civil enforcement officer??

[santaman2000]

Some years ago, a very close friend of mine, a guy called Ephraim Lewis, was tasered by LA cops, he fell backwards off a balcony and died from massive head injuries. Bad things happen to real people...

That's one of the reasons I'm not fond of TASERs either. That and the possibility of tasering someone with a heart problem. By and large though they inflict less serious injuries than impact weapons. In most cases they cause no injury at all (other than the intended temporary incapacitation) Had the LA cops engaged your friend physically the end result might well have been the same. We'll never know and it's tragic either way.

 

[Martyn]

He would have been tazerd for resisting arrest, there are strict guidelines in place for the use of it, yes mistakes happen but if he was cooperating then he wouldnt be tazerd would he,

Someone had spiked his drink with PCP. He'd only just got the recording contract and Elektra records whisked him off from Stoke to Los Angeles. They threw a shedload of money at him, including a massive birthday party for him. His drink was spiked, he stripped off and started acting wierd. The police came and tasered him. He died. End of!

 

[Martyn]

terrible story but i quite agree

Yeah, sorry. It was just the "lets hope no one on this forum has a loved one tasered for being Suspected of some thing" prod that struck a nerve. Didnt mean to interrupt the insanity with an unhealthy dose of reality. God forbid.

 

[santaman2000]

Someone had spiked his drink with PCP. He'd only just got the recording contract and Elektra records whisked him off from Stoke to Los Angeles. They threw a shedload of money at him, including a massive birthday party for him. His drink was spiked, he stripped off and started acting wierd. The police came and tasered him. He died. End of!

So the police just showed up and tasered him? No conversation? No warnings? No order to cease and co-operate? No provocation of any kind?

Well if that's so then it's certainly not the "end of" The officers would have been arrested, charged and imprisoned. The family of the victim would now be millionaires after the lawsuit against LA.

 

[JonathanD]

Hold on, on second thoughts, I'm not gettin' involved in this craziness

 

[Martyn]

So the police just showed up and tasered him? No conversation? No warnings? No order to cease and co-operate? No provocation of any kind?

Well if that's so then it's certainly not the "end of" The officers would have been arrested, charged and imprisoned. The family of the victim would now be millionaires after the lawsuit against LA.

If you're interested, read the link, it's mostly accurate....

http://www.ephraimlewis.com/Ephraim_Lewis_-_The_Unofficial_Fan_Page/His_Untimely_Death.html

There are some details of his life in England they have wrong, but it's a fair account.

 

[santaman2000]

Thanks Jonathan. That's my point. They had an uncooperative (for whatever reason)suspect, they were trying to gain control of the situation using the least force possible (in the officers' judgement and training) and the situation ended badly.

 

[santaman2000]

If you're interested, read the link, it's mostly accurate....

http://www.ephraimlewis.com/Ephraim_Lewis_-_The_Unofficial_Fan_Page/His_Untimely_Death.html

There are some details of his life in England they have wrong, but it's a fair account.

Thanks. Without having been there neither of us can say just how accurate the account in the article is. However it's a far cry from "the police showed up and tasered him" in any case. There appears to have been a long chase and attempt to take him into custody.

 

[EdS]

No CEF will not be getting TAZERS if for not other reason that due to cut backs Local Authorities couldn't afford them even if the had the urge for them.

We will not be getting them (Env Health) and we enforce criminal law and execute warrants - often alone / in pairs to properties where the Police only go mob handed and armed.

 

[Martyn]

Thanks. Without having been there neither of us can say just how accurate the account in the article is. However it's a far cry from "the police showed up and tasered him" in any case. There appears to have been a long chase and attempt to take him into custody.

He was a singer, who had been catapulted from an ordinary life, into the life of a pop star in a heartbeat. When I knew him, he used to drink very little and never took drugs, he was a fitness nut, his brothers were too. He was at his birthday party in LA and someone put angel dust in his drink. He went nuts, they shot him with a taser and he died. There isnt much more to say really. The only thing he was guilty of, was being an incredibly talented singer and having his drink spiked. No conspiracies, just a really tragic mistake.

 

[JonathanD]

Thanks Jonathan. That's my point. They had an uncooperative (for whatever reason)suspect, they were trying to gain control of the situation using the least force possible (in the officers' judgement and training) and the situation ended badly.

