Asking a landowner for permission to hunt and snare rabbits on their land.

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DavidDavidson

Member
Apr 30, 2015
17
1
Northern Ireland
Would anyone have the best idea on how to approach a local landowner about hunting (with a catapult); I'd rather use my xbow but uk kneejerk regulations mean I can't use an air rifle without a licence (northern Ireland; where pistols are still legal to own with a licence but you can't get a bloody air-gun without one. So a xbow kill would essentially be quick and painless but a slingshot (provided it hits the chest) will cause massive internal damage, punctured lungs and all that whereas a judo point arrow would kill the rabbit outright, as would an air rifle. If they're so worried about Tom Dick and Harry getting xbows and firing field tips into targets make people complete a bowhunting licence (much like a driving licence; I can drive a car or bike round a track legally without a licence but I can't drive one on the road without facing serious consequences. A theory and practical section shouldn't be too hard to do and if they're worried about hunters injuring other hunters make it a legal requirement to wear a transponder which vibrates when you get within 300m of them; well out of bow distance; transponders and two way radios would essentially do away with that worry and make bowhunting safer than all other types and more humane whilst not hurting target archers in the slightest. Once again I completely go off on a tangent: I'll give a brief run-down on the landowners:

- Happy to let people walk in their fields, they just have a 'please close the gate sign'
- Happy to let teenagers camp in their field/s, was round with a friend and a bunch of strangers, most were under-age and all were drinking. Next thing the police showed up, thought they'd be getting the booze confiscated and kicked out, the police just said the landowner would prefer if they kept the noise down as they live within earshot are trying to sleep and to extinguish the fire and not light another one, as people were clearly drunk.
- Happy to let people pick 'wild mushrooms' in their fields

That's about all I know about them but they seem friendly enough; I was thinking of approaching, well dressed (long hair trimmed at the fringe), mentioning that they have plenty of rabbits on their land and asking if I could hunt without firearms, using UK legal snares (put in a comment that I'll check twice as often as is legally required) and a ghillie suit and slingshot combo. Then offer to give them every second or third catch if they want (after gutting, skinning, cleaning and removing the head as a skinned rabbit can look a bit disturbing with those always open staring eyes) as well as that I'll ask if there's days or times they'd rather I not be there (if permitted) and finally if all goes well get a pre-printed note of permission signed by them, just to keep me covered when carrying my knife, snare wire and slingshot up there, to show to police in case I'm stopped by them on the walk up, or they think I'm poaching. Letting the owners know this is to save them the trouble of having the police come to the door with me in cuffs until they confirm. Papers would include my photograph and the home-owners contact # (if they want to give it out) as well as their names, address and signatures.

Would this be the best way to go about things? Or is there a better way to sweet-talk owners into letting me essentially lease land for hunting purposes? I suppose if they didn't want Rabbit meat I could offer to pay for the privilege. Any idea on the price? £20-30/month? Since it's basically 'come in and close the gate' I couldn't see them asking a huge sum for my presence on their land.
 

bridget

Banned
Apr 21, 2015
30
0
67
Exeter, Devon
As a teenager, camping out and drinking on our local small holder's land. things have changed a lot. what insurance? how to sweet talk a land owner? trust my friends is the key I think, locals and their neighbours all 'helpout' each other on a regular basis.

we need to become a 'neighbour' and build up on trust first, second & third. offer to come out with them, on a round-up round, do they shoot there own pests etc.,

if you dont ask, you will never know... my two cents worth hth

Tony Bridge
 
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British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,886
2,138
Mercia
If there are people on the fields are there any dogs off the lead? Any badgers, hares, foxes etc?

If any of the above its not a suitable place for snaring as the chance of catching a non target species is unreasonably high. I don't even snare my own land using live catch cage traps and despatching in trap since there are cats and badgers around here.

I agree on the insurance, the first thing I would require. I would also want to see evidence of hitting a 2p piece ten out of ten times at sixty feet which I would consider bare minimum marksmanship.
 

mrcharly

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 25, 2011
3,257
45
North Yorkshire, UK
So a xbow kill would essentially be quick and painless but a slingshot (provided it hits the chest) will cause massive internal damage, punctured lungs and all that whereas a judo point arrow would kill the rabbit outright, as would an air rifle.
You don't know a lot about hunting and shooting, do you?

Most of what you have said here is nonsense, sorry.

Not sure what to suggest, maybe what bridget/Tony said about building up trust, getting to know people first.

If you have permission to hunt on some land, I suspect getting an air rifle licence will be much easier.
 

Goatboy

Full Member
Jan 31, 2005
14,956
18
Scotland
I agree that insurance would go a long way to helping you get permission. I always had cover and it gave peace of mind to the landowners who let me hunt on their land. You can get insurance that will cover you in Northern Ireland using a catapult for around £30 a year.
 

