Best Insulation Order for sleeping warm

[rorymax]

Bit of a long read, I tried to keep it short and simple, best I could do, :sad6:

I have been thinking about the best way to form layers for the warmest sleep.

I do have a preference for the inflatable air bed to be inside the bivy bag (as I wont roll off it so easily), but that is not a must have if it proves to be a less efficient method. I will have a ground sheet base inside a tent.

So starting from the ground up I have these four permutations:

You of course may have different views on this and I would be happy to hear them.

What say you ? if you can give your advice.


Option 1
1. Bivy Bag
2. Inflatable Air bed (inside bivy bag)
3. Insulated mat on top of inflatable air bed
4. Top Quilt (inside bivy bag)

Option 2
1. Bivy Bag
2. Insulated mat (inside bivy bag)
3. Inflatable Air bed (on top of insulated mat)
4. Top quilt (inside bivy bag)

Option 3
1. Insulated mat
2. Inflatable Air bed (on top of insulted mat)
3. Bivy Bag (on top of air bed)
4. Top quilt (inside bivy bag)

Option 4
1. Inflatable Air bed
2. Insulated mat (on top of airbed)
3. Bivy Bag (on top insulated mat)
4. Top quilt (inside bivy bag)

 

[Dr Toerag]

I choose option 1!
The mats outside the bivy would lead to me falling off in the night, I move too much while asleep, plus the inflated mat may get damaged if uncovered.
The advantage of the air mat at the bottom is that the air mat is protected from puncture from above (insulated mat) and below (bivy).
The main reason for mats outside the bivy would be if it's a small bivy (I am a not small man) and I'm wearing extra clothes for warmth.

 

[bobnewboy]

Option #2 for me. I presume you mean everything undeneath the sleeping bag is within the bivvy bag? Since you're unlikely to get a big inflatable into a bivvy, it will most likey be quite an expensive inflatable. Therefore its more important to protect it from punctures from underneath, as the bivvy and the insulated mat will both be cheaper/easier to fix/replace in event of a puncture.

 

[PDA1]

If you use an insulated air bed,you can reduce the number of items carried. The mat must be on top of the air bed to prevent convection heat loss. As you are in a tent. I'm not sure why you are using a bivvy bag. Seems redundant to me.

 

[Tonyuk]

I would have the mat outside the bivvy. You don't want anything in there with you restricting how the bags/quilts insulation lofts, so might be an issue unless you have a large bivvy. I would also just go with a self inflating mat and sleeping bag, that'll save you a bit of weight.

Tonyuk

 

[Nohoval_Turrets]

The bother with having the mat inside the bivvy is that it's awkward then to sit up unless you get out of the bag to some extent. And on chilly mornings, it's nice to keep the bag about the shoulders as you get going.

 

[rorymax]

I choose option 1!
The mats outside the bivy would lead to me falling off in the night, I move too much while asleep, plus the inflated mat may get damaged if uncovered.
The advantage of the air mat at the bottom is that the air mat is protected from puncture from above (insulated mat) and below (bivy).
The main reason for mats outside the bivy would be if it's a small bivy (I am a not small man) and I'm wearing extra clothes for warmth.

Good point about puncture protection, main criteria though is 'Best Insulation Order for sleeping warm'.

Originally Posted by bobnewboy
Option #2 for me. I presume you mean everything undeneath the sleeping bag is within the bivvy bag? Since you're unlikely to get a big inflatable into a bivvy, it will most likey be quite an expensive inflatable. Therefore its more important to protect it from punctures from underneath, as the bivvy and the insulated mat will both be cheaper/easier to fix/replace in event of a puncture.

Again, very good point about puncture protection, main criteria though is 'Best Insulation Order for sleeping warm', but I will keep your point in mind also.

Originally Posted by PDA1
If you use an insulated air bed,you can reduce the number of items carried. The mat must be on top of the air bed to prevent convection heat loss. As you are in a tent. I'm not sure why you are using a bivvy bag. Seems redundant to me.

My airbed does not have a high insulation value and I am not spending more money to replace it, my cheap little insulated compact and light mat will have to suffice .
Factual information like " The mat must be on top of the air bed to prevent convection heat loss " is exactly what I need to determine the best insulation order for keeping warm.

