments. They're sweet, bubblegum sweet, but they're full of seeds.
All the cultivated ones have is more liquid, not more sweetness.

View attachment 83460
Insulting iv not swore once?
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
Have you met many hunter gatherers ? I have met a few. Most are very lean, but they freely admit that given the opportunity they'd get fat. They (well, the interpreters) said that they said that being here (they were visiting, part of a cultural exchange)that our lives were easy. They didn't want to lose their traditions or their culture but they would like reliable food sources......so, your 'noble savage' idea is based on false premise. Basically if they could access it, they'd eat it.



You are now insulting other members. Please go and read the rules and guidelines you agreed to when you joined the forum.


Mine are small, but there are so many of them, I can gather a handful in moments. They're sweet, bubblegum sweet, but they're full of seeds.
All the cultivated ones have is more liquid, not more sweetness.

View attachment 83460
Being lean or slim is much healthier than being fat though that's absolutely universal being fat is horrible iv been fat .
 
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Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
39,133
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S. Lanarkshire
I have been very lean, and I'm now fat. On the whole, being lean is physically easier, but unless I'm prepared to live on around a thousand calories a day, every day in life, then no, I'm not going to be lean like that again.

My BP is fine, my heart is healthy, my liver and kidney functions are excellent, I have no signs of osteoporosis, despite my age, and no diabetes issues.
I'm fortunate, but I come from a long line of little fat ladies who all lived to their late eighties, early nineties, one until she was 102.

At the end of the day, your genetics are the biggest part of your health.

M
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
I have been very lean, and I'm now fat. On the whole, being lean is physically easier, but unless I'm prepared to live on around a thousand calories a day, every day in life, then no, I'm not going to be lean like that again.

My BP is fine, my heart is healthy, my liver and kidney functions are excellent, I have no signs of osteoporosis, despite my age, and no diabetes issues.
I'm fortunate, but I come from a long line of little fat ladies who all lived to their late eighties, early nineties, one until she was 102.

At the end of the day, your genetics are the biggest part of your health.

M
I v had a sixpack been lean i d argue being lean is not healthy it's very hard to maintain and takes lot being slim though without visible a bs is very easy to maintain for men at least ,i v been fat to I felt horrible somewhere in the middle off fat and lean is ideal say 15 to 20% body fat for men.
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
I have been very lean, and I'm now fat. On the whole, being lean is physically easier, but unless I'm prepared to live on around a thousand calories a day, every day in life, then no, I'm not going to be lean like that again.

My BP is fine, my heart is healthy, my liver and kidney functions are excellent, I have no signs of osteoporosis, despite my age, and no diabetes issues.
I'm fortunate, but I come from a long line of little fat ladies who all lived to their late eighties, early nineties, one until she was 102.

At the end of the day, your genetics are the biggest part of your health.

M
The calorie knowledge is interesting iff we go for the standard 2500 for men that's a lot off food. It's 8 rounds off toast for breakfast ,a bigmac and fries for dinner and a similar meal for tea. Unless one is doing hard manual labour it's not best advice for health.
 

Broch

Life Member
Jan 18, 2009
8,456
8,316
Mid Wales
www.mont-hmg.co.uk
I v had a sixpack been lean i d argue being lean is not healthy it's very hard to maintain and takes lot being slim though without visible a bs is very easy to maintain for men at least ,i v been fat to I felt horrible somewhere in the middle off fat and lean is ideal say 15 to 20% body fat for men.

And, other people choose to live a different lifestyle, because, in the end, life is about living. Enjoy what you do, by all means feel happy with yourself, be comfortable with your choices, but don't preach to others.
 

Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
And, other people choose to live a different lifestyle, because, in the end, life is about living. Enjoy what you do, by all means feel happy with yourself, be comfortable with your choices, but don't preach to others.
Iv not preached anything yes life is about living but people's choices have impacts obesity strains the NHS
 
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Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
39,133
4,810
S. Lanarkshire
Many fat people are apparently more and more too embarassed to bother their Doctor, because they're fat shamed by people posting like you have.
Thing is though, those people have often worked and paid their national insurance all their days.
What right has anyone else to say that they shouldn't access the NHS ?