DavidDavidson

Member
Apr 30, 2015
17
1
Northern Ireland
Had no idea about insurance, thanks for that but where do I go about getting it, tried looking it up but all I got was shooting insurance. Is that it or am I barking up the wrong tree?
You don't know a lot about hunting and shooting, do you?
Not all that much, no. Fishing, yes, hunting, no. As for an air rifle licence I live in the suburbs (but fields with rabbits, cows, etc are a fifteen minute walk away) and having a few run ins with the authorities (no violent crime, no property/financial crime, no crime that could harm another) getting that licence may be somewhat harder than normal; that said I could try and probably would get it if I had permission to hunt on land. That said I am a crack shot with an xbow and before practising on rabbits I would be practising on cutouts or cans.

Most of what you have said here is nonsense, sorry.
While I appreciate and respect criticism from someone with much more experience than I, I would prefer that criticism tell me why what I am saying is nonsense, otherwise I'll just end up rather confused. (no sarcasm).

Not sure about foxes but none of the rest, except maybe dogs off their leash
though I've seen an abundance of rabbits and they aren't too shy either, so I'd presume that there would be nothnh to kill the rabbit and eat it whilst it's snared. Besides there are such a large abundance I'd probably wait with my ghillie suit on (pet project of mine when I was 18, in thick grass I'm 'invisible' unless you're feet away. I'd just lay there with the slingshot (after getting rid of the people smell on the suit, probably by soaking in mud, unless there's an easier way) I can just lie there with a smartphone or book, catapult and binoculars.

@bridget; I'll definitely ask them all of that.

Thanks for all your input guys, you've all been very informative.
 
Feb 21, 2015
393
0
Durham
Dear OP, Im sure its not just me, but you seem to be quite angry in your rant ..... that and you clearly know B****ER ALL about people..... you don't 'sweet-talk' That in itself would be a reason if i was a land owner i would say no....you 'ask permission', respectfully, and politley......it doesn't matter what anyone else does on their land.....

If you want a farmer/landowner to let you use his or her land, you first need to build up TRUST, maybe your best approach would be to offer yourself willingly, for free, to help out around the place, explain that you wish to learn more about the land and how things work, and that by helping you hope to 'maybe' and that is key...maybe, show that you are trustworthy enough to in time ask permission to take the odd bunny for the pot.

In 30 years of living on 40 acres of land my Dad only twice let anyone hunt....and that was because they asked if they could do anything to help, no strings,,,,with the possibility of 'maybe' later on getting permission. One man came up every 2 weeks for a full Saturday, mending fences, chopping logs, clearing brush, helping out unpaid. He never asked or mentioned the shooting again. After 7 or 8 months my Dad said to him 'John, anytime you want, you can shoot my land, just be sensible, leave no cartridges and only you or you and your son together no one else' ( his son was 21 and had helped out a couple of times)
John then enjoyed 12 years or so until we sold the place, of shooting once or twice a week, as long as we knew he was there, which wasn't hard, his bright red VW camper parked outside our Barn was a dead giveaway. And he still helped out if we needed a hand.
Sometimes you have to give.......to receive.
 
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DavidDavidson

Member
Apr 30, 2015
17
1
Northern Ireland
Personally bowhunting in the uk gets me a little riled up, I shouldn't have ranted about it in an unrelated thread, for that I apologise.
I probably used the wrong phrase when I said 'sweet taking' from my OP
That's about all I know about them but they seem friendly enough; I was thinking of approaching, well dressed (long hair trimmed at the fringe), mentioning that they have plenty of rabbits on their land and asking if I could hunt without firearms, using UK legal snares (put in a comment that I'll check twice as often as is legally required) [sic] and use a slingshot for hunting too.
I know they don't use firearms as there are no backstops at all; one way leads to a Glen which is walked by people quite often, usually with children. (and the rabbits come from this side) and the other side on which the rabbits are drops off onto suburban housing, so firearms would be extremely dangerous to use there as the chance of hitting a person because of a lack of backstops is very high and all it takes is for you to have your finger on the trigger, squeezing to take the shot then something completely unexpected to happen (for example a bird ****ting right on your head/face and you've probably jumped, missed your target and sent a bullet somewhere where it shouldn't be.

As for offering to help, I'm not sure how much their land needs tending though I would offer to help, would asking if it were okay to hunt, then if told no offering to help, no strings attached be an acceptable course of action? Naturally they'll know I'll want to hunt but once they get to trust me a little more then maybe they would let me, if not I get to do a bit of manual labour.

NB since I'm new here I think posts have to pass moderation first, I;ve made 2 recent posts to this thread. If the moderator reviewing could possibly merge them so as I don't double post I'd be much obliged, if not apologies for the double post.
 

artschool

Forager
Sep 14, 2014
111
1
chester
all it takes is for you to have your finger on the trigger, squeezing to take the shot then something completely unexpected to happen (for example a bird ****ting right on your head/face and you've probably jumped, missed your target and sent a bullet somewhere where it shouldn't be.

this is a ridiculous thing to say.

why don't you contact the BASC and ask about opportunities for young people to get into shooting?
 

