Cereal - a bushcrafters staple?

  • UPDATE - The main upgrade is now finished. The site should now be functioning as normal, I will be making tweaks over the weekend, particularly to look of the site. If you notice something is broken or have any comments please let me know. Many thanks Matt (Lithril)

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
James Nicoll wrote about the English language that,
"We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary."
Scots get an extra dose of Scottish to add to the English :D
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,214
798
63
Florida
I wonder if Corn Bread is not a version of Focaccia?
Parallel development maybe.

I enjoy baking bread. I am yet to do a 100% satisfactory bread containing no wheat.
It seems a 25% high gluten flour is needed to give it a good mouth feel.
We aren’t allowed gluten at all in our house. My daughter’s a celiac. She also has crohn’s disease (She’s currently on the 7th night of a hospital stay with a crohn’s flair up) So when we make cornbread we have to substitute a gluten free flour for th wheat flour most people use.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Janne

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,214
798
63
Florida
Eh ? not in Europe it wasn't. Oats, barley, rye and in the warmer drier bits, wheat.
Lots of other indigenous grains used here in the past too, from wood millet to pendulous rush and dockens....who needs chai and quinoa ?

I admit that a bit like Janne and his rye, here in Scotland, it's oats and barley. I've just made skirlie for my lunch...that's this stuff (copied from localish butcher's site)

Rye isn't common in Scotland, but beremeal bannocks were a staple for thousands of years, and oatcakes (both the Scottish crisp ones and the Northern English barm ones) are still commonplace.

I reckon the American 'grits' are just skirlie made with cornmeal instead.

M
Yeah. I know corn (maize) wasn’t especially important in Europe. It wasn’t even known there until after the New World was discovered. The same for potatoes and tomatoes as well as turkeys. That’s why I specifically said in “the Western Hemisphere.” Most of Europ isn’t in the Western Hemisphere.



The Western Hemisphere
The Western Hemisphere is a geographical term[1][2] for the half of Earth which lies west of the prime meridian (which crosses Greenwich, London, United Kingdom) and east of the antimeridian. The other half is called the Eastern Hemisphere.[3]
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,214
798
63
Florida
I’m growing a taste for buckwheat the last two or three years. Real buckwheat is gluten free and makes great pancakes. That said, many processed mixes that say buckwheat on the labeling aren’t real buckwheat.
 

Janne

Guest
Feb 10, 2016
12,368
2,251
Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
True, we did buy a buckwheat pancake mix.
Not much % buckwheat in it. Plenty of other stuff though that has nothing there to do.

It is simple. Buckwheat, milk, egg, salt. A little bit of melted butter.
Baking powder.
We mix it thick enough so the pancakes, about 6cm across, will be just under 5mm thick.

Simple Russki way to do it. Should be Deerhorn Salt but baking powder is fine.
 
  • Like
Reactions: santaman2000

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
Yeah. I know corn (maize) wasn’t especially important in Europe. It wasn’t even known there until after the New World was discovered. The same for potatoes and tomatoes as well as turkeys. That’s why I specifically said in “the Western Hemisphere.” Most of Europ isn’t in the Western Hemisphere.



The Western Hemisphere
The Western Hemisphere is a geographical term[1][2] for the half of Earth which lies west of the prime meridian (which crosses Greenwich, London, United Kingdom) and east of the antimeridian. The other half is called the Eastern Hemisphere.[3]
It does indeed, but that also includes Greenland, Western Africa and big chunks of arctic and antarctic....and corn doesn't grow there, or in much of north or south america either.
I think the area you live in colours your worldview :) Maize cultivation comes from Southern Mexico, and most corn grown worldwide isn't used for human consumption but for animal feed. Of course nowadays the GM stuff means that it will grow outside it's native range. Some varieties even grow here now.
 

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
I’m growing a taste for buckwheat the last two or three years. Real buckwheat is gluten free and makes great pancakes. That said, many processed mixes that say buckwheat on the labeling aren’t real buckwheat.
Pure buckwheat flour is pretty grim I find. I know it's gluten free but it really does benefit from adding other flours into the mix. Best results seem to be about 25% buckwheat if you want baked goods that are recognisable.
Countries where buckwheat was the staple seem to have made flat breads rather than loaves or pastries.
I added it to Dove's Farm's Freee gluten free flour and, well, it didn't make it any better, just it added buckwheat. Made nice pancakes, with a different taste to them. I don't know what the North American version of DF is ...Bob's Red Mill maybe ?
 
  • Like
Reactions: santaman2000

Janne

Guest
Feb 10, 2016
12,368
2,251
Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
Yes, we use the Red Mill flour.

Being brought up of non wheat bread, the taste for me is nice, full of flavour. A hint of bitterness..

That is of course also why I dislike Maize/Corn products, not being brought up with that.
Even Corn Tortillas taste sweetish to me.
 

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
I find them almost perfumed, kind of like patchouli somehow. I am acquiring a taste for cornmeal though. I'm not fond of rye bread, it's kind of chewy/sticky, like malt loaf.

Oats are an excellent food but they really need that extra heating process to remove the chaff. Seven layers, that's why most in Europe just used it as animal fodder.
We find a 'drying kiln' in virtually every single farm steading and clachan. The oats needed to be heated to puff up the chaff and let it be knocked off. That leaves the groat which is the bit that's fit to eat.
If you don't do that the oats are really harsh food indeed.