Those who fat shame others are often those who strain and struggle so hard to remain slim themselves that they have neither empathy or courtesy, and honestly if they're making so much comment about someone else's weight I question just how much they're stressing themselves mentally.
Why do they seem to desperately need some kind of validation for being disciplined about their diet? :dunno:

There's also the issue that a huge number of women my age are now realising that all those years of dieting have left them with real problems with osteoporosis. The estimate is that one in two women will have a fracture related to osteoporosis as they age past menopause.

I think fitness for the life you lead ought to have greater importance.

On that note though; @John Fenna has immeasurably improved his quality of life by losing a substantial amount of weight.
Everything from easing the aches on his joints to stamina. He is fit and very active again.
Good on him :) a power of determined effort that has such really good results :)
 
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GreyCat

Full Member
Nov 1, 2023
179
176
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South Wales, UK
Many fat people are apparently more and more too embarassed to bother their Doctor, because they're fat shamed by people posting like you have.
Thing is though, those people have often worked and paid their national insurance all their days.
What right has anyone else to say that they shouldn't access the NHS ?

Those who fat shame others are often those who strain and struggle so hard to remain slim themselves that they have neither empathy or courtesy, and honestly if they're making so much comment about someone else's weight I question just how much they're stressing themselves mentally.
Why do they seem to desperately need some kind of validation for being disciplined about their diet? :dunno:

There's also the issue that a huge number of women my age are now realising that all those years of dieting have left them with real problems with osteoporosis. The estimate is that one in two women will have a fracture related to osteoporosis as they age past menopause.

I think fitness for the life you lead ought to have greater importance.

On that note though; @John Fenna has immeasurably improved his quality of life by losing a substantial amount of weight.
Everything from easing the aches on his joints to stamina. He is fit and very active again.
Good on him :) a power of determined effort that has such really good results :)

Nail. Head. On.

It's interesting that the body is actually a very finely tuned system, and the fact it generally keeps fat levels pretty consistent is amazing. It would appear that there is a natural set-point which influences where the individual metabolism wishes to be, in terms of how much reserve energy is being carried.

The improving understanding of epigenetics casts light on this, studies of children of mothers who lived through a severe famine (pregnant afterwards not during the famine) were done in the Netherlands after the winter famine following WW2, and showed changes in propensity to weight gain (higher set-point) in the children. It makes sense evolutionary terms, the children of famine survivors will carry more of a food reserve in case it happens again.

Genetic changes are slow, but epigenetic shifts are fast and allow the organism to respond to conditions in pretty-much real time. It also appears the epigenetic changes are heritable- at least in part. It's a really interesting area of research at the moment.

As for the drivers: the core balance is the insulin/glucogen balance. If blood insulin is raised and persistent, we store excess glucose as fat. Over-doing this causes a blood-sugar drop which leads to extreme hunger, more sugar in, and so the cycle goes on. Various things can alter the basic insulin set-point with PCOS (poly cystic ovary syndrome) and menopause being on the list.

Lean and fit are not the same thing. Someone can be lean and have a "thin on the outside fat on the inside" type metabolism. It's also clear from the raw data that older ladies with a bit of padding tend to survive longer and better than the skinny ones. Particularly if the padding is around the thighs and buttocks (not the abdomen).

Calcium is important post-menopause, what is often not appreciated is that to use it to make new bone, the body needs vitamins: Vitamin D, Vitamin K2 and Vitamin A. Vitamin K2 is difficult to get without using animal-derived products (unless you like traditional Natto.... ).

I agree about fitness being the cricical factor, unfortunately the medical and general press is (misguidedly IMO) fixated on thinness as a proxy for fitness- it's more of a morality/religious approach than one based in the latest research. In turn, that means that many of us avoid GPs because sadly if you're an older non-skinny lady then chances are you will be told that whatever is wrong with you is all because you're fat.

GreyCat.
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
Many fat people are apparently more and more too embarassed to bother their Doctor, because they're fat shamed by people posting like you have.
Thing is though, those people have often worked and paid their national insurance all their days.
What right has anyone else to say that they shouldn't access the NHS ?

Those who fat shame others are often those who strain and struggle so hard to remain slim themselves that they have neither empathy or courtesy, and honestly if they're making so much comment about someone else's weight I question just how much they're stressing themselves mentally.
Why do they seem to desperately need some kind of validation for being disciplined about their diet? :dunno:

There's also the issue that a huge number of women my age are now realising that all those years of dieting have left them with real problems with osteoporosis. The estimate is that one in two women will have a fracture related to osteoporosis as they age past menopause.