I'm using a bivy bag as I will be camping in freezing and below temps in very wet and windy Scotland.
Bivy big is to keep wind chill at bay and to prevent condensation and blown rain getting onto the top-quilt, I am not planning to carry an inner for the tent, no midges at the time of year I will be using this set up for .

Originally Posted by Tonyuk
I would have the mat outside the bivvy. You don't want anything in there with you restricting how the bags/quilts insulation lofts, so might be an issue unless you have a large bivvy. I would also just go with a self inflating mat and sleeping bag, that'll save you a bit of weight.

Hi Tony, yes I will have to consider how lofting may be restricted, I best take some measurements and make some calcs on that point.
Weight is not a problem, I am quite happy about the weight and pack size of the items I will be carrying.
Remaining very comfortably warm and dry are my main concerns.

 

[mrcharly]

I'd say you need to put the mats outside, mostly for the reason Nohoval gave. If you aren't in a tent, it will be sensible to be able to get in the bivi while still able to eat etc. It's best to conserve heat rather than have to warm up.

 

[rorymax]

I'd say you need to put the mats outside, mostly for the reason Nohoval gave. If you aren't in a tent, it will be sensible to be able to get in the bivi while still able to eat etc. It's best to conserve heat rather than have to warm up.

I will be in a tent mrcharly.

I don't make tea\coffee or cook food lying in bed, when it's time to get up I'm straight out of the sack and getting on with it, only time I need to warm up again is if I have to get out for a P during the night.

rorymax

 

[Nohoval_Turrets]

I don't make tea\coffee or cook food lying in bed, when it's time to get up I'm straight out of the sack and getting on with it

You're just the worst type of person

 

[Shewie]

Bivvy bag in a tent, does it leak?

 

[rorymax]

Bivvy bag in a tent, does it leak?

Bivy bag leaks like sieve, why else would I bring a tent ?

You been skim reading again Shewie ?

 

[mrcharly]

Bivy bag leaks like sieve, why else would I bring a tent ?

You been skim reading again Shewie ?

You haven't said your bivvi bag leaks, at least not in this thread. As I said, getting in your bivvi bag isn't about being a lazy slug, it is about conserving heat.

 

[Shewie]

Bivy bag leaks like sieve, why else would I bring a tent ?

You been skim reading again Shewie ?

No inner, makes sense

 

[rorymax]

You haven't said your bivvi bag leaks, at least not in this thread. As I said, getting in your bivvi bag isn't about being a lazy slug, it is about conserving heat.

Bivi bag does not leak mrcharly, my remark was merely an attempt at a riposte to Shewie's mischievousness.

And I do take your point about conserving heat .

Edit: posted after Shewie's reply :welcome:

 

[rorymax]

No inner, makes sense

Yeah, trying to cut down on some weight and the time taken to pack \unpack Shewie.

I don't want to carry extra clothing if I can help it, part of the reason for asking the 'insulation' question. I reckon I can pack lighter\smaller if I get the sleeping chamber more efficient.

Well, that is the idea, but always happy to accept advice.

 

[mrcharly]

You are going to camp in scotland but don't want to carry a tent inner (or am I misunderstanding)?

forget the debate bout insulation order; focus on midge protection.

 

[rorymax]

You are going to camp in scotland but don't want to carry a tent inner (or am I misunderstanding)?

forget the debate bout insulation order; focus on midge protection.

I had already mentioned the inner (or lack of) and midges mrcharly, have you been skim reading too .
, I have had more experiences of those little darlings than my indiscretions merit.


I fear this thread is going , anyone got advice on the insulation question then .

 

[mrcharly]

I've said my 2p worth - yes I did miss your statement about "no midges this time of year". With the erratic weather, does that sort of assumption still apply?

If you are very keen on saving weight, why the airbed plus the insulated mat? (I'm a big softy and need padding is an acceptable answer)

 

[rorymax]

I've said my 2p worth

I'm so glad to hear that, my day just gets better and better,

And if I get bitten by a midge on my December trip I will eat my hat and start wearing clothes again (I'm becoming a bit fed up getting nicked anyway).

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