DavidDavidson

Member
Apr 30, 2015
17
1
Northern Ireland
Not sure if BASC operates in Northern Ireland but I'll fire them an email anyway

this is a ridiculous thing to say.
Say what you will, but when shooting without backstops Murphy's law comes into effect. Shooting without backstops is bad enough in my albeit extremely limited knowledge of firearms, but I wouldn't practice with my crossbow (160b) without backstops. This area is on a hill with a thin hedge between the public walkway on your left from the entrance (where the rabbits seem to have their warren), behind you is a well used road with footpath and to the right of you is a moderately used 'country road' so the only place you could really be sure you have to face to the right, in the complete opposite direction of the warren where the hill continues upwards. Which is why I said I'd rsther hunt sans firearms or air rifles (since the reason you need a licence for one here is because some idiot was shooting at the fire brigade and accidentally hit a four year old in the head, killing him; see UK and kneejerk reactions) thus with a public walkway on a slope down from the warren the land owners would definitely worry about use of firearms. Despite living in this area all my life I have never seen shooting in any of the fields nearby.
 

birchwood

Nomad
Sep 6, 2011
460
108
Kent
The point about dogs, badgers ,hares and foxes which you seem to have missed is that they are going to get in your `rabbit` snares. Not that they were going to eat the rabbit.
Also you mention the proximity of houses so peoples pet cats will be roaming about.
Snares are indiscriminate and having seen the results of misuse imho, there are better ways of catching food.
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,886
2,138
Mercia
If there are dogs off the leash then snaring is out, you could injure a dog and be legally liable for that injury. Clearly it is illegal for you to hunt with a crossbow whatever the land.

I very much doubt that you are accurate enough with a slingshot to not risk injury.

This leads me to believe that the land is unsuitable for the purpose that you wish.

My suggestion would be to get a shotgun certificate, learn to shoot accurately and safely and then seek a more suitable permission.

Not wanting to do paperwork is no reason to hunt on unsuitable land or with unsuitable tools. Get a proper gun, training, permission and insurance and enjoy the sport for life. I was bought a brand new shotgun for £150 last month so it need not be an expensive sport.
 

Bowlander

Full Member
Nov 28, 2011
1,353
1
Forest of Bowland
If there are dogs off the leash then snaring is out, you could injure a dog and be legally liable for that injury. Clearly it is illegal for you to hunt with a crossbow whatever the land.

I very much doubt that you are accurate enough with a slingshot to not risk injury.

This leads me to believe that the land is unsuitable for the purpose that you wish.

My suggestion would be to get a shotgun certificate, learn to shoot accurately and safely and then seek a more suitable permission.

Not wanting to do paperwork is no reason to hunt on unsuitable land or with unsuitable tools. Get a proper gun, training, permission and insurance and enjoy the sport for life. I was bought a brand new shotgun for £150 last month so it need not be an expensive sport.
Well said!!
 

K813ZRA

Member
May 1, 2015
37
0
Spain
Wow, this is a rather informative thread. There are many examples of just how different rules and regulations are from place to place. Having grown up in Pennsylvania asking for permission to hut on land was more of a courtesy than a requirement as most land is posted as either open to hunting, requiring permission or closed. Also, the tools that are allowed are different as well. As I am sure most of you know, guns are easy to get in the US and are the norm for hunting. That being said, not only are we not allowed to hunt with slingshots but in many states we are not allowed to own them. Most states don't allow the use of snares either. Pennsylvania does but only after a certification course.

Also, though we have required a weapons safety course for years from my understanding there is now a course on the ethical treatment of animals. IE, how to dispatch them properly to ensure the least amount of suffering.

As for how things work here in Spain, I haven't got the foggiest. I haven't been and won't be here long enough to experience that, likely.

Anyway, good luck with your hunting endeavor!
 

WoodGnome

Tenderfoot
Mar 4, 2015
67
1
Germany/Northern Ireland
I think I'd just go ahead and ask them straight away. The worst that can happen is that they say "No", which does not effect your current situation at all. But I also second the idea of making sure that the piece of land is suitable for hunting and getting a shotgun license. This might be on your plus side if asking permission because it at least gives the other side the impression that you know what you do.

Where in Northern Ireland, btw?
 

DavidDavidson

Member
Apr 30, 2015
17
1
Northern Ireland
Personally I prefer the American way. Also public land should be open to public hunting without paying the state as it's our land and not the land of the state's.
I've had a very informative email from a moderator on how best to handle things and I'll probably do things his way, I live just on the outskirts of belfast (fields ten minutes away on foot) but there is never any shooting done in them. I just wouldn't want a shotgun since you might pay £150 for the gun, but then you need to shell out for a cabinet (usually >£100) and have the police come round to your house for regular checks. Not my cup of tea. Besides I should hopefully be leaving the UK for Denmark in a year anyway. Much better than living in Airstrip 1.
As a complete and utter libertarian I feel lots of UK laws need changing (guns being one of them) but I'll not get into that.
 
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