Building a Hot Frame (Picc Heavy)

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
Back in 2009, I read a recommendation from Sandbender to get the DVD of "The Victorian Kitchen Garden". In this superb series (originally shown in the 80s), Harry Dodson (an ex-head gardener in a proper, walled kitchen garden) showed many of the tricks to providing a diet of fresh vegetables and fruit to the "big house" all year round - without supermarkets or imports.

One of the techniques shown was the "hot frame"

I had never heard of such a thing until I bought the DVD. It is, in effect, a small, self heating greenhouse.

We try to experiment with new things each year and this year, we have been inspired to try to recreate the hot frame.

Now please bear in mind that my knowledge of them extends to a brief segment explaining how they work. But that's not the same as detailed plans and a management regime. So this "recreation" may well involve a great deal of trial, error and failure.

So, in the original Victorian garden the hot frames were large, brick built, rectangles about waist high, with sloping glass roofs. In late Autumn, the bottom of these frames was filled at least a couple of feet deep with fresh manure from the stables of the stately home. This would begin to rot. The rotting generates a lot of heat (ever seen a manure pile steaming)? On top of the manure was sieved a thick layer of top soil. In this soil, vegetables and even fruit could be planted. The soil was heated from below by the rotting manure and the plants could be protected and warmed well into the depths of Winter.

This is what I wanted to recreate (initially in a small way).

Given my ongoing discussions with Goatboy on recycling and waste reduction, it seemed appropriate that to make this that I should use scrap. The wood came from some rubbish shelves that were in the cottage prior to restoration (the white is swallow poop).

Scrap pine shelves by British Red, on Flickr

I also have some glazed cupboard doors that I saved from going into the skip at the gun range

15703223606_ff06cb8ba6_z.jpg


Some offcuts of tanalised 2x2 were the other needed wood

tanalised 2 by 2 by British Red, on Flickr

So, step 1 I picked out a glazed door and checked that the shelves were long enough to make a box to the same dimensions

Glazed cupboard door by British Red, on Flickr

Using the table saw I made an "angled box" the same length and width as the door

Angled Box by British Red, on Flickr

It really helps in doing this to have a table saw where you can angle the blade

Table saw by British Red, on Flickr

The cupboard door fitted neatly on top

Angled Box with cupboard door by British Red, on Flickr

I used a hammer and chisel to chase out room for an old pair of butt hinges to secure the glazed door

Rebate or butt hinge by British Red, on Flickr

Then I made a series of "frames" to the same dimensions. A set of mitre clamps really helped with holding them together whilst I drilled and screwed

Mitre clamps by British Red, on Flickr

These frames would be stacked on top of each other to contain the manure.

I was concerned though that they would fall over so I decided to add a projecting "stud" to lock each frame to the one above.

I didn't have any material thin enough so used the table saw to rip down the 2x2 to thin batten

ripping down wood by British Red, on Flickr

The studs were then installed in the frames.

Stacking up frames by British Red, on Flickr

Remember to allow room for the studs coming from below when the frames are stacked and also that they do not project so high that the fouled the glazed door on the lower side.

Studs in place by British Red, on Flickr

[lie] Naturally I remembered this [/lie].

A chop saw really makes short work of turning out all these identical lengths - but, as with the rest of this project, no power tools are really needed.

cross cutting wood by British Red, on Flickr

In total I built four of the square frames and the sloping top piece

Five frames deep by British Red, on Flickr

Roughly assempled hot frame by British Red, on Flickr

I then took the pieces apart and treated them with exterior varnish to protect against rot

Hot frame sections being varnished by British Red, on Flickr

That's the basic construction done

Hot Frame with Exterior Varnish by British Red, on Flickr

So, of to the stables to collect a barrow of the very freshest of horse poo :)

Fresh Horse Poo by British Red, on Flickr

I placed three stacked frames inside an unheated greenhouse

Three Stacked sections by British Red, on Flickr

This left the lid and one section

Cold Frame section by British Red, on Flickr

It occurs to me that, in the Spring, the stacking frames would be brilliant for growing new potatoes in and the lid and one section make a good cold frame. Multi purpose pleases me :)

Anyway I started shoveling manure into the stacked frames, stopping every few inches to water well. This packs the manure and wood shavings together and eliminates air pockets. Should I do this? No idea!

Wash in manure by British Red, on Flickr

That barrow full (160 litres) only filled two frames (which surprised me). When I do this on a large scale, I'll need a lot of manure. Not that that is a problem - its all free for the taking.

Two sections of manure by British Red, on Flickr

So, that's the manure done. Clearly plants cannot grow in this so I got some top soil and sieved it on top of the manure

Soil Sieve by British Red, on Flickr

Sieved Soil by British Red, on Flickr

Watered Soil by British Red, on Flickr

On top of that I put a light mix of compost and sand

Potting Mix by British Red, on Flickr


I planted four varieties of seed in this - coriander, radish, spring onion and salad leaves

Labelled Seeds by British Red, on Flickr

I popped a thermometer into the frame to monitor the temperature and put the lid on

Thermometer in Hot Frame by British Red, on Flickr

Top Section of Hot Frame by British Red, on Flickr

I have one frame left which I will add to give the plants room to grow - but not until they have germinated as adding it now would only create air space that would need to be heated.

