The Crime and Policing Bill 2025

[Kiri]

The first draft of the Crime and Policing Bill 2025 has landed.

https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3938

Measures of interest are:

Part 2

10 - Possession of weapon with intent to use unlawful violence.

11 - Maximum penalty for offences relating to offensive weapons

12 / 13 - Power to seize bladed articles


The new online knife sales and delivery measures will probably be added later.

The Ninja sword ban will be through secondary legislation.

 

[Chris]

I think this is the bit of interest to me, which may catch people out. It’s easy to see the word ‘violence’ and assume this wouldn’t apply to bushcrafters or campers.



However, it states violence to include ‘unlawful damage to property’, which could apply to people saying they are using tools for processing wood that does not belong to them. This would then, theoretically, give an officer the right to lawfully confiscate your bladed or pointed bushcraft tools.

(Yes, I am aware that a police officer would have to be in your house in the first place, but I am not here to argue about that, just to discuss how the legislation *could* impact people who have bushcraft or camping tools).

 

[ijohnson]

The line 'lawfully on any premises' is one that stands out to me.

If the Police ever ask to enter your house and you have (currently legal to own) knives tell them no.

 

[Chris]

The line 'lawfully on any premises' is one that stands out to me.

If the Police ever ask to enter your house and you have (currently legal to own) knives tell them no.

You waive this right if you have a FAC or Shotgun Certificate unfortunately! But I think a bushcraft knife would be the least of your problems if firearms officers are in your house uninvited.

 

[Laurentius]

If an individual has made threats against their neighbours or issued threats on Social media, it does seem reasonable to seize that persons knives if they are likely to use them. I think the provision against damage to property comes in when you are threatening acts of deliberate vandalism, or perhaps threatening to cut down a neighbours tree. The basic rule is, that if you have blades, particularly big ones, you should act responsibly in such a way as you will not attract attention. It's exactly the same as people complaining that they have had a legal blade confiscated, when they had previously been in the pub threatening to cut somebody with it.

If you are a tree surgeon or gardener, you will be on other peoples property and processing wood you do not own, but it would be an incredible stretch to raid your house on the basis that you are advertising your services locally.

 

[MartinK9]

Like PC Savage in 2019?

Car smash Met Police officer committed gross misconduct

PC Joshua Savage attacked a man's car with a baton and cut the window with a knife.

www.bbc.co.uk

Snip>
"Mr Naseem said the IOPC was concerned about Mr Savage's claim that Met officers routinely carry multi-tools, despite them being against regulation.

"If true, this would be matter for public concern," Mr Naseem said.!

 

[Chris]

I feel like there’s a post or two I can’t see.

Nowhere in the legislation does it say an officer will enter your house for no reason to confiscate your knives on the basis of you using them for work.

Following one or both of these simple steps will mean this legislation doesn’t impact you:

1) Don’t give police cause to go in your house in the first place

2) Don’t give police reasonable suspicion that you are going to commit a crime with your tools if they ARE in your house for some reason, ie don’t say or suggest you’re going to commit a crime with them (such as chopping wood whilst trespassing, thereby causing criminal damage), or don’t have a pattern of behaviour in general which might give them reason to suspect this, such as threatening people with knives or causing general mischief with them.

 

[slowworm]

You don't have to do anything wrong, all the police would need would be an allegation, which could be completely false. It's not unheard of, for example, for people who are anti-shooting to make false allegation against a law abiding SGC/FAC holder.

I think it would certainly be wise to keep things shut or even locked away. And thinking about it I wouldn't be surprised if knives will be treated like air weapons in several years time and have to be locked away if anyone under 18 has access to them.

 

[Laurentius]

You don't have to do anything wrong, all the police would need would be an allegation, which could be completely false. It's not unheard of, for example, for people who are anti-shooting to make false allegation against a law abiding SGC/FAC holder.

I think it would certainly be wise to keep things shut or even locked away. And thinking about it I wouldn't be surprised if knives will be treated like air weapons in several years time and have to be locked away if anyone under 18 has access to them.

I have been around long enough to have seen good cops and bad cops. Of course I have seen police who seem incapable of dealing with a situation without inflaming it. On the other hand I have not been known never to take an axe or a billhook onto land I do not have title to, and in the presence of an off duty police officer so there. Where exactly would an electric hedge trimmer fit within the new legislation?

 

[Silverclaws2]

From experience, don't ever let the police in your house without a warrant, not even when they are purporting to be doing you a service.

 

[Pattree]

I think it would certainly be wise to keep things shut or even locked away. And thinking about it I wouldn't be surprised if knives will be treated like air weapons in several years time and have to be locked away if anyone under 18 has access to them.

That’s good advice anyway. I’ve been doing it for decades for my hobby knives that are not in use………. Which, thinking about it is odd given that a number of 20cm+ fixed bladed knives are sitting in a wooden block in my kitchen.

I have absolutely no problem with the police force and do not expect even to have a conversation with a police officer in the foreseeable future. I suspect that is true for the majority of people on this site.

Recent legislation has not affected how I use, transport or store my tools.

 

[TeeDee]

From experience, don't ever let the police in your house without a warrant, not even when they are purporting to be doing you a service.

Purporting is a lovely word.

 

[Silverclaws2]

Purporting is a lovely word.

Another word relating is ; deceit

 

[TLM]

Where exactly would an electric hedge trimmer fit within the new legislation?

... some of them have a very serrated BLADE ...

 

[Pattree]

What a disappointing view some here have of our police force. I’ve found them nothing other than helpful, reasonable and caring. Stressed and stretched but doing an almost impossible job.

The legislation is opaque if not impossible and they are asked to police it. Their training / briefing changes so frequently with every test of new legislation that passes through the courts.

 

[TeeDee]

What a disappointing view some here have of our police force. I’ve found them nothing other than helpful, reasonable and caring. Stressed and stretched but doing an almost impossible job.

The legislation is opaque if not impossible and they are asked to police it. Their training / briefing changes so frequently with every test of new legislation that passes through the courts.

Just want to point out I have no issue with the Po-Po.

I do like the nuances of the English language however.

 

[Chris]

This is an interesting recent post I stumbled upon on Reddit, regarding someone who was arrested (and promptly cleared, and the correct suspect arrested) for an assault in some woodland. Their house was searched and they had their legally owned knives confiscated and Nottinghamshire Police told them they refuse to return them as they have a 'zero tolerance approach' to knives. Which is of course unlawful.

https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/comments/1fuv0ng/nottinghamshire_knife_seizure

I suppose here it's important that whilst plenty of us will say "Well I have never been in trouble with the police, they have never been to my house", that isn't the case for everyone even when said people have done nothing wrong.

 

[Pattree]

Then, as we have seen here theirs is redress. One of our members got their property back by contacting the MoJ.

Of course it shouldn’t have happened and I’m glad that it doesn’t often do so.

 

[ijohnson]

Then, as we have seen here theirs is redress. One of our members got their property back by contacting the MoJ.

I read that thread with great interest and admired the tenacity of the OP.

 

[Silverclaws2]

What a disappointing view some here have of our police force. I’ve found them nothing other than helpful, reasonable and caring. Stressed and stretched but doing an almost impossible job.

Brought up to be supportive of and one time applicant for Lancashire Constabulary, I also used to find them thus until I didn't and not through misdemeanour on my part.