I stand corrected, as I said, just a thought that came into my head, nothing to back it up. thanks for putting me straight, I won't give it a go.
What weight can I carry?
- Thread starter Minotaur
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I stand corrected, as I said, just a thought that came into my head, nothing to back it up. thanks for putting me straight, I won't give it a go.
Looking at my kit, I was surprised to see that my water carrying kit weighs over half a kilo alone. That's 330g for a 2L Platypus and 227g for a 1L Osprey bottle. Do any lightweight experts have tips for reducing that? You're going to say dump the Osprey, right?
Well I'd say dump them both if you want to save weight. I usually carry a couple of PET bottles like the ones they use for carbonated water and other fizzy drinks. A two litre bottle weighs less than 40 grammes. They're tough as old boots, you can squash them flat to stow them in your pack empty and they'll still hold water afterwards even if they are a bit crinkly. They'll hold fuels too. You never have to worry about washing them, they're disposable. Cut them in half and you have both a cup and a funnel. Cut into strips they make good firelighters. In a pinch you can stuff them up your shirt empty for extra buoyancy. Steven Segal uses them to suppress firearms but I haven't tried that one myself.
It is likely that the heavy package was originally a Parcelforce one that the Parcelforce guy didn't want to deliver hence it would have been dumped in the back of the Royal Mail sorting office for the postie to deliver. They're supposed to be bad for that or at least until the threat of redundancies come along then they will do their job! However the rest of the time they are known for being work shy. My kind of people!!
I second the mention above regarding the weight of the actual pack- very often forgotten! I got a Karrimor sabre 60-100 a while back, and was staggered by the weight of it compared with my 25 year old karrimor it replaces.
I did a long timed trek over the more pointy bits of the brecon beacons a few years back with the military, carrying 55lbs plus water, food and rifle- in KG, that probably adds up to about 32kg. Thoroughly unpleasant, made slightly bearable by the constant munching on a cocktail of pain killers. The heaviest load i ever carried with them was in excess of 85kg. It would take two of your mates to pull you upright if ever you rested or fell over. Absolutely ridiculous, and progress was extremely slow as you can imagine. These days my knees are in bits, which is a shame for a bloke in his early 30s.
I learnt a good lesson though- the weight of your pack at the start of your trek can increase if it rains- especially over a couple of days. Packing up a wet tent/tarp, wet waterproofs, clothing, and just the fabric of your pack itself adds up. (this was hammered home to me when i made the mistake of attaching 60 hessian sandbags to the outside of my bergen, and a large expanse of hessian attached to chicken wire- fool).
Also, it is worth remembering that every unit of weight on your feet (heavy boots/wet socks etc.) is equivalent to five times that in your pack for energy expended. So lighter weight footwear pays real dividends.
I did a long timed trek over the more pointy bits of the brecon beacons a few years back with the military, carrying 55lbs plus water, food and rifle- in KG, that probably adds up to about 32kg. Thoroughly unpleasant, made slightly bearable by the constant munching on a cocktail of pain killers. The heaviest load i ever carried with them was in excess of 85kg. It would take two of your mates to pull you upright if ever you rested or fell over. Absolutely ridiculous, and progress was extremely slow as you can imagine. These days my knees are in bits, which is a shame for a bloke in his early 30s.
I learnt a good lesson though- the weight of your pack at the start of your trek can increase if it rains- especially over a couple of days. Packing up a wet tent/tarp, wet waterproofs, clothing, and just the fabric of your pack itself adds up. (this was hammered home to me when i made the mistake of attaching 60 hessian sandbags to the outside of my bergen, and a large expanse of hessian attached to chicken wire- fool).
Also, it is worth remembering that every unit of weight on your feet (heavy boots/wet socks etc.) is equivalent to five times that in your pack for energy expended. So lighter weight footwear pays real dividends.
I agree with ged, but also hydration packs have other downsides too. Yes they are heavy, but it can also be impossible to tell exactly how much water you have left in them. On a similar subject, they are no good for measuring water for making food. They are hard to clean, and easy to go mouldy. For bikes or running they are pretty good, but not ideal for walking IMHO. Another problem some inexperienced walkers get with hydration packs in cold weather is the water in the tube freezing, and thus making them unusable. (the water needs to be 'blown' back into the bladder to prevent this after drinking).
