Gun Advice

[durulz]

Hello All.
What's the law on the ownership and use of airguns on public land? Well, both gas-powered guns and good old fashioned airguns that you have to break to power and load; assuming there's a legal difference - thought gas-powered may count as a gas-powered firearm.
I will NOT be shooting animals.
Do I have to have a licence? Am I allowed on public land with one (to be honest, I suspect not, but just wondered)?
All those kinds of things.
Like I say, I will not be shooting any animals, so not looking for permission to kill anything.

Cheers.

 

[Everything Mac]

as far as i know you are not allowed on public land with an airgun.

you are allowed to shoot on private land with permission as long as your pellets do not go out of the bounds of the land.

does not matter what you are shooting at - you are on public property with a weapon = an armed response.


in short - don't.
andy

 

[BorderReiver]

Regardless of the law, you will get nothing but grief if you attempt to use an air rifle on any land without written permission of the owner. All land is owned by someone, even public land.

 

[Bushwhacker]

The airgun will have to be limited to 12ft/lbs. Whether it's a gas or spring powered doesn't matter.
You can only shoot on private land WITH PERMISSION.

 

[Adze]

Your chances will be a big fat zero mate.

In public the gun must be covered and unloaded at all times IIRC.

Provided the gun imparts less than 12lbft of energy at the muzzle then you do not require a licence for ownership. If it produces more than 12 lbft then you require a FAC (Fire Arms Certificate) which will, usually at least, require somewhere 'approved' to shoot it - that is regardless of what you'll be shooting with it.

Basically, doing anything illegal while in possession of an airgun (whether or not it's below the legal licensing limit) will be called a 'firearms offence' and you don't want to go to court to try and defend against one of those.

Gas powered, meaning compressed air or CO2 is an airgun, the same as a spring airgun - licensing is dependant on how much muzzle energy it imparts. If you meant gas powered as in combustion of a flammable gas with air or other means, then I've no experience of those but I would imagine that would be a firearm requiring a licence.

 

[Miyagi]

Agreed about public land - sheesh doesn't bear thinking about!!

Even on private land with permission stay 50yrds (or is it metres?) from any paths, rights of way etc. No permission is armed trespass.

As said make sure no pellets leave the boundary of your permitted shoot and only shoot when there is a "backstop" behind your quarry should you miss.

No air rifle clubs in your area?

Gone are the days when teenagers could bimble about with an air rifle even just plinking at tin cans etc.

Even if you have permission your rifle can be confiscated, it will be calibrated to make sure it's below 12ft lbs etc and can take an age to be returned.

Good advice from earlier posters.

 

[durulz]

OK, lovely - cheers all.
I thought that would be the case.
Pity. I've just been given an old rifle by a family friend and would like to do some target shooting with it. Not interested in shooting living things, just paper targets and stuff.
Oh well.

 

[HillBill]

Are there any shooting clubs over your way mate?

Oh BTW for all you who say you cant shoot in a public place. The law on airguns is the same as knives. If you have a reasonable reason for having it then its fine.

to quote the law

"An offence to possess an airgun in a public place without lawful authority or a reasonable excuse."

And

"Any airgun regardless of it's power is considered a 'firearm' if it is used to commit a criminal offence"

So the law states that an airgun is only a firearm when used to commit an offence and that you can have it on public land with a reasonable reason for doing so.

Listening to the above it would seem we need permission to use knives too as the law is the same.

Permisson applies to private land, we own public land. Act like a tit and your stuffed, act like a responsible adult with respect for others and ensure the safety of others first and you wont have much trouble.

 

[HillBill]

Just for comparison.

knife law word for word about public places.

" It is an offence for any person, without lawful authority or good reason, to have with him in a public place, any article which has a blade or is sharply pointed except for a folding pocket-knife which has a cutting edge to its blade not exceeding 3 inches"

airgun law

An offence to possess an airgun in a public place without lawful authority or a reasonable excuse.
It is an offence to fire an airgun within 50 feet of the centre of a public highway

So to sum up. What applies to one applies to the other equally. THAT is the word of the law, not me. Saying you need permission to use an airgun anywhere means you need permission to use a knife anywhere. Which as we all know you do not.

Stay 20 metres away from a path or road, shoot at targets only and you are on the correct side of the law.

 

[Buckshot]

Even on private land with permission stay 50yrds (or is it metres?) from any paths, rights of way etc. No permission is armed trespass.

Amazingly it's 50 feet (17 yards) and measured from the centre line of the right of way, not the nearest part/edge.

 

[Miyagi]

Amazingly it's 50 feet (17 yards) and measured from the centre line of the right of way, not the nearest part/edge.

Yes, you're right, I added metres because that's a "safer" distance to be. I erred on the side of caution.

I'd imagine this distance was based on the old airguns that didn't have the power nor range they have today.

Airguns are the devil's toys these days in Scotland and the Gov't are looking to ban them.

I'd happily pay a license to use one if it came to it, as I shoot targets and for my dinner, some vermin.

Talking of shooting vermin it's a pity we didn't get paid for every Burberry baseball cap we handed in....

 

[Adze]

"An offence to possess an airgun in a public place without lawful authority or a reasonable excuse" - agreed. I love the argument "because we all own public property" too.

Sadly, very few magistrates would consider "because I fancied shooting some tin cans on the school footie pitch" as a "reasonable excuse".

There are other areas of the Firearms Act 1968 which could also apply - section 21A would be a good example.

In short - don't shoot airguns on public land, you'll get arrested at the least and 6 months in pokey with a £5k fine at the worst.

 

[HillBill]

"An offence to possess an airgun in a public place without lawful authority or a reasonable excuse" - agreed. I love the argument "because we all own public property" too.

Sadly, very few magistrates would consider "because I fancied shooting some tin cans on the school footie pitch" as a "reasonable excuse".

There are other areas of the Firearms Act 1968 which could also apply - section 21A would be a good example.

In short - don't shoot airguns on public land, you'll get arrested at the least and 6 months in pokey with a £5k fine at the worst.

It is one of those grey areas i admit, but in the word of the law it is possible, What i do if i want to shoot some groups which i cant do at the gunclub as they dont have a place to put up targets and such only the knockdowns. There is a wood i use, its public land. I go away from the path, set a range up, pin the targets to a backboard i made which pellets cannot pass through etc. Basically from my expierience it works like this. If you show responsibility and your prioritys are safety for others, and it will show with your set up then you are generally ok as people will see you are no idiot with a gun and if the police do show up they will also see it, they will see responsibility and treat the situation as such. I have sat and talked to the police and had a brew with them in such an instance and they were quite happy for me to be doing what i was doing.

Its all about the first impressions.

What is a reasonable excuse to carry an air rifle? There are none other than shooting with it or going to shoot with it. Its how you are shooting with it that makes the difference. Like with a knife it is how you are using the knife and in what context that matters not where or when. The law is the same and even worded almost the same.

Firearms laws only apply if an offence has been commited. Shooting on public land obeying the 50 yard rule but more importantly, shooting safely and responsibly is not an offence if you are shooting targets. Note the law states you need "reasonable excuse" to shoot the rifle while with a knife it states "good reason" so you need a more solid reason for carrying a knife than an air rifle

Did you know that the 50 yard rule applys everywhere and that if your back garden is within 17 metres of the centre of the road then you are breaking the law weather in your garden or not?


In short It is not an offence to shoot on public land at all. Please dont state that you WILL get arrested as i can assure you that this is not the case.

You do realise if thats your opinion on the laws wording then that HAS to be you opinion on knives as it is the same. Do you use a knife in a public place? In the woods/campsites/work?

 

[Miyagi]

Thanks for putting that into perspective Hillbill.

A very good post that IMHO.

 

[HillBill]

Amazingly it's 50 feet (17 yards) and measured from the centre line of the right of way, not the nearest part/edge.

Even more amazingly is that its the shooter that has to be 50ft away, not the target.

 

[Shewie]

OK, lovely - cheers all.
I thought that would be the case.
Pity. I've just been given an old rifle by a family friend and would like to do some target shooting with it. Not interested in shooting living things, just paper targets and stuff.
Oh well.

How big's your garden ?

If I sit in the dining room with the back door open I can get a good 40yds. Just need to make sure our lass is out first though.

 

[HillBill]

How big's your garden ?

If I sit in the dining room with the back door open I can get a good 40yds. Just need to make sure our lass is out first though.

Is your back door 50 ft from the centre of the road Rich? Illegal if not Wouldnt worry about it though mate. You'd not get in trouble

 

[dean4442]

Sorry but I'm afraid that if you shoot whilst on public land you will be in a world of hurt should the police find you! This is from the BASC website Linky http://www.basc.org.uk/en/utilities/document-summary.cfm/docid/00E7F47F-F5C0-4DA5-98B0BF55BA67E338

"It is an offence under Section 19 of the Firearms Act 1968 for anyone without
lawful authority or reasonable excuse to have with him in a public place a
loaded shotgun or loaded air weapon or any other firearm, (whether loaded or
not) together with ammunition suitable for use in that firearm."

If you are on your property then you can shoot next to a footpath as long as no one is stopped from moving along it, even if they are too scared to walk besides you a police officer could state this was enough. From the same BASC document.

"In Section 161 of the Highways Act 1980 it states: It is an offence without
lawful authority or excuse to light a fire, or discharge any firearm or firework
within 50 feet of the centre of any highway which consists of or comprises a
carriageway, and if in consequence any user of the highway is injured,
interrupted or endangered that person is liable to a fine."

 

[HillBill]

Thats all well and good, but firearms laws only apply to airguns AFTER an offence has been committed by one, not before. So you need to commit an offence first for that to apply.

Plus it says without lawful authority or reasonable excuse. Again exactly the same as knives. Dont let it confuse you.

 

[dean4442]

Did you not see this part?
"It is an offence under Section 19 of the Firearms Act 1968 for anyone without
lawful authority or reasonable excuse to have with him in a public place a
loaded shotgun or loaded air weapon or any other firearm, (whether loaded or
not) together with ammunition suitable for use in that firearm."

So for you to say that it's ok to go onto public land, set up some targets and shoot away is not only wrong but also illegal!