Gluten free ?

[Toddy]

No idea then. Wheat didn't grow well through much of Scotland, and the 'corn' was usually oats or barley.
Oats I can manage fine. Barley as in bere meal is fine too. Rye's not much used or grown here, now or in the past, though there are attempts to promote it for bio something or other. Our damp encourages the mould in it.
http://www.thescottishfarmer.co.uk/...4367635.Try_rye_to_spread_costs_and_workload/

 

[Robson Valley]

"Scottish breads," huh? My biochem friends are just crazy enough to fly over for samples.
OK. Wheat fields need a cold/dry period to reduce the soil microflora of pathogens.
Possibly the Scottish bread flours are brought in from somewhere else?

You might succeed with inquiries as it's not the artisan's thechniques in bead making that you're after,
it's the wheat sources.

 

[Toddy]

Type 'Scottish plain bread' into Google, if you do it in images you'll see what I mean
Then do the same with Glasgow rolls.

The rolls are hand made, all 2,000,000 a week of them from one bakery alone, and they are very slow risen.

Apparantly it's Canadian flour that's used. So no idea about the variety, etc.,
http://www.redbookrecipes.com/glasgow-morning-rolls/

M

 

[Robson Valley]

That's amusing that they will admit to the flour source. It will make a difference.
#1 Northern Hard Red Spring wheat. Probably the finest bread wheat (Group III) on the planet. Gluten a mile long.
You can fool with that by adjusting the fat content, the "shortening," to shorten the gluten strands for more crumb.
I use butter in breads but olive oil in pizza crust to really cut down the leathery gluten texture.

I don't have the patience to mess with bread for 2 days. Although I must admit, the taste baked after a long ferment is heavenly.
I've read most of Bertinet's book: "Dough." A fine volume to keep in my kitchen. Great for make-up ideas (bread-stars, bread-shots, etc).
I don't want to fight with it so I use Robin Hood All-Purpose flour which has a lower protein content but not as poor as "weak" flour, used for pastries.
I'm no cake and pastry baker, anyway. Bready things by all means.

Should have a chat with my biochem friends, some of us go back 50 years to Uni.

 

[Toddy]

I know that other rolls are like fall apart polystyrene in comparison

M

 

[Robson Valley]

There well could be some ingredient in some breads which can mask or otherwise bind to the gluten?
Bagels, strong rye bread, what others are there? All equally hard on your guts?

There are so many choices for a bread formula. Gisslen: Professional Baking. McGee: Food.
Then I understood what to do, what to pick and why. There's no magic.
It's been done with a bowl and a stick for 5,000+ years, hard to screw up.

I don't think that I've been baking for 15 years.
It never ever fails to please me to pull the bread out of the oven.

Big factory bread is a foam of flour & water with yeast as a "flavoring."
That's scaled and into the oven so fast, it can't fall.
Crumb. Switch from an animal fat (butter), say 1tbsp per finished loaf, to 1+oz veg oil
and the bready thing crumbles like cake.

 

[Toddy]

It's veg fat in most of our breads now, and it is in the Scottish stuff, and it doesn't crumble. It's brilliant for toast, you can cut it with biscuit cutters and make mini pizzas from it, or butter it and press it into a fairy cake tin and it'll make croustards (little pie shells). It makes excellent cheesy garlic bread too.
Only the butteries of the North East use butter…..and they're a different beast altogether.

Bagels are horrible things; well, I think so. Rye bread upsets my tummy too. Yet I eat all the seedy things normally with no fuss or bother. From our own pendulous rush and wood millet to sesame and sunflowers. funny things are people

"a foam of flour and water with yeast as a flavouring ". That descibes most factory breads perfectly

Sorry Richard, I still haven't watched the Ancient Brit thing

M

 

[Robson Valley]

I like all sorts of grain products. I've had great difficulty making rye breads.
They rise beautifully and flop in the oven (lack of gluten is the usual reason given.)
Recently reading of "rye extract" for flavoring, which I might try.
Canadian rye whiskeys were a long time favorite, too. And gluten-free!

 

[Toddy]

I doubt there's much gluten left by the time the liquor has sat in those barrels

M

 

[Macaroon]

Even the best of the commercially available and artisan breads make me feel uncomfortable after eating them, and in a way that I can't ignore. But I love good bread and would miss it sorely from my diet. My answer to it is home-made sourdough bread, this time of year the rises are ofte over twenty hours in my unheated kitchen. I don't know the science of it, but there's no doubt at all in my mind that the use of the natural and local yeast cultures has some very pronounced effect on the make-up of the bread I bake; not only do I not feel uncomfortable after eating it but it makes me feel just how you ought to feel after eating something that suits well. This is backed up by the comments I get from folk who stop by and take food with me from time to time, and also from those to whom I've gifted loaves.