In the 'at a pinch' catagory, you can also lay a fizzy drinks bottle on the embers of your fire to heat the water in it to make a drink. The criteria for this is that the water has to COMPLETELY fill the bottle with no air gaps, and you need to keep the bottle cap away from the embers as it will melt. Otherwise just put the body of the bottle onto the embers, and it wil easily heat to water to 60-70 degrees C.
Another 'at a pinch' idea is that a partially inflated bottle can be placed into a jacket or top, and this makes quite a comfy pillow.
250ml or 500 ml fizzy bottles are also ideal for carrying meths. They are very strong, and will not buckle or melt. They are much lighter than sigg type bottles. It is also worth pointing out that the MSR fuel bottles are also only suitable for petrol carrying and not meths as they have no plastic liner, and meths will eventually eat pin holes in them. This also applies to some cheap sigg copies.
The last (for now) at a pinch use is to cut the bottle in half and use the lower portion as a urine collector to avoid the need to leave your tent on cold nights.
In the 'at a pinch' catagory, you can also lay a fizzy drinks bottle on the embers of your fire to heat the water in it to make a drink. The criteria for this is that the water has to COMPLETELY fill the bottle with no air gaps, and you need to keep the bottle cap away from the embers as it will melt. Otherwise just put the body of the bottle onto the embers, and it wil easily heat to water to 60-70 degrees C.
Another 'at a pinch' idea is that a partially inflated bottle can be placed into a jacket or top, and this makes quite a comfy pillow.
250ml or 500 ml fizzy bottles are also ideal for carrying meths. They are very strong, and will not buckle or melt. They are much lighter than sigg type bottles. It is also worth pointing out that the MSR fuel bottles are also only suitable for petrol carrying and not meths as they have no plastic liner, and meths will eventually eat pin holes in them. This also applies to some cheap sigg copies.
The last (for now) at a pinch use is to cut the bottle in half and use the lower portion as a urine collector to avoid the need to leave your tent on cold nights.
I know I am double posting, but I have just finished packing my rucksack, as I am maybe doing a two and a half day back pack starting in the morning.
My pack weighs just under ten kilo's including 1.6 litres of water, food for two days, and recharging gear for our Iphones).
It would normally be lighter, but I am taking a much bigger cooking pot, as I will be cooking for two, and also have a larger radio than usual. I am also carrying all of the tent (we are not splitting the load, as I am going with my partner, and she thinks that it means 'I carry all the gear').
I mention this, as various posters have mentioned weight carrying formulas. So, as my pack is approx 10kg, and I weigh 95kg, its just over a tenth of my body weight. Once I have taken my fleece out of the pack, and my wind/waterproof, the pack will be less than a tenth of my weight.
My pack weighs just under ten kilo's including 1.6 litres of water, food for two days, and recharging gear for our Iphones).
It would normally be lighter, but I am taking a much bigger cooking pot, as I will be cooking for two, and also have a larger radio than usual. I am also carrying all of the tent (we are not splitting the load, as I am going with my partner, and she thinks that it means 'I carry all the gear').
I mention this, as various posters have mentioned weight carrying formulas. So, as my pack is approx 10kg, and I weigh 95kg, its just over a tenth of my body weight. Once I have taken my fleece out of the pack, and my wind/waterproof, the pack will be less than a tenth of my weight.
You do have to wonder, why no wheeled sleds, or scout carts anymore?
There must be something going on to do with momentum etc, but still superhuman, or crazy.
This is a debate from a while back. They would have been professional walkers for a start. Then did they carry that much, or did bushcraft come into it.
If you in armor, you on a horse, that heavy stuff. Also you miss, you owned.
It sounds like an old canvas Black's of Greenock patrol tent you're talking about, Minotaur?
Never, Stormhaven all the way.
Just found out my normally camping tent, weights, wait for it, 43kg :yikes:
Tend to either car camp, or hike. This time camping but using public transport, so this question popped into my head.
Look around some of the upto three men tents are amazingly heavy. I do agree to a certain point a red hearing, but was amazed that these were marketed as lightweight, or hiking tents.
