Newbie Rucksack Questions

preacherman

Full Member
May 21, 2008
310
0
Cork, Ireland
Personally I have been trying to reduce pack size and weight but if you are definitely interested in a large pack then the links below should be of interest to anyone looking at military vs civillian expedition size packs.

These are from Pablo's Woodlife site. The article in the first link is really well thought out and written and the videos are self explanatory.


http://www.woodlife.co.uk/2008/11/25/carrying-stuff/

http://www.youtube.com/profile?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&user=prmaklpboo#p/u/12/mb21Cmuq9kA

http://www.youtube.com/profile?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&user=prmaklpboo#p/u/13/XquLbzFjrwM

http://www.youtube.com/profile?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&user=prmaklpboo#p/u/14/aM_IIstI9b4

Andrew
 

Paul_B

Bushcrafter through and through
Jul 14, 2008
6,412
1,698
Cumbria
Got mine and took it out for a spin. A sack from Aiguille Alpine that is, I have a nice black number with an XL back. Made a good carry and all the room I need for a multi day trek in the hills. Is tough as they come. A nice clean climbing style of sack. Perfect for backpacking and only 1kg too. Its also discrete for those who like such sacks. My point is why get a big, heavy load lugger in a "army style" that is probably no more comfortable than a lighter weight and just as durable sack from a British manufacturer that will do what you need it to do but is still a lot lighter than most bergens by some way. Is it image over substance?
 

johnboy

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Oct 2, 2003
2,258
5
Hamilton NZ
www.facebook.com
Got mine and took it out for a spin. A sack from Aiguille Alpine that is, I have a nice black number with an XL back. Made a good carry and all the room I need for a multi day trek in the hills. Is tough as they come. A nice clean climbing style of sack. Perfect for backpacking and only 1kg too. Its also discrete for those who like such sacks. My point is why get a big, heavy load lugger in a "army style" that is probably no more comfortable than a lighter weight and just as durable sack from a British manufacturer that will do what you need it to do but is still a lot lighter than most bergens by some way. Is it image over substance?

How many Ltrs is your new Aiguille Pack?
 

Paul_B

Bushcrafter through and through
Jul 14, 2008
6,412
1,698
Cumbria
Good question. Its supposed to be about 47 litres in the standard back length. Mine is 1" longer than the long back length or 3" longer than the standard. That probably makes it a bit more than the 47 litres. I am also not too sure that the standard sacks are that accurately measured for volume anyway. I think it is about 50-60litres. I have a 50+10litre berghaus alpine style sack that is also on the large vollume size. That one has more volume than my previous 65litre standard backpacking sack. So I really have not idea to guage it against.

All I can say is that when I first saw it I thought they had made it too long. Turns out to be ok. I can get my backpacking kit into it including way too much gear (a tent, bivvy bag and tarp plus two stoves / cooking systems, etc.). I would say that it is about 10 litres less capacity than my previous sack so that should make it 50 litres. The shape is interesting. It is kind of wider at the base and the top but tapers in a little at the middle. I suppose that is to give it plenty of freedom of arm movement for scrambling / climbing with it. I am yet to get it comfortable. The strut in the middle of the back needs re-shaping to get the sack comfortable or might end up being removed completely, I'm really not sure yet.

Whatever sack people buy I do think that for backpacking you have to play around with each new sack to get it comfortable. I am in that process now. It is a case of getting the padding to mould to you and for you to get the back support shaped right (in the case of alloy strut supports in the back). When I get it truly comfortable I reckon it will be a great sack. All sleek and black. It really does look good. A few straps that were attached too long to be any good but an easy mod to correct it.

I can heartily recommend Aiguile Alpine sacks.
 

maddave

Full Member
Jan 2, 2004
4,177
39
Manchester UK
All I can say is Big_Swede made a very good point about people on this site and their big green sacks. Depends what you are using it for. Carrying loads of heavy gear short distances from the car, landy or van to a wood camp / moot spot then very well. If you have to carry all your gear in one bag over many miles while backpacking then I do think you have to account for why you are carrying up to 3kg in a sack when there are sacks available that work just as well in the real world weighing 1kg or even less depending on your load weight.

IMHO the big green sack does not offer any benefit in what is perceived as its biggest selling point and that is durabilty. I have used sacks and most definitely abused them for many years and have not so far damaged a sack. I have used some UL sacks weighing 600g and found them perfectly adequate for backpacking use. I scramble, climb and throw them around. I trip, stumble and fall on them. Sit on them and even been known to throw them down on the ground in a strop.

My point is the bergen type of sacks are an old technology now. They are a little bit from the time when it was thought thicker fabric, more webbing and more stitching makes it a real tough sack. There are better options out there but they might not be the big green or black SF sack/bergen. You are not a bulk, contract buying military body so why get the type of stuff they get limited with. Afterall it is not uncommon that some units allow them to buy their own, better stuff.

I personally think the newer products inspired by the USA's UL backacking community using dyneema and some amazingly tough but light fabrics is a better choice for backpacking. The Crux is known as a bombproof sack. If you rip one of them you are a cretin. That make of sack is tougher than the bergens. It is the simplicity of it that makes it particularly tough. A single compartment body of the sack made out of as few pieces of fabric as possible, with good stitching, webbing and buckles, etc. They all contribute.

Now as an outside bet try Aiguille Alpine. Based in Stavely in the Lakes they make their own sacks above their shop. They offer a degree of customisation all in their standard price. The sacks are cheaper than main stream brands for what they are and there is no fuss with them making them reasonably light. If you read through some threads on here you will find out that people tend to keep this make and use them for decades. They are known as being well made and very durable. I like the fact that I have got aa back length made to fit my back not the "standard" back size whatever that is. I think it is also another good sign that MRT members use them as do climbing guides and I believe some military units (if he's not spinning me a yarn). You just have to get over the big green sack herd mentality.

Sorry if I've been controversial with my big green sack comments but its just my honestly held opinion that those sacks are attrocious for backpacking use when compared with what is out there. There are some reaally good sacks that people are ruling out for what appears to me to just be a question of colour.

I won't mention the word "Duluth" then..... I promise :D
 

wentworth

Settler
Aug 16, 2004
573
3
40
Australia
I used to use a golite pack, then started making my own ultralight frameless sacks. But for my most recent 5 day trip, covering up to 40km a day, I went back to my beautiful GREEN canvas rucksack.

Pity I don't know that real walkers use XYZ :)
 

wentworth

Settler
Aug 16, 2004
573
3
40
Australia
Hi Darren,
we had to lug 6L of water for a lot of the trip. 6kg of gear(including pack), 7kg of food (we were anticipating it taking 7 days) and 6kg of water.
I was glad to have the frame on my old pack for this trip, even though at 2kg it was the heaviest thing I carried. My gear may be light, but food and water are not!

If you don't have to carry more than 2L, light sacks are fine.
 

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