M
 

Janne

Guest
Feb 10, 2016
12,368
2,251
Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
Sounds like you got old stale flour.
It turns ‘aromatic’ in a weird way when it gets old.
I ruined a batch of rye bread with stale flour. (Newly bought, so storage here on island was substandard)

With our receipes, 100% rye bread is thinner and has a ‘shorter’, mouthfeel. More oil than recommended improves the mouthfiel, plus we use natural youghurt as liquid.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Toddy

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,214
798
63
Florida
It does indeed, but that also includes Greenland, Western Africa and big chunks of arctic and antarctic....and corn doesn't grow there, or in much of north or south america either.
I think the area you live in colours your worldview :) Maize cultivation comes from Southern Mexico, and most corn grown worldwide isn't used for human consumption but for animal feed. Of course nowadays the GM stuff means that it will grow outside it's native range. Some varieties even grow here now.
Yeah, I know my view is colored,by where I live. That was indeed the point of the first post on the importance of corn. However while it was first cultivated in Mexico about 9000 years ago (oldest estimate) it had spread throughout most of North America, excluding Greenland as you said (which is indeed part of North America) and South America by about 6000 years ago. True, it doesn’t grow above the Arctic Circle, but Arctic crops aren’t really much of a consideration when discussing continental importance; much less so when discussing hemispheric importance.

Oh, and it could be argued that even though it doesn’t grow in Antarica, it’s still the most important crop there as there’s no farming at all.
Pure buckwheat flour is pretty grim I find. I know it's gluten free but it really does benefit from adding other flours into the mix. Best results seem to be about 25% buckwheat if you want baked goods that are recognisable.
Countries where buckwheat was the staple seem to have made flat breads rather than loaves or pastries.
I added it to Dove's Farm's Freee gluten free flour and, well, it didn't make it any better, just it added buckwheat. Made nice pancakes, with a different taste to them. I don't know what the North American version of DF is ...Bob's Red Mill maybe ?
Yeah, the lack of structure without gluten has been our hardest problem too. Taste can be a problem but that’s been getting better. Bob’s Red Mill s indeed the biggest brand name selling good GF flours. Ironically even oats are potentially hazardous as the ordinary brands are processed in the same facilities as wheat and cross contamination is a risk. Bob’s RM And a few others offer certified GF oats (oatmeal) from dedicated GF facilities,but the cost is quite a bit more.
 
Last edited:

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
Corn was until recently a very area specific crop. The 'corn belt' is well named.
Greenland is a massive island and under Danish 'rule'. I don't think they'd appreciate being called North American.
The Western Hemisphere isn't just America, iimmc....it includes most of the UK, Ireland, Portugal, big chunk of France and Spain, enormous part of Africa, etc., too.

On the whole we're lucky here because it's fairly easy to find gluten free oat products and the prices are dropping as the volume increases with more purchasers.
 

Janne

Guest
Feb 10, 2016
12,368
2,251
Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
So I originate in the Eastern Hemisphere....

That will maybe explain my affinity to pan Asian food, Japanese culture ?
Japanese kitchen knives, Tofu and small batch Sake?
:)

Most people, including me all my life, think of Western Hemisphere as a politicsl/ economical division, where most of Europe, ( not Russia) and North America, but not Africa, and America south of USA are.

Europe stretches far into Russia, all the way to the middle of the Ural Mountains, 2300 miles or so west of London
 
  • Like
Reactions: Toddy

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
Yeah, it doesn't quite compute from a European mindset, does it ?

It's an arbitrary line, originally meant as a fixed time line (and it had real competition at the time, the French hung onto their Paris one for years after there was a major international agreement on Greenwich) that helped sailing ships co-ordinate their positions.
 

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
35,273
1,488
S. Lanarkshire
Ah we're just confused because we hear 'Western' and we think Western Europe, not Western Hemisphere. The meridian kind of divides the UK :roll: so England has a foot in both hemispheres.

M
 
  • Like
Reactions: santaman2000

Robson Valley

Full Member
Nov 24, 2014
8,148
1,302
McBride, BC
I'm quite pleased with the buckwheat flour that I buy from Nunweiler's Flour Company (Alsask, SK). NIce 1 kg packages.
As far as wheat protein goes, All-Purpose wheat flour here is maybe in the middle between strong and weak.
Canadian-made, it always bakes well with a good crumb.

Gisslen (Professional Baking textbook) recommends no more that 20% different flour for best taste and aroma.
I have found Gisslen's opinion (Cordon Bleu schools) to be right every time.
Normally, I use 20% Best-for-Bread whole grain mix flour. Wonderful aroma, toasted.
Rye bread? Buy a bottle of rye extract flavoring. Yes, you've been conned a lot of the time.
 

Janne

Guest
Feb 10, 2016
12,368
2,251
Grand Cayman, Norway, Sweden
Rye extract flavouring?

Need to look that up. Somehow I doubt that an European company would sink that low. A discovery would mean heavy fines, loss if public trust and maybe bankrupcy.
Findus ( and IKEA) only could BS their way out of the horse meat scandal because nobody could prove they knew about the content.

Most Czech and German bread receipes want between 25 and 50% wheat flour.
Finnish soft rye bread and swedish rye knäckebröd contain 100 % rye.
No flavourings.