2 year woodland apprenticeship

[British Red]

I see this differently. If a person goes to college or university, how much are they paid to learn? Indeed after university they are expected to pay back the cost of their taxpayer funded education if they earn a decent salary (not interested in discussing the merits of this, it is simply a fact). So why should someone be expected to be paid to learn a practical skill? There is a cost to such things (try pricing a chainsaw ticket in your area).

If a young person is seeking to learn practical skills, this strikes me as a much better route than a degree in media studies. No student loan and some pocket money too.

I know several people who are fencers and they make a decent living at it. No need to denigrate those that work with their hands - thats an insidious form of snobbery in my book. Here is an opportunity for someone to learn "on the job". Thats a good thing.

Thanks for posting Steve.

 

[Goatboy]

Apprentiships & internships have always been seen as low paid/ bound to starts to a job. When I studied forestry it was two years at the forestry shool & three working for estates or the F.C. Not the best paid jobs but I was getting a great start in life and foraged/hunted enough food to keep me fed. Once I got my tickets I could earn a fair bit contracting/doing homers.
A good fencer or tree surgeon can make a packet. Though I'm not fit enough to do it anymore I'm blown away at some of the prices fencers can charge now.
Aye things'll be tight to begin with but it's an avenue that can lead to a brilliant life. You'll never be "rich" but job satisfaction and quality of life is worth a lot to some folk, it's not all about a huge plasma telly and holidays abroad twice a year.
Sometimes it's good to give back more than you consume.
Sent via smoke-signal from a woodland in Scotland.

 

[santaman2000]

I see this differently. If a person goes to college or university, how much are they paid to learn? Indeed after university they are expected to pay back the cost of their taxpayer funded education if they earn a decent salary (not interested in discussing the merits of this, it is simply a fact). So why should someone be expected to be paid to learn a practical skill? There is a cost to such things (try pricing a chainsaw ticket in your area).

If a young person is seeking to learn practical skills, this strikes me as a much better route than a degree in media studies. No student loan and some pocket money too.

I know several people who are fencers and they make a decent living at it. No need to denigrate those that work with their hands - thats an insidious form of snobbery in my book. Here is an opportunity for someone to learn "on the job". Thats a good thing.

Thanks for posting Steve.

I was thinking along these lines also. Especially after Mary mentioned the food and board. That said, there is a place where you get paid to learn (albeit not a lot at first) Somebody already mentioned the Forces.

 

[John Fenna]

When I started in Outdoor Pursuits Education my job description was "Temporary Voluntary Assistant Instructor" and I got only my bed and board and loan of gear on top of an excellent grounding in nearly all the activities then generally available in outdoor centers - kayaking, climbing, caving, archery, ropes courses etc, plus experience in working with "deprived" groups, apprentices in trades etc
The education I received was worth having to find all my other monetary outgoings elsewhere
In those days you did not get the ole if you were doing voluntary work - I do not know if you do now - even if it was equipping you for work in the future...
I had to pay to get onto NGB qualification courses - but they were easy to pass thanks to the training I had received as a TVAI...

 

[santaman2000]

.....I am clearly minded that the vocational aspect of experience and commitment is now much in demand for admission to many further learning courses. CV's that come without are often simply discarded regardless of just how much academic prowess has been displayed.
I know of students with 6 straight A's refused admission to Vet school because they had no 'vocational experience',....

I would agree to a large degree in respect to getting a job. But if they're not accepted into university, just how would they get those straight As? Or any academic experience.

 

[dewi]

As I said above, if there is food and board involved, then its definitely a worthwhile opportunity, but if it isn't, the low wage makes the applicant in need of the bank of Mum and Dad, which limits who can apply.

I see the argument that you wouldn't get a wage for doing academic studies, but if you can't afford the luxury of extended academic studies, you don't attend the course. On the other hand a job, which this is advertised as, will inherently teach you something just as any other job does. Do warehouse work and you learn to stack shelves, operate a pallet truck and have the possibility to sit your forklift license, but does that mean you should be paid a nominal wage because you're learning while you're earning?

All I'm saying is that we seem to accept that low wages are acceptable by putting forward excuses... the applicant will learn something... well, yes, because they are doing a job they know nothing about. They should be paid less because they don't have experience... well, no, because they are doing a job that would still need to be done by someone experienced.

Wages are scandalously low in this country to begin with, but £3.30ph is taking the biscuit, running away with said biscuit and burying it (ironically) in the woods where no one will ever find it!

 

[Toddy]

Straight A's are from fifth and six year of Secondary School (though we also do 6th year Studies) The English equivalent is 6th year A levels…..I think it's three of those though.
Scottish students routinely go to University at seventeen just going on eighteen. Jamie was 17 by just five weeks, Andrew was 17 by five months. My brother couldn't be accepted into University for the course he wanted(he was doing medicine) until he was eighteen though. Instead he did Chemistry for a year first and it added on to his degree.

Either way, nursing, veterinary, medicine, dentistry….if you haven't spent time and effort to volunteer appropriately, it greatly lowers your chances of acceptance onto the course, regardless of your academic results.