I think fitness for the life you lead ought to have greater importance.

On that note though; @John Fenna has immeasurably improved his quality of life by losing a substantial amount of weight.
Everything from easing the aches on his joints to stamina. He is fit and very active again.
Good on him :) a power of determined effort that has such really good results :)
I'm very slim but thanks I'm glad Mr John is healthy losing weight is the best thing anybody can do .
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
Nail. Head. On.

It's interesting that the body is actually a very finely tuned system, and the fact it generally keeps fat levels pretty consistent is amazing. It would appear that there is a natural set-point which influences where the individual metabolism wishes to be, in terms of how much reserve energy is being carried.

The improving understanding of epigenetics casts light on this, studies of children of mothers who lived through a severe famine (pregnant afterwards not during the famine) were done in the Netherlands after the winter famine following WW2, and showed changes in propensity to weight gain (higher set-point) in the children. It makes sense evolutionary terms, the children of famine survivors will carry more of a food reserve in case it happens again.

Genetic changes are slow, but epigenetic shifts are fast and allow the organism to respond to conditions in pretty-much real time. It also appears the epigenetic changes are heritable- at least in part. It's a really interesting area of research at the moment.

As for the drivers: the core balance is the insulin/glucogen balance. If blood insulin is raised and persistent, we store excess glucose as fat. Over-doing this causes a blood-sugar drop which leads to extreme hunger, more sugar in, and so the cycle goes on. Various things can alter the basic insulin set-point with PCOS (poly cystic ovary syndrome) and menopause being on the list.

Lean and fit are not the same thing. Someone can be lean and have a "thin on the outside fat on the inside" type metabolism. It's also clear from the raw data that older ladies with a bit of padding tend to survive longer and better than the skinny ones. Particularly if the padding is around the thighs and buttocks (not the abdomen).

Calcium is important post-menopause, what is often not appreciated is that to use it to make new bone, the body needs vitamins: Vitamin D, Vitamin K2 and Vitamin A. Vitamin K2 is difficult to get without using animal-derived products (unless you like traditional Natto.... ).

I agree about fitness being the cricical factor, unfortunately the medical and general press is (misguidedly IMO) fixated on thinness as a proxy for fitness- it's more of a morality/religious approach than one based in the latest research. In turn, that means that many of us avoid GPs because sadly if you're an older non-skinny lady then chances are you will be told that whatever is wrong with you is all because you're fat.

GreyCat.
And the Gp is right eat less move more the law off thermodynamics applies ,ducks raised on pasture are very high in K2 liver is high in A cod liver oil inA and D .
 
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Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
Many fat people are apparently more and more too embarassed to bother their Doctor, because they're fat shamed by people posting like you have.
Thing is though, those people have often worked and paid their national insurance all their days.
What right has anyone else to say that they shouldn't access the NHS ?

Those who fat shame others are often those who strain and struggle so hard to remain slim themselves that they have neither empathy or courtesy, and honestly if they're making so much comment about someone else's weight I question just how much they're stressing themselves mentally.
Why do they seem to desperately need some kind of validation for being disciplined about their diet? :dunno:

There's also the issue that a huge number of women my age are now realising that all those years of dieting have left them with real problems with osteoporosis. The estimate is that one in two women will have a fracture related to osteoporosis as they age past menopause.

I think fitness for the life you lead ought to have greater importance.

On that note though; @John Fenna has immeasurably improved his quality of life by losing a substantial amount of weight.
Everything from easing the aches on his joints to stamina. He is fit and very active again.
Good on him :) a power of determined effort that has such really good results :)
I'd also like to add me disagreeing on certain views and saying being fat is unhealthy is far from fat shaming it's neither direct or indirect.
 
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Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
39,133
4,810
S. Lanarkshire
I'd also like to add me disagreeing on certain views and saying being fat is unhealthy is far from fat shaming it's neither direct or indirect.

It's both how and what you say, and it wasn't just on the 'fat shaming' content.

Look, do everybody a favour, change the record.
 

Poacherman

Banned
Sep 25, 2023
437
213
31
Wigan
Again, what are the facts of that?
You have now picked out a minority group of people with a specific diet and decided they all have no teeth and no muscles.
That doesn’t provide any basis to your claims.
You can eat as much fruit as you want, because as much fruit as you want is not 300 apples a day.

I eat at least 6 pieces of fruit a day as part of health balanced diet.
And you have zero cavities ?
 
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