Advice needed - fire by friction - bow drill

[greensurfingbear]

Ive been attempting to do the ole bow drill fire starting.

Made all the pieces really quickly. had some hazel from my garden.

get lots of smoke but dont ever seem to get charr to ignite.

Need some advice please

 

[leon-1]

What colour are the grains that would normally form the ember??

They should be very dark brown to the point of nearly being black.

Is the wood green??

What was the hearthwood (hazel, sycamore, ivy, willow)??

A peice of pallette wood can be used.

is the bow flexing when you are bowing?

Is the cord slipping?

What are you using for your tinder bundle?

 

[greensurfingbear]

100% hazel. not green. embers are going to black....think i need to keep spinning longer

bow seems to be working ok. think it is more my technique lol

first cord I tried melted....am using nylon rope at the mo as it is all I have to hand.

 

[leon-1]

Sounds like you are getting to much friction on the cord (hence it melting).

Are you applying a lot of pressure on the bearing block and as such the cord slips a lot on the drill.

If so ease back on the pressure and you may be able to go faster with less slippage.

or tighten the cord a bit more so that it grips the drill better.

The other option is Egyptian bowdrill, from what I have heard less friction on the cord, no slippage and better when it comes to wear and tear.

If you think that you may have to bow a little longer, when you think you are there give it another twenty passes at speed.

 

[torjusg]

Instead of making higher and higher pressure, try making faster and faster spinning. It has highened my succesrate.

Torjus Gaaren

 

[rich59]

Well done for the attempts!!! Any pictures you can show?

 

[falling rain]

Greensurfingbear,

It's very hard to fathom what you're doing wrong as regards to technique without seeing you do it. Use the whole length of the bow when drilling. Your bow should be at least as long as your arm from shoulder to finger tips, get over the top of the drill, use something better than nylon cord as it wears very quickly (melts) get into a rythm to start with and then speed things up as smoke starts being produced, when it's smoking furiously give it another 30 strokes to make sure, and use a twig or knife in the notch to hold the ember in place as you roll the hearth back out the way. You can relax a little now, and wait for the ember to build to a nice glowing nugget. (if it's smoking nicely of it's own accord when you stop drilling you're pretty much there) place your ember in the tinder bundle (flat bundle and not teased out too much) fold it around the ember but don't crush it. The ember will of course have to have contact with the tinder and gradually increase your strength of blowing it into life.
I thought I was patient as a keen fishereman, but learning bowdrill brought a new meaning to it for me.

It's the old thing of 'you can't learn somethings from a book alone' and it's really difficult to write about techniques for bow drilling as people make different mistakes, and it's a lot easier to advise when you can be with the person. Advice on prepping the componants is a different thing but if you can make it to the workshop in December we'll sort you out I'm sure

 

[greensurfingbear]

workshop where and when?? how much info much appeciated


your right showing some one is better than reading.....

I think it is down to technique not drilling long enough...and by the sound of it the bow I am using is too short and I am using the wrong kinda rope.
Tend to get smoke then I get excited the the drill tends to fly off. I tried to make the eyptian bow ie tying the drill to the saw but dont think I got it right.

making all the components only took about 10 mins, I had some cut hazel stored in the garage.... maybe I should put up some pics

 

[leon-1]

making all the components only took about 10 mins, I had some cut hazel stored in the garage.... maybe I should put up some pics

Yep get some pictures up, I have a fair amount of sycamore here if you wish to try a different hearth wood as well.

 

[greensurfingbear]

came across this in my web browsing at work...

http://imnh.isu.edu/Public/JustForK...x/SubMenu_5/content_3A_DrillActivity_temp.htm


used as a drill but I think that it would make a great idea for fire by friction

 

[leon-1]

That is already a method of fire by friction. IIRC they call it the fire pump and they do go into making them in some of the books, can't remember which ones off the top of my head.

I know that Dave Watson has been known to teach this method as well

 

[gaz_miggy]

sorry to but in on ur thread greensurfingbear but i was wondering what the best tinder was for the ember i was trying to use dry bracken (ferns) my bundle was about the size of an apple. is this good tinder cuz i couldnt seam to get it to light

 

[rich59]

sorry to but in on ur thread greensurfingbear but i was wondering what the best tinder was for the ember i was trying to use dry bracken (ferns) my bundle was about the size of an apple. is this good tinder cuz i couldnt seam to get it to light

Different people use different things. No problem with bracken if it is dry and crunchy. However, like all leaf bundles you need to turn at least some of the bundle to powder by rubbing thoroughly between your hands. Make a bit your bundle into a teaspoon or so of finely divided, dusty, crumbly stuff, either at the edge or in the heart of your bundle. Then place your glowing ember against this. Gently blow the ember into the dusty stuff and then you should have a large enough mass of heat to get the rest of the bundle. If the whole bundle does not burst into flame then too wet or too small. Keep the bundle well compacted - I put a bit of wood or bundle of twigs on the top.

 

[gaz_miggy]

right what am i doing rong iv got evrything made of sycamore all dry but not getting

it hot enuff make an ember. my cord is liping as well is this the problem? the

bering block seams 2 get hotter than the bord its self i am getting powder its just

a bown colour not going dark

 

[Goose]

Don't know if sycamore is a good wood for it!
The other problem might be because the atmosphere is damp too, it is easier in the summer on a nice dry day!
Put some butter on your bearing block to oil it, you will be surprised at the difference it will make.
Is the powder smoking, and does it carry on smoking after you stop drilling?

 

[rich59]

Cord slipping - try it with a couple of turns round the drill
- you may need to tighten the cord as it stretches with use. Find a grip that allows taking up of any slack

Not getting it hot - start slow. When you get some smoke slow down even more for a while so you just get a bit of smoke. This will help drive out any remaining moisture. When the smoke changes from white (steamy) to a bluer colour then speed up a little, but keep the pressure light. Finally speed up a lot to get a good mass of black powder collecting quickly before it has time to cool down.

Sycamore it pretty good - don't change it.

 

[falling rain]

workshop where and when?? how much info much appeciated


your right showing some one is better than reading.....

I think it is down to technique not drilling long enough...and by the sound of it the bow I am using is too short and I am using the wrong kinda rope.
Tend to get smoke then I get excited the the drill tends to fly off. I tried to make the eyptian bow ie tying the drill to the saw but dont think I got it right.

making all the components only took about 10 mins, I had some cut hazel stored in the garage.... maybe I should put up some pics

Have a look in meet-ups and social chatter. - Bow drill workshop
18th December 2005