Escaping with Paracord

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Col_M

Full Member
Jun 17, 2010
212
0
London and Devon
I'm sorry but this is absolute nonsense. If you are sliding down a rope at a constant speed, the force on the rope will be *less* than when it supported your static weight.
I agree with you on the whole but if you're sliding at a constant speed then forces are balanced (unbalanced forces mean acceleration), so sliding at constant speed means the force is the same as when you are static :)

Also I read in another post somewhere in here that someone said the breaking load of a rope decreases the longer it is or words to that effect, that's wrong. Well there is a small element of truth as the force in a vertical rope will increase linearly as you go up the rope due to the mass of the rope below. However to say a longer rope is weaker than a shorter one is plain wrong, it defies the fundamental principals of physics. The tensile force whether it be static or dynamic acting on a body is uniform along it's length whether it's 30m or 300m long, hang 10kg masses on the end of a 1m rope and a 10m rope and the force will be 98.1N at any and every point along the lengths of both ropes.
 
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daveO

Native
Jun 22, 2009
1,456
519
South Wales
If you have time to do all that you may as well wait for the FB to turn up.

30', hang from my fingers and drop, effectivly a 24' fall, easily survivable.

If you're going to do that you may as well use the paracord to lower yourself a few more feet before it snaps. I'd probably just send the missus down a drainpipe and get her to catch me though. :rolleyes:
 

wattsy

Native
Dec 10, 2009
1,111
3
Lincoln
throw everything squishy out in a pile, hang off your arms then drop and try to land using a parachute landing roll.550 paracord is not for climbing, and while it is rated to have a minimum breaking strain of 550lbs (hence the name) thats just hanging weights off it straight up and down, when you add external forces, like the cord hanging over a window sill for example, these forces are increased, the window frame and sill will cause all of the climbers weight to act on one point digging into the side of the rope which paracord isn't designed for. parachutes use dozens of strands of paracord
 

ged

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jul 16, 2009
4,980
14
In the woods if possible.
Nylon cord is useless when it gets hot.

When my wife got a job in Bath she rented a room for a couple of months until we could find a house.

The room was on the third floor of an old mansion and there was no fire escape.

The first thing I took up to the room when she moved in was a length of 3/4" coir rope, one end of which I tied to a good old cast iron radiator under the window.
 

mrcharly

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 25, 2011
3,257
44
North Yorkshire, UK
when you add external forces, like the cord hanging over a window sill for example, these forces are increased, the window frame and sill will cause all of the climbers weight to act on one point digging into the side of the rope
This is very true.

For the people who are essentially jumping; you'd probably survive. But don't underestimate the injuries. I had a fall of well under 30ft many many years ago. 6 months on crutches, my ankle is permanently misshapen and painful.
 

ged

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jul 16, 2009
4,980
14
In the woods if possible.
This is very true.

For the people who are essentially jumping; you'd probably survive. But don't underestimate the injuries. I had a fall of well under 30ft many many years ago. 6 months on crutches, my ankle is permanently misshapen and painful.

But don't forget there may be a positive side.

Years ago, a friend of mine used to be an aerial rigger. One day he stepped back to admire his work and fell eleven metres onto a concrete patio.

His right elbow took most of the damage, and now in the pub it seems to take him absolutely ages to reach his insode jacket pocket...
 

lou1661

Full Member
Jul 18, 2004
2,181
201
Hampshire
But surely if youre going to risk jumping, you may as well tie off a rope and try to climb it? If it breaks you will fall just the same as dropping from the window?

The real question is wouldn't it be better to have smoke detection to give you early warning of a fire, along with the engineered fire safety solutions within the building, or pretend you are MacGyver. I know which one I would choose.
 

rik_uk3

Banned
Jun 10, 2006
13,320
24
69
south wales
Groucho Marx had a good idea

"Three men and one woman are trapped in a building! Send help at once! If you can't send help, send two more women!" :)
 

PDA1

Settler
Feb 3, 2011
646
5
Framingham, MA USA
SJS Agreed 550 breaking strain is marginal for rapelling. Friction. This is very relevant for this type of rapelling. Move the cord awqay from your body and you slide down the line. Mave your arm closer to your body and the line runs over more of your clotjhing, slowing you down and/or stopping descent. Seems to me that if the choice is to stand and burn to death, or risk rapelling with marginal line, the choice would have to be rapelling.
 

Laurentius

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Aug 13, 2009
2,432
626
Knowhere
Seriously there are better things than paracord that may be found in the average household. Bedsheets notwithstanding, there is electrical flex, a lot stronger than you might think. In anycase where your life is at stake friction burns are the last thing you are going to worry about. In my youth I used to be able to jump the length and height of a one storey staircase. I built up to it one step at a time till I could clear the whole lot and land safely with a roll at the bottom. Mind you after that I only ever performed this stunt when I was drunk , the folly of youth, how did we ever survive it?
 

jackcbr

Native
Sep 25, 2008
1,561
0
50
Gatwick, UK
www.pickleimages.co.uk
Nylon cord is useless when it gets hot.

When my wife got a job in Bath she rented a room for a couple of months until we could find a house.

The room was on the third floor of an old mansion and there was no fire escape.

The first thing I took up to the room when she moved in was a length of 3/4" coir rope, one end of which I tied to a good old cast iron radiator under the window.

Lets hope the radiator was well secured. Last thing I'd want after hitting the ground would be a radiator following me down.
 

horsevad

Tenderfoot
Oct 22, 2009
92
1
Denmark
Slightly random question, but how would you do it?