I use a best quality organic strong bread flour to bake with, having fed the starter with the same make and quality of wholemeal flour; yep, both Canadian and the best I can find.

 

[Toddy]

We have a bread making machine, and himself loves the bread, but I like my bread slow risen and knocked back thoroughly to slow rise again.
I think I'll have a go tomorrow
You've inspired me Mac

M

 

[Robson Valley]

Yeasts produce far more than the simple fermentations of sugars from starches. All the fabulous wines, cheeses, beers & ales are testament to that.
It stands to reason that bread yeasts are no different. Not too many years since SanFrancisco sourdough yeast was declared a new species from
Saccharomyces cerviseae.

Years ago had a friend who caught some wild yeast that he used for breads. Extraordinary. Sudden death and never found it again.
Macaroon has a variety and a technique to make truely artisan bread. That's as good as it gets.

 

[santaman2000]

I doubt there's much gluten left by the time the liquor has sat in those barrels

M

Here the FDA regs say a company can certify a product as gluten free if it contains less than 5 PPM (Parts Per Million) The celiac websites have mixed results for true celiacs. Some can tolerate that small amount and others not so well. They also have mixed results for the reaction to alcohol and vinegar (wine and cider vinegars are fine, but not malt vinegars) Non grain based alcohol (rum or true potato vodka, etc.) is safe but not most whiskies.

As I've posted before, my daughter's a celiac, as well as another distant family member and their doctors both recommended throwing out all their old dishes and cooking pot, pans, utensils, etc. to avoid cross contamination. Eating out is virtually impossible. many restaurants offer a gluten free menu choice but they cook it on the same appliances they use for the regular menu and then serve it on the same dishes.

Yes, gluten free has become another fad for those who don't truly need it. That's been both a help and a curse for my daughter. It helps because there are more GF foods available now: GF pastas, breads (the GF breads are truly awful but the pastas are pretty good) The curse is that b it I mentioned about eating out. When she asks the waiter about how they prepare the food they ususally assume she's just one of the fad group and brush off any questions or even lie outright.

That said, going gluten free doesn't mean she has to eat more processed foods. Quite the opposite; it means she has to avoid them because gluten get sneaked in through the most surprising ways (through vinegar, soy sauce, seasonings, etc.) The GF pastas I mentioned are pretty good but they are processed (just lijw regular pasta) Instead she usually uses spaghetti squash or rice rather than pasta. Fresh veg rather than canned (processed) etc.

 

[passer]

Here the FDA regs say a company can certify a product as gluten free if it contains less than 5 PPM (Parts Per Million) The celiac websites have mixed results for true celiacs. Some can tolerate that small amount and others not so well. They also have mixed results for the reaction to alcohol and vinegar (wine and cider vinegars are fine, but not malt vinegars) Non grain based alcohol (rum or true potato vodka, etc.) is safe but not most whiskies.

As I've posted before, my daughter's a celiac, as well as another distant family member and their doctors both recommended throwing out all their old dishes and cooking pot, pans, utensils, etc. to avoid cross contamination. Eating out is virtually impossible. many restaurants offer a gluten free menu choice but they cook it on the same appliances they use for the regular menu and then serve it on the same dishes.

Yes, gluten free has become another fad for those who don't truly need it. That's been both a help and a curse for my daughter. It helps because there are more GF foods available now: GF pastas, breads (the GF breads are truly awful but the pastas are pretty good) The curse is that b it I mentioned about eating out. When she asks the waiter about how they prepare the food they ususally assume she's just one of the fad group and brush off any questions or even lie outright.

That said, going gluten free doesn't mean she has to eat more processed foods. Quite the opposite; it means she has to avoid them because gluten get sneaked in through the most surprising ways (through vinegar, soy sauce, seasonings, etc.) The GF pastas I mentioned are pretty good but they are processed (just lijw regular pasta) Instead she usually uses spaghetti squash or rice rather than pasta. Fresh veg rather than canned (processed) etc.

I empathise with your daughter, there are without doubt varying levels of gluten intolerance. I have family members (coeliacs) who can eat limited amounts of gluten with no outward effects
Eating out is my biggest problem, many is the time I have been to a family gathering, where gluten free is catered for. Only to spend several hours in the wee hours in the little room.
I mentioned the processed issue, with regards to shop bought products. I find: bread, cakes, pasta biscuits etc are invariably more processed than the average gluten based counterparts.
On this side of the pond, all spirits are classed as gluten free by Coeliacs uk....... thank goodness

 

[santaman2000]

.......On this side of the pond, all spirits are classed as gluten free by Coeliacs uk....... thank goodness

Yeah, they're below that 20 PPM I mentioned so legally they're GF over here too.