Tertiary education here is either college (and those are often the apprenticeship linked too) and University.

M

 

[British Red]

As I said above, if there is food and board involved, then its definitely a worthwhile opportunity, but if it isn't, the low wage makes the applicant in need of the bank of Mum and Dad, which limits who can apply.

I see the argument that you wouldn't get a wage for doing academic studies, but if you can't afford the luxury of extended academic studies, you don't attend the course. On the other hand a job, which this is advertised as, will inherently teach you something just as any other job does

I still don't see the difference. This is not advertised as a job, but as a two year apprenticeship. If it was advertised as a hands on college course would it then be okay?

I think its absolutley fine, its two years learning for which you don't have to pay and indeed receive a bursary. Better than a two year college course in my book

 

[santaman2000]

Straight A's are from fifth and six year of Secondary School (though we also do 6th year Studies) The English equivalent is 6th year A levels…..I think it's three of those though.
Scottish students routinely go to University at seventeen just going on eighteen. Jamie was 17 by just five weeks, Andrew was 17 by five months. My brother couldn't be accepted into University for the course he wanted(he was doing medicine) until he was eighteen though. Instead he did Chemistry for a year first and it added on to his degree.

Either way, nursing, veterinary, medicine, dentistry….if you haven't spent time and effort to volunteer appropriately, it greatly lowers your chances of acceptance onto the course, regardless of your academic results.

Tertiary education here is either college (and those are often the apprenticeship linked too) and University.

M

Sounds mostly similar to here. It takes a minimum High School GPA (Grade Point Average) to get into some programs; although there's not an emphasis on how those grades get averaged (so many As, etc) and a minimum score on one of the two entrance exams (and these scores will over-ride any GPA anyway)

College and University tend to be interchangeable words here and yes, some degrees may offer Summer Internships with the related industry (particularly engineering, scientific, management, or financial programs)

I suppose the one big difference being that we'd not really consider anything below college/university level as accademic achievement. You either have the HS diploma or you don't.

 

[Tony]

I think i'm with Hugh and others on this, It's an opportunity for someone that's interested and as long asa they recognise that it's an educational experience and go into it with their eyes open it's a good opportunity for the right person, it's a skill base that can lead to many other things in life, many of which will pay more etc, for many having enough and loving their work is a great position to be in.

 

[dewi]

I still don't see the difference. This is not advertised as a job, but as a two year apprenticeship. If it was advertised as a hands on college course would it then be okay?

I think its absolutley fine, its two years learning for which you don't have to pay and indeed receive a bursary. Better than a two year college course in my book

Fair enough.. only my opinion, and it isn't as if its going to change anything.

 

[Palaeocory]

I think this is a great opportunity for the right person... exactly, if this was a college course they'd have to pay instead of getting paid. And it's directly useful to those entrepreneurial youngsters that want to start up a bushcraft company or related career... I can think of lots of business ideas where this background would be a great asset. Life's not all about money, and you can certainly develop a nice life for yourself with the right mix of opportunities and this...

 

[Macaroon]

This strikes me as a brilliant opportunity for the right person; when you're in your late teens/twenties two years is a reasonable amount of time to devote to something like this if your inclinations were running in this rough direction. As with everything in life you get out of these things what you put in, and sometimes multiples thereof. A young person who went into this with their eyes open and a willing attitude could come away with life enhancing skills, all of which would be eminently transferable; and think of the networking.................if you approached this properly you'd be able to build up a great contacts list and learn the lie of the land, so to speak.

Back when I was employing people, when I saw something like this on a C.V., that candidate would immediately have a head start on others who didn't. If I knew anybody who was remotely thinking of making their way in this field I'd thoroughly recommend this as a serious potentially great way in.

 

[widu13]

Well done, have a biscuit... I wasn't whining or whining, I was illustrating a point, a point you've completely missed in your I-was-worse-off-than-you game you've chosen to play. Frankly I couldn't give a rats hoot if you survived a month on three quid and a tin of beans, it doesn't answer the point I was making, nor does it advance the discussion.

When you're quite done with your side show, anything on topic?

Dry your eyes Dewi. It was in reply to hardships raised by you.

This is an opportunity not long term employment. If you don't like it or agree with it so be it. I've said my piece, hopefully the person who succeeds in being awarded the apprenticeship learns valuable skills.

 

[dewi]

Dry your eyes Dewi. It was in reply to hardships raised by you.

This is an opportunity not long term employment. If you don't like it or agree with it so be it. I've said my piece, hopefully the person who succeeds in being awarded the apprenticeship learns valuable skills.

I was making a general point about not all 16 year olds being in the same boat, which I cited an example of, but you've insisted on turning into trading insults. Not entirely sure why, but whatever. Not particularly interested.

 

[Tengu]

Like several have said, seems to be a great opportunity in the right hands.

(Says she who is studying a course which will lead to a non existent and poorly paid job...But Im having great fun.)

 

[didicoy]

Investment in knowledge pays the highest interest.
Chances are the candidate could live in a caravan at the Woodyard/ sawmills. Pay no rent and sleep in a tent, push for free electricity and all the overtime/ night security you could wish for.