In Spare Section for Growth by British Red, on Flickr

order to check what temperature improvement (if any) we are gaining I have also hung a thermometer beside the frame inside the greenhouse

15562704549_ea48f90857_z.jpg


and one outside the greenhouse to monitor against air temperature.

Thermometer Outside Greenhouse by British Red, on Flickr

How well will it work? No idea. Its cost me nothing but some scrap wood and time and I'll be intrigued to find out.

Hope this was interesting - even if, for now, its all guesswork.

Red
 

Clouston98

Woodsman & Beekeeper
Aug 19, 2013
4,364
2
26
Cumbria
Very nicely done that mate! What a superb tutorial! It's a great idea too and the series sounds well worth a watch- I'm sure it'll work and I for one will be looking forward to seeing how you get on :).
 

Laurentius

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Aug 13, 2009
2,539
703
Knowhere
I was aware of the ability of horse manure to keep things warm, but I have never seen it used that way before, excellent idea.
 

Macaroon

A bemused & bewildered
Jan 5, 2013
7,241
385
74
SE Wales
It is indeed interesting, a great project and one that'll no doubt be very handy for those who don't have room for a greenhouse; and after a cycle/season of growing the contents of the frame will make for useful stuff for use elsewhere, methinks.

You're right to wet the stable manure thoroughly, horse manure piles were always left open to the rain and not covered, as it needs watering in order to get "working" properly; my gransher grew melons in frames like this,
and he had a plastic pipe with holes in it spiralled around inside the frame at the same height as the top of the manure, and leading to the outside where it was connected to a large funnel into which he peed on a regular basis; he reckoned the urine soaking down into the manure but not up into the soil was the way to keep the manure "working". :)
 
Nov 29, 2004
7,808
26
Scotland
That is lovely bit of work, all the more impressive that it was put together from scrap wood.

This is the only picture I can find of the one my family used, this was probably taken in 1976 (Edinburgh). We used an old sash window and scrap wood from the loft flooring, it wasn't as high as yours however there were brick walls stacked maybe three deep beneath ground level below it.

garden.jpg


The 'lid' has been pushed back a bit for ventilation, it must have been warm.
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
after a cycle/season of growing the contents of the frame will make for useful stuff for use elsewhere, methinks.

That's the hope - that, following a Winter / Spring of heating the frame, it may be possible to simply empty out the frame into the greenhouse and use the well rotted stuff to fertilise the Summer greenhouse crops.

It has got us to wondering how many "Daleks" of fresh manure would be needed to heat the greenhouse proper?
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
This is the only picture I can find of the one my family used, this was probably taken in 1976 (Edinburgh). We used an old sash window and scrap wood from the loft flooring, it wasn't as high as yours however there were brick walls stacked maybe three deep beneath ground level below it.

Mine may well be far too tall....I based it on my "by eye" guesstimate from the ones Mr Dodson worked on in the series. I am considering this one very much a prototype. I hope the multiple "sections" will allow me to manipulate it until I get it right.
 
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bilmo-p5

Bushcrafter through and through
Jul 5, 2010
8,168
10
west yorkshire
That is lovely bit of work, all the more impressive that it was put together from scrap wood.

This is the only picture I can find of the one my family used, this was probably taken in 1976 (Edinburgh). We used an old sash window and scrap wood from the loft flooring, it wasn't as high as yours however there were brick walls stacked maybe three deep beneath ground level below it.

garden.jpg


The 'lid' has been pushed back a bit for ventilation, it must have been warm.

Nice storage rad. recycle, SB.
 

bilmo-p5

Bushcrafter through and through
Jul 5, 2010
8,168
10
west yorkshire
It has got us to wondering how many "Daleks" of fresh manure would be needed to heat the greenhouse proper?

There's a bloke in the states has a whole domestic heating system utilising the heat generated by copious quantities of 5h1t. I'll have a trawl thru' my bookmarks & see if I can find a link
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
So will yer have too vent the box too let air in and condensation out?


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I'm thinking condensation will just sink back into the soil....but on warm days, I probably will have to vent heat...or will I? Time will tell!
 

Alreetmiowdmuka

Full Member
Apr 24, 2013
1,106
13
Bolton
Its a brill experiment by the way n could be a valuable asset in the future.ill bett with a bit of kingspan foil backed insulation yer could really crank up the temperature.


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British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
Its a brill experiment by the way n could be a valuable asset in the future.ill bett with a bit of kingspan foil backed insulation yer could really crank up the temperature.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Funny you say that - I have half a board of Cellotex in the workshop and the same thought occurred to me :)
 

Mesquite

It is what it is.
Mar 5, 2008
28,221
3,199
63
~Hemel Hempstead~
I'm thinking condensation will just sink back into the soil....but on warm days, I probably will have to vent heat...or will I? Time will tell!

If I remember right, the hot frames I worked on were always vented daily apart from the coldest days. I was told this was to prevent mildew developing but my memory is a bit hazy on them as it was 35 years ago. :)
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
2,143
Mercia
I'll make a couple of variable vent stops when I can get some workshop time - thanks Steve!
 

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