Fungi - The beginning ?

[Shewie]

Whilst out on a bimble yesterday evening I came across a fallen Ash which I think must have come down just after autumn last year. I started to think about King Alfreds and made a note of where it was so I could find it again later.

What I was also thinking about is how do fungi spores come to habitat a particular tree. I presume they are airborne and could potentially be carried huge distances given the right conditions. But how do they differentiate between the different species of tree and what makes certain fungi grow on there once they've found it ?

Are there particular chemicals in different trees which trigger the generation of the spores or is there another clever way it works ?


Take the above example of cramp balls/King Alfreds for instance, why can they primarily be found on Ash and nothing else ?

Saying that, one of my books also states that they can sometimes be found on Birch after a heath fire. So how does that work ?


Just curious

 

[Iona]

At a guess I'd say you're right about the spores spreading far and wide, but that they only find the conditions they need to grow on/with certain tree species...

Would be interested in a more scientific response from a more knowledgable person though...

 

[Peter_t]

fungi are prety odd, neither animal or plant. the only reason i can think of for being so specific to certain trees is because they provide the right environment and food for the fungi to live. if it isnt suitable the spors just wont grow i gess.

spors are not male or female but plus and minus. i think the reason being is that they both travel instead of only male gammets (is that the right word?) travel in male and female. when a spore lands on a food sorce it will start to grow into a root like structure called myselium. it can only grow to a sertain size untill it bonds with its opersite (plus + minus). after this it can get bigger and reproduce by growing fruiting boddies (bracket or toad stool). it is inportant to know that the fruiting boddies are not the fungi alone, a fungi can grow for years without produceing fruiting boddies.

how do i know this lol

some fungi are no so specific such as honey fungi or ganoderma. im sure i have seen king alfrids cakes on beech befor. also i have seen jew ear on feild maple and ash aposed to just elder. althow these others didnt seem to be growing as well as where they are comonly found.

hope this helps

pete

 

[Shewie]

Interesting stuff

So potentially in a mixed woodland for example, all the trees would be covered in the same spore secies, but they will only generate a paticular fungi if the right nutrients are available for that fungi?

 

[Lasse]

So potentially in a mixed woodland for example, all the trees would be covered in the same spore secies, but they will only generate a paticular fungi if the right nutrients are available for that fungi?

There would be loads of different spores from different species spread all over the woodland, every fungi has his own spores, and indeed only start to grow in the right conditions (many plants do about the same really).

 

[xylaria]

Whilst out on a bimble yesterday evening I came across a fallen Ash which I think must have come down just after autumn last year. I started to think about King Alfreds and made a note of where it was so I could find it again later.

What I was also thinking about is how do fungi spores come to habitat a particular tree. I presume they are airborne and could potentially be carried huge distances given the right conditions. But how do they differentiate between the different species of tree and what makes certain fungi grow on there once they've found it ?
Fungi play the number game, they make billions and billions of spores. I don't understand why they grow on certain trees and substrates and not on others.
Are there particular chemicals in different trees which trigger the generation of the spores or is there another clever way it works ?
probably, mycologists go to alot of effort to find out how certain mushrooms germinate so they can be cultivated. They haven't been very successful in most cases, very few fungi have been cultivated by man. Even the mushrooms that have been cultivated are very fussy about temperature, the substrate, and light levels.
Take the above example of cramp balls/King Alfreds for instance, why can they primarily be found on Ash and nothing else ?
Don't know!

Saying that, one of my books also states that they can sometimes be found on Birch after a heath fire. So how does that work ?
Increase in heat leads to more spore been germinated. Quite a few fungi need to eaten by animals for instance so the spore is incubated in the gut. I have noticed there is higher diversity of species after a warm summer. