I just can't get that hand drill going.

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Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
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I've seemed to have had the best results using teasel on ivy and elder on willow.
I heard that you should spit in your hands but when I do that I find it hard to get enough downward pressure.
Also, there are blisters.
All I get is a load of darkbrown powder and some smoke:red:
I can light this powder with a ferro rod.
What should I do?
 

Mesquite

It is what it is.
Mar 5, 2008
27,891
2,942
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~Hemel Hempstead~
I've seemed to have had the best results using teasel on ivy and elder on willow.
I heard that you should spit in your hands but when I do that I find it hard to get enough downward pressure.
Also, there are blisters.
All I get is a load of darkbrown powder and some smoke:red:
I can light this powder with a ferro rod.
What should I do?

Keep practicing... you're nearly there by the sounds of it.

With regards the blisters, you need to harden your hands off so as soon as you start feeling hot spots building up stop, rest a good while then go back to it and over time your hands will get harder and calluses build up which will make it easier for you.

One of the best people I've seen at hand drill showed me his hands and it was amazing seeing the calluses he'd built up
 

jacko1066

Native
May 22, 2011
1,689
0
march, cambs
You will have to excuse me chaps because I don't no particularly anything about the hand drill, but would putting a bit of Vaseline on your hands before you start help with the friction?
Or does that take away from the idea of it being primitive fire lighting?
Cheers
Steve


Leave only footprints take only memories
 

Mesquite

It is what it is.
Mar 5, 2008
27,891
2,942
62
~Hemel Hempstead~
You will have to excuse me chaps because I don't no particularly anything about the hand drill, but would putting a bit of Vaseline on your hands before you start help with the friction?
Or does that take away from the idea of it being primitive fire lighting?
Cheers
Steve


Leave only footprints take only memories

Unfortunately you want the friction so as to spin and apply pressure on the drill

Having vaseline on your palms would mean you'd be gripping a greasy pole :)
 

jacko1066

Native
May 22, 2011
1,689
0
march, cambs
Unfortunately you want the friction so as to spin and apply pressure on the drill

Having vaseline on your palms would mean you'd be gripping a greasy pole :)

Lol you certainly would lol!!
I think I'm getting confused with the drill that you use the cord on the top that helps with the downward pressure.
I can certainly see your point now though mate.
So what the quickest way to harden your hands up to something like this Steve?


Leave only footprints take only memories
 

Mesquite

It is what it is.
Mar 5, 2008
27,891
2,942
62
~Hemel Hempstead~
So what the quickest way to harden your hands up to something like this Steve?

If you haven't got the time to do the handrill itself then get a piece of dowel or a section from an actual drill, put it between your hands and rub them together vigorously. When you feel your palms getting hot and sore stop, rest a good while before going back to it :)
 

wildranger

Need to contact Admin...
Oct 29, 2011
112
1
Ireland
I'm not really surprised that you've been having a hard time considering the woods you're using. Ivy and willow are great for bow drill but for hand drill you should use superior hearth boards. Teasel and elder are great drills but they need to be used with the correct hearths.

Try: Elder on clematis
Teasel on lime
Teasel on willow root

These 3 combinations will definitely increase your chances of success considerably
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
I'm not really surprised that you've been having a hard time considering the woods you're using. Ivy and willow are great for bow drill but for hand drill you should use superior hearth boards. Teasel and elder are great drills but they need to be used with the correct hearths.

Try: Elder on clematis
Teasel on lime
Teasel on willow root

These 3 combinations will definitely increase your chances of success considerably

Thanks!, Clematis sadly does not grow naturally here. I have seen it in parks, but not yet any big enough for a hearth. I will give the willow root and lime a go though.
 

lannyman8

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 18, 2009
4,005
3
Dark side of the Moon
ah now, it took me a matter of a day or 2 to get the bow drill, it just seemed to come to me and be willing to make embers for me, the hand drill on the other hand took me ages, around 6 months of constant (when i had time) trying

top tips for me...

1) technic over wood types
2) 3 stage method
3) correct length and width spindle
4) position and hold of the spindle and board

1) the woods are of course important but i found once i had mastered the technic it was more important to get the correct technic than specific woods as such.

