Need a little advice on canoes.

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Tomcoles

Settler
Jul 21, 2013
537
0
Buckinghamshire
I am looking at buying a canoe like a Canadian canoe I have about £250 may be at a push £300 to spend I need it to be capable of tandom but with the main usage as a sole. I live in Buckinghamshire so, close to the thames. So could be the start to some great adventures. I drive a 2004 vauxhall Astra 5door hatch back so my question is does anyone own a canoe that will suit me or have any suggestions and will I be able to transport it on my car?? I have considered an inflatable but I don't really like the idea and would prefer to spend my money on something more bomb proof. Any help would be great. Many thanks Tom
 

Chainsaw

Native
Jul 23, 2007
1,385
157
57
Central Scotland
Hi Tom,

there's a whole forum dedicated to canadian canoes over on Song of the Paddle and a lot of people on there are on here (and vice versa) 250-300 is not lot for a canoe, you will be definitely second hand and plastics one's are cheaper but also heavier. For tandem you'll need around 15ft (most are this size) any bigger and it becomes a bit trickier to paddle solo. a 15 or 16 footer will fit on your astra no problem, some roof bars, straps and ropes will sort that out no problem.

Most of us started on cheap, heavy, plastic canoes, and then progress to lighter, more expensive materials if we really get the bug. Your best bet is ebay or gumtree for a 15 foot pelican or old town canoe. Some people recommend fibre glass which are quite cheap and light but personally I'm not keen, although some people swear by them! Apache canoes are a good example of these, I've met Stu he's a good guy.

Remember you'll need a couple of paddles, some Buoyancy Aids/Personal Flotation Devices (life jackets) and some ropes, dry bags etc. Another important thing is to get some training, either from a pro or from some knowledgeable amateurs. SotP often have group paddles in various areas and it's always good to go out with other people who can help in the early days.

HTH

Alan
 
Hi Tom,
This is my third year canoeing, before that I had never been in one. You will not regret getting a canoe, it is my favorite way to camp. I almost never go without it.

First, what is a Canadian Canoe? Here in Canada, we just call them "Canoes." :p (j/k)

For 250-300 quid, you won't find much. You will definitely have to go used, and I have no idea what the market is like over there for them. You have to be careful, because it really depends on what kind of canoeing you will be doing. If you plan on doing some tripping, then you really have to watch the weight as you will probably have to portage it from lake to lake. Some of the cheap plastic boats can weigh upwards of 80-90lbs. You're best bet is to find a used but quality fiberglass or "royalex" boat. Fiberglass used to be the go to material, but few companies are even offering FB versions anymore. It's easily repairable but it requires repair if you're smashing into rocks, etc. If you get one from a good brand, you're looking at 50-70 lbs depending on the boat. Royalex is a plastic type of material. It is plastic layers and foam buoyant layers in between them. This is the new standard material for lower end canoes from quality manufacturers. It is bombproof.

I have a 16' Nova Craft Pal in Royalex Lite and it weighs 58lbs. I personally would not want a heavier boat. Mine is covered in dents and scratches. They are battle scars. As a beginner paddler, I highly recommend royalex if you can find one.

As for size, 15' is a perfect size for a tandem boat that will be used mostly for solo. I have a 16' and currently this is the same purpose I use mine (until my Fiance and I live in the same bloody place). I've paddled a 17' solo, and it's just too big. 14' would be ideal for solo, and can seat two people usually, however probably not two people and gear. Most canoes have capacities listed on their websites too. For instance, mine is 800lbs. More than enough for two big dudes and gear for a week.

You also have to look at the type of water you want to paddle. Are you planning on doing big calm rivers, whitewater, calm small lakes, big lakes, etc. Like anything, each canoe is special to a specific task, but can be used for others, just not idealy. I'll use two classic canoe designs as an example: The Prospector and the Pal (both used by Bill Mason). The prospector has a lot of rocker, meaning from front to back it has a lot of curvature vertically (looks like a banana kind of). This makes the canoe very easy to turn/pivot, but then also harder to keep in a straight line. It also has relatively high sides. Both of these features make it a good river tripping/whitewater canoe. On flat calm lakes, it obviously takes more effort to keep straight, and the higher sides can catch the wind easier. The Pal has little rocker, with a long flat bottom and 2" lower sides. This means it holds a line really well, is less effected by the wind, so its a great lake canoe. However both of these canoes can be multi use, just not as ideal at everything. I had my pal out in whitewater for the first time a few weeks ago. While I got a little wet, and couldn't spin around as fast as the other guys, I still had a blast.

I would advise, trying to save a bit more money to get a good canoe. It will be like a new best friend.
 

Tomcoles

Settler
Jul 21, 2013
537
0
Buckinghamshire
That's great advice thankyou. In England a canoe and kayak are always confused normally people call a canoe a kayak hence why I discribed it as a Canadian canoe. E.g. an old town etc
 

Jjessup

Full Member
May 15, 2013
190
0
Essex
15 foot is definitely the type of size you are looking at. I would recommend a prospector style model as well, most of the main manufacturers make one. Although Royalex is lovely and light to carry, you would be looking at £1000+ new, so unlikely to find a decent second hand one in the price range. Plastic will be the way to go unless you get REALLY lucky on ebay. Keep an eye out on your local canoe shop websites, as they often have trade in boats, and they are usually riverworthy. You can then start haggling on the extras at the same time!

As far as roofracks are concerned, the guys at my canoe club (who are kayakers) always say that it's best not to skimp on the roof bars. I've heard reports of the pad and straps jobs scratching up cars, and horror stories of cheapo halfords roofracks peeling off the top of cars resulting in boats bouncing down the motorway.

As the guys said about training, it's good to get a bit of pratical experience with someone who knows what they are doing. i would also recommend the following books if you feel like a bit of background reading.

Canoeing by Ray Goodwin: an excellent book that covers a lot of the skills, techniques and planning that go into an enjoyable trip.

Pub paddles: a great book with some nice day trips in the South East, including loads on the Thames, and including pubs!

Hve fun it's a great way to travel.
 

Wayne

Mod
Mod
Dec 7, 2003
3,770
659
52
West Sussex
www.forestknights.co.uk
Good luck finding an open canoe for £300. Bargains are out there but they are snapped up quickly. Unlike kayaks open canoe models don't change very often so second hand boats hold their value. So if you spend £300 in two years time when you decide to upgrade to something lighter and more specific to your paddling style you will be able to sell your first love for the same money.

Be warned canoes are addictive. I currently own 6.

Make sure you allow some pennies for a buoyancy aid and have 2 paddles a cheapo plastic for rock bashing and a nicer deep water wooden for cruising.

have a look at the ranger 16 and the nova craft prospector sp. Both plastic canoes so heavy to and from the water but good canoes for the money.

A roof rack needs to be secure. A set of Thule bars or the halfords alternative will be fine. Just remember to tie the bow and stern down as well.

Use cam lock straps or rope. Its easy to crush your pride and joy with ratchet straps.
 

Wayne

Mod
Mod
Dec 7, 2003
3,770
659
52
West Sussex
www.forestknights.co.uk
That is a truly ugly canoe 11ft is going to really slow and will track poorly. It will be affected by the wind with the high prowl.

However if it's within your budget and gets you on the water then why not.

It very much depends what you want to do with it.

Get yourself to a SOTP meet in your area and try out as many canoes as you can before committing your cash.

As we have already said an open canoe is not cheap to buy even second hand but will last you years and you will be able to sell on if the time comes.
 

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