I think that's the point Martyns making. The state of mind he was in was not his doing, it was an incredibly unfortunate row of circumstances which were beyond his control that ended up with the police using tazers that ultimately caused his death. Certainly using tazers close to a balcony is not a good idea. He was not armed himself. The culture of the tazer means that certain LEO's may be less inclined to go into harms way or a difficult situation than before, thus resulting in circumstances like this. One of the reasons why I don't like them as they promote a more blase aproach to suspect apprehension with less thought to the consequences or circumstances surrounding the suspect.

 

[maddave]

Look out !!

 

[JonathanD]

Look out !!

Two of them fellas flew over me the other day. Scary buggers when they're flying low towards you, one to the right and slightly higher. Makes them seem like they are coming at you for a purpose. Thought about diving into the heather at one point

 

[Martyn]

Just want to post this...

[video=youtube;5ukkWLIBLf8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ukkWLIBLf8[/video]

He would have been massive if he had lived. RIP mate.

 

[santaman2000]

He was a singer, who had been catapulted from an ordinary life, into the life of a pop star in a heartbeat. When I knew him, he used to drink very little and never took drugs, he was a fitness nut, his brothers were too. He was at his birthday party in LA and someone put angel dust in his drink. He went nuts, they shot him with a taser and he died. There isnt much more to say really. The only thing he was guilty of, was being an incredibly talented singer and having his drink spiked. No conspiracies, just a really tragic mistake.

No, I don't see anything pointing to conspiracies either. I hope I didn't sound like that's what I thought. Not accusing him of being guilty of anything either. Perhaps his worst fault was his inability to pick his friends (someone at his b'day party who laced his drink)

What I was trying to point out was that he was obviously acting irratic (your words were, "he went nuts") and the police were lawfully trying to take him into custody (ironically, as much for his protection as for any others) They escalated the use of force incrementally and were using the least amount necessary to control the situation. Unfortunately it ended tragically.

BTW. Did they ever discover just who laced his drink? Did they prosecute them? If so what was the result.

 

[JonathanD]

Just want to post this...

[video=youtube;5ukkWLIBLf8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ukkWLIBLf8[/video]

He would have been massive if he had lived. RIP mate.

Talented lad. I think we should let this direction of the thread rest with that.

 

[santaman2000]

...Certainly using tazers close to a balcony is not a good idea. He was not armed himself. The culture of the tazer means that certain LEO's may be less inclined to go into harms way or a difficult situation than before, thus resulting in circumstances like this. One of the reasons why I don't like them as they promote a more blase aproach to suspect apprehension with less thought to the consequences or circumstances surrounding the suspect.

I don't like them for a lot of reasons. But it's not just because of LEOs going into harm's way that they are chosen. As I said earlier they are listed lower on the force continuum that impact weapons because they usually cause less damage (almost never any serious damage) than do impact weapons. Tazers don't break bones or cause lacerations that need stitches (or any lacerations for that matter) Impact weapons do; and a slight misjudgement with impact weapons can easily kill. For a TASER to do that kind of damage is or kill is much, much, much rarer (only in the case of someone with a heart problem or an unfortunate chain of events such as in this case)

However I'll re-state my stand that I don't like them either and I agree with you on disliking/distrusting the current trend of "TASER culture." They have their place but they aren't the magic wand some seem to believe.

 

[Martyn]

Talented lad. I think we should let this direction of the thread rest with that.

Aye, he was 26 when he died, he'd be 43 today.

Anyway....

Me point was, at the time there were shouts of police cover-up, conspiracy etc. We heard on the day he died that he'd been shot with a taser, I remeber I was in Tescos and bumped into one of our lads who told me - though at that time the offical line was suicide. It took some time for the truth to come out - remember this was 94, only a couple of years after Rodney king had the crap kicked out of him by the LA plod and got caught on camera. Racial tensions were high and the last thing they wanted was a scandal surrounding the death of a black British singer shot by the plod. In the end it turned out that the only conspiracy was that they were very, very slow releasing details of his death. I think the bloke who spiked his drink, probably just thought they were doing him a favour, him being a black popstar and all - but the closet Ephraim got to drugs, were vitamin supplements. It would have knocked him for six. No conspiracy, no men in black suits, no malice, just a very bad set of circumstances that led to a tragedy. That's real life. traffic wardens with tasers - get real folks.

 

[santaman2000]

Just want to post this...

[video=youtube;5ukkWLIBLf8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ukkWLIBLf8[/video]

He would have been massive if he had lived. RIP mate.

Good vid. And a great voice. I wish it had ended differently.

 

[Martyn]

Sorry, I've derailed the thread havent I.

Not my intention, honestly, it's just the taser thing struck home.