2) with the bow drill i use a 2 stage method, the filling of the notch with the dust, stage 1, and the heating/lighting of the dust, stage 2... with the hand drill a 3 stage method is needed, (1)first the warming of the board and hands, this is a very slow with little pressure methodical movement to warm the board in, you will get a very light wisp of smoke every now and then but very little. (2) the dust stage is the same as the bow drill, you need to fill the notch before the heat can be produced to light the dust, again methodical and not to much pressure with a little amount of smoke but a steady stream of it, with light brow fluffy dust forming in the notch. (3) the lighting stage, allot of pressure with loads of smoke, the amount of turns depends on how much dust has been formed, i find it easyer to get an ember with more dust as the heat is held in better...

3) the correct length and width of the spindle is a personal thing and will come with more practise, i have made embers with very short lengths of teasel which are too thin to be used really, but the best size is as long as your elbow to the tip of your fingers long, maybe a little longer, but the longer it is the harder i find it to control, and around 10mm wide at the drill end, again i like it a little smaller nearer 7-8mm but thats just me, you will learn once you start making embers..

4) there are many ways to hold the drill and board, again this is personal choice, as long as it feels comfortable then dont worry what you look like...i do 2 different holds to get an ember, i use the bow drill stance with my foot on the board to burn in, i do this as you get better downward force from your body which helps burn in the board quicker, this in turn helps save your hands a bit when starting out...:) i then use the sitting style with the side of my foot on the board, this gives more room for your arms to work and is more comfortable for making the ember...

hope this has helped a little, it took me ages to get it down, and do use lots of spit or water, it WILL help prevent blisters, all the best and dont stop trying, the satisfaction of knowing you can do this is great.....

you rock....;)

regards

chris.
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
Thanks! :You_Rock_My hope is renewed once again, and I'm off to the the shed with healed hands, to chase after this illusive hand drill ember...
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
Just managed to produce loads of smoke again, and the notch was full of powder, but no glowing.:( Tomorrow I'm gonna look for willow root. I remember seeing a video from RM where the Hadza would walk for miles to the top of a mountain to find the perfect firestick, with which they could produce a coal with any hearth wood. I can relate to those people now more than ever as I too have to walk like 5 km with the dog to get to the nearest teasel stems and willow trees.:rolleyes:
 

lannyman8

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 18, 2009
4,005
3
Dark side of the Moon
keep up the good work Niels, once it comes to you, you will be able to produce them on demand.....;)

just keep trying mate, and dont forget, 3 stages, take your time on the first 2 then go for it dude...:)
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
BAM! Got it:D I shortened the teasle drill a bit. I got some more downward pressure this time and was happily surprised to see the smoke wasn't stopping.
Managed to take a picture as well but it's not as clear as I'd hoped, but who cares!? I made fire rubbing sticks!!:D:D:D


2012-11-02 19.54.22 by Sami knives, on Flickr

Thanks for all your advice!
 

lannyman8

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 18, 2009
4,005
3
Dark side of the Moon
whoooop whhoooooppppp wwwwhhhhhhhhooooooooooooooooooooooooppppppppppppppppppppppppp......:):):):):):):):):)

welll done that man....:You_Rock_:dancer:goodjob

it looks like a nice big coal too, that should have made fire no probs dude...

welcome to the club of stick rubbers....lol

really chuffed for you mate, now all you have to do is keep trying and make some tweaks to make things easyer for how you like to do things...

again many congrats dude....:):):):)
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
I made another two embers just now! The secret seems to be not to press your hands together, but to move them down quickly while rubbing quickly to.
Also, I now used my foot to hold down the hearth instead of another stick which I sat upon.
And poplar works way better with teasel than willow or ivy.:D:D
 

Niels

Full Member
Mar 28, 2011
2,582
3
26
Netherlands
I have heard of people wearing those really thin plastic gloves, could help but I think it's better not to use them and just develop calluses.
 

lannyman8

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jan 18, 2009
4,005
3
Dark side of the Moon
lol....well done sir.....:)

when i do it i dont get blisters but my hands feel as if they are bruised where the bones are, from the pressure and constant rolling of the spindle i suppose. but hey i can also make fire by rubbing 2 sticks...;)

well done Niels, keep up the good work...
 

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