Lets say you're on the 3rd floor of a building and trapped in a room with fire a fire preventing your escape down the corridor. You have 100ft of proper 550 paracord and a pair of gloves to protect your hands. How do you escape safely?

Would you tie the cord to something and fast rope out the window (would it be thick enough to grip and not cut through your clothes)?
Or perhaps tie loops in the cord to make a ladder?
Or even a set of prusik knots or similar?


Apologies for my rambling thoughts and if this is in the wrong board!
Dan


This is actually a quite good question. It shows forethought and analytical approach - and is as such an example of where prudent preparation really can change the potential outcome of a dangerous situation. Such approach applies easily both to wilderness travel and common urban life.

Short answer: It can be done - but please read the rest of the reply, as the real trouble may not be where one would instinctively think.

I have rappelled down quite a number of different cords and ropes - ranging from doubled masons twine to clothesline - and of course paracord. All of these experiments have - of course, as I am rather fond of this life - been done with redundant array of UIAA climbing/abseiling equipment.

The strength of the cord is issue number one.

The dynamical load on the cord is issue number two.

The braking mechanism is issue number three.



Issue one : Tensile strength of the cord:
=============================

Almost all of such cords are manufactured in a way which does not GUARANTEE such tensile strength. Is is merely used as a nice overall figure. Real MilSpec Paracord may be different; but at least I find it rather difficult to distinguish between the original and the copy.

Furthermore, as the cord is tied to some furniture or implement in the flat, as to facilitate an improvised anchor for the rappel, the tensile strength is drastically decreased. The knot itself may not even be the largest factor, as the cord may pass over other items of furniture or the windowsill itself any small edges along this will have vast impact on overall tensile strength.

For my tests, the paracord has been tied in a figure of nine, to distribute the load evenly. I have not tested the impact from windowssills or such, as these test were conducted in a classic top-anchored climbing training environment.

Using a mat or similar (which should be absolutely free from grit and such) under the cord, where it passes any kind of edges would be essential.


Issue two:
========

The paracord is rated for static load. Any rappel is going to involve dynamic loading. The cord will - of course - not be required to arrest a falling person; but as you move down the cord the inherent elasticity of the cord will make you bounce up and down. Your mission is to make these bounces as small as humanly possible. You will therefore have to move very slow and deliberate; which leads us to the next issue, braking.


Issue three:
=========

The braking issue would be the most single most influential factor in relevance to the potential succesful outcome of the excercise.

Such small diameter cord is EXTREMELY hard to brake using any of the available body-rappel methods. Simply wrapping the cord around ones waist would be yet worse, as it would cinch hard on the internal organs and severely restrict ones ability to breathe. Combine this with the abrasive action of the paracord as is transverses under high tension across ones body or clothes would make a very effective meat-saw.

The correct way to do a body-rappel is the Dulfer:

dulfersitz.jpg


(Image cortesy of http://www.traditionalmountaineering.org)

This is a quite hard technique to master, as one have to both control the balance and braking action with ones actual body. The method was actually quite well-used in the traditional mountaneering - but as a testament to the inherent dangers of this method there were several well-experienced climbers which actually strangled themselves to death as a result of this method.

In the bygone era of climbing the ropes were of substantial larger diameter than today. Doing a dulfer with a single (thin) modern rope is nearly impossible to do without burns from the friction. With a doubled rope - and lots of padding - it is doable.

With paracord - single or double - it is bordering outright insanity. The abrasive action - as mentioned above - would be severing both the collarbone and the femoral artery by the time the 30 feet decent was finished.

If one foresee the probable need to do an emergency rappel one would therefore be advised to preposition rope of suitable diameter and tensile strength (preferable static - and maybe even a cheap (unpolstered) climbing harness.

If the intended situation is of improvised nature it would be very prudent to include an UIAA locking carabiner to the kit. With the use of an hms-knot (or simply wrapping the rope around the spine of the carabiner) it would be quite possible to rappel down doubled or even tripled paracord. Single layer paracord breaks at the smallest dynamical load you would introduce. A fast improvised harness can be tied with a triple bowline:

Triple Bowline:
106152019_medium_dc13df.jpg


(Image courtesy of http://www.mountainproject.com)


HMS-knot:
257px-HMS_complete.jpg


(Image courtesy of http://www.wikimedia.org)



Recommended solution:
==================

My solution to the problem is Dyneema. Dyneema SK-75, tp be excact. A 3mm cord made of Dyneema SK-75 has an ultimate tensile strength of over 800 kgs, and is thereby plenty strong for improvised rappels. It should be stressed, though, that the cord is NOT designed to absorb any kinetical energy in a free-fall situation. (It is, of course, neither designed to rappel from. Only UIAA (or similar) stamped gear should be used for planned rappelling activities.)

I have 30 meters (about 100 feet) of such Dyneema SK-75 tightly rolled op in a little pouch which conveniently fits in the right back pocket of my trousers. I have a UIAA locking carabiner holding my keys, in a belt which is designed to hold my weight with a considerable safety margin, and a pair of abrasive-resistant climbing gloves tightly packed around the cord in the abovementioned pocket. I probably need not mention on a bushcraft forum that a knife (of some sort, whatever is allowed by the various autorities in your relevant country) is a tremendous asset to any rope-based rescue - improvised or planned, and should therefore always be awailable.

I have in two separate occasions had to use this setup to facilitate an improvised rescue in situations where the outcome otherwise would have been dubious for the unfortunate persons involved.

I should stress, however, that NEITHER of these incidents were in conjuction with any of the wilderness courses I teach (where I, BTW, allways bring more robust rescue gear anyways). Both incidents were in urban settings, where wating for official rescue relief were simply not an viable outcome.



// Kim Horsevad
 
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