I have used an old school force ten, and it drove me nuts, because you could only lie in it. Getting dressed in the morning was for flexiable people only.
Really like the look of some of the Vango designs, so might be getting another new tent soon.
Made that change years ago, when everyone else went into Goretex. Bizarrely, just got a Tresspass three in one which takes up more room, but seems so far to be so much better in use.
Got the straw thing to turn them into bladders. What I really want is this set up using different stuff. Seems to be the perfect lightweight water set up.
This is probably to late to help but I'll add it anyway. A couple of posters here have stated the 20% rule. That's what's taught by the Boy Scouts and interestingly was also taught by the cavalry for a horse's load. You might remember though that 20% of your weight might not mean 20% of your TOTAL weight. I'm not referring just to the extra weight of your clothing and boots either. I'm reffering to they mean 20% of your "healthy" weight. Any extra body fat has to be considered as part of the "load" to be carried rather than "healthy" weight used to determine the 20%. I don't know about you but in my case I have to subtract about 50 pounds to get my healthy weight (yeah, I'm an old lard a**) before I figure the percent. Next I have to subtract it again from the percentage because I obviously WILL be carrying it as a part of the total load. These are however guides and mostly apply to longer hikes or daily hikes. I can carry quite a bit more; I just don't want to go too far with it or too often. Likewise the terrain will make a big difference.
i personally think it comes down to conditioning, practice and what your mind will take....
i went to wales over new years to go ice climbing and carried 35kg of kit, in my army bergan and another 45ltrs berghaus arete on the front. it was damn hard going and without walking poles it would have been impossible. ironically there was no ice or snow at the top as it started to rain as soon as we got out the car.... sigh...
the most i have ever carried is 50kg and it crushed my soul along with my body, im glad it was only for a couple of km.
i take people trekking a lot and 10kg seems to be a light pack for a 4 day 3 night trip. that would be if you packed well and didnt take any uncessaries and also didnt go nuts and start shaving flakes off your spoon to save grams...
12-15 seems to be the average for average gear carried for an average period.
so for a short distance.... you can carry more.... BUT be warned, dont put your back out just for the sake of one less trip to the car....
i went to wales over new years to go ice climbing and carried 35kg of kit, in my army bergan and another 45ltrs berghaus arete on the front. it was damn hard going and without walking poles it would have been impossible. ironically there was no ice or snow at the top as it started to rain as soon as we got out the car.... sigh...
the most i have ever carried is 50kg and it crushed my soul along with my body, im glad it was only for a couple of km.
i take people trekking a lot and 10kg seems to be a light pack for a 4 day 3 night trip. that would be if you packed well and didnt take any uncessaries and also didnt go nuts and start shaving flakes off your spoon to save grams...
12-15 seems to be the average for average gear carried for an average period.
so for a short distance.... you can carry more.... BUT be warned, dont put your back out just for the sake of one less trip to the car....
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well my alice is about 20-26 kg, but i walk about 2 miles to the zone then dump the alice then go do whatever
Surely its a question of mind over matter?? I mean, if you pack what YOU want into your pack, then pick it up and it feels ok, then thats fine. But put the very same packed bag on some scales, and all of a sudden it becomes heavy/light.
I think this is absolutely correct. I remember the first time I put a pack on my back (only 16kgs) and thought that I had made the wrong choice in potential hobbies after half a mile! After 5 miles I was almost dead on my feet. The day after, on the way back it felt a bit more comfortable.
Now I put myself in the ultralight category, rarely carrying more than 10kgs - and I enjoy that.
I'm really shocked that no one even talked about these guys!!!!
They carry HUGE loads up the mountains, do not complain (although they do this for a living) and still help you out with what path to take.
Ok, S.A.S. , paratroopers, royal marines, etc all take massive loads, especially on training and long range missions, but they don't take as much as this:
They some time carry more than they're own bodyweight!!!!
Anyway, on-topic: Load your pack, take a few laps (walking\strolling) around the block, find out it's too heavy, return home, lay-out everything you have in the pack and take everything out that you absolutelly don't need\can replace with lighter stuff. Then go walk some more.
You can do it after work, just to see how you deal with that much wheight when you're tired, and try and do some small tweeks to the backpack (shoulder straps length, hip belt size, etc)
They carry HUGE loads up the mountains, do not complain (although they do this for a living) and still help you out with what path to take.
Ok, S.A.S. , paratroopers, royal marines, etc all take massive loads, especially on training and long range missions, but they don't take as much as this:
They some time carry more than they're own bodyweight!!!!
Anyway, on-topic: Load your pack, take a few laps (walking\strolling) around the block, find out it's too heavy, return home, lay-out everything you have in the pack and take everything out that you absolutelly don't need\can replace with lighter stuff. Then go walk some more.
You can do it after work, just to see how you deal with that much wheight when you're tired, and try and do some small tweeks to the backpack (shoulder straps length, hip belt size, etc)
These guys carry upto twice there body weight!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12301421
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12301421
I did the Southern Upland Way with a 20kg rucsac (a decent karrimor 65l one) and if it taught me anything it was to go as light as possible. I met a guy doing same walk with 14kg pack and on trying his pack I found the difference was huge. To carry more weight all day will require eating (and carrying) more food to convert to energy, which (unless you're eating at pubs etc) will result in a heavier pack. I'd say keep it under 15kg if you're going long distance. The other benefit of a light pack is that you're less likely to take non-essential things. I had all sorts of 'useful' devices that I ended up sending home when I came to the first post office on route.
I'm really surprised it's taken so long for tumplines to make an appearance in this thread. Everywhere in the world when it gets too tough for vehicles, and pack animals then people end up carrying loads with a tumpline. Minatour, if you are only travelling a few miles I strongly urge you to give one a try! Get it set up correctly and you'll understand why tumpliners say that backpacks were designed by people who didn't have to carry anything.
Back at the height of the Hudson Bay Company, voyagers were contracted to carry two pieces, each piece weighing 90lb! Clearly these people did this every day, so are not office workers trying this out with 180lb loads.
You might find Beyond the Paddle by Garrett Conover useful. The bit about the loads carried for competition purposes makes you think twice. A course of two hundred yards, up to a post and back. At the time of printing (about fifteen years ago) the records stood at 900lb for the women, and 1100lb for the men!
Food for thought I hope.
Al
Back at the height of the Hudson Bay Company, voyagers were contracted to carry two pieces, each piece weighing 90lb! Clearly these people did this every day, so are not office workers trying this out with 180lb loads.
You might find Beyond the Paddle by Garrett Conover useful. The bit about the loads carried for competition purposes makes you think twice. A course of two hundred yards, up to a post and back. At the time of printing (about fifteen years ago) the records stood at 900lb for the women, and 1100lb for the men!
Food for thought I hope.
Al
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Thanks for the help all!
Think the go for a walk makes more sense, have been able to pick packs up that carrying was a problem. It amazing what you do not need when you have to carry it.
Think the go for a walk makes more sense, have been able to pick packs up that carrying was a problem. It amazing what you do not need when you have to carry it.
i did 18 odd miles in about 5 hours once with 25kg ish could have been more, i then went on to finish the 42 miles at 8pm ish we started walking at 6am...
it was for help4heroes along the Pembrokeshire Coastal Path, we managed to raise just under 5k, 186 miles in 5 days, i really enjoyed it, even with the hills....
really nice piece of coast to walk, we did it south to north th "wrong" way, most people do it the other way as the north part has more climbes in it, all the same i loved it to bits......
i hope to do Hadrians wall next X 2 there and then back, east to west then back to east, should manage it in 4 days, 40 miles a day 160 in total.....
just do what feel you can and enjoy what ever you do, even if it hurts.......
chris.........
it was for help4heroes along the Pembrokeshire Coastal Path, we managed to raise just under 5k, 186 miles in 5 days, i really enjoyed it, even with the hills....
really nice piece of coast to walk, we did it south to north th "wrong" way, most people do it the other way as the north part has more climbes in it, all the same i loved it to bits......
i hope to do Hadrians wall next X 2 there and then back, east to west then back to east, should manage it in 4 days, 40 miles a day 160 in total.....
just do what feel you can and enjoy what ever you do, even if it hurts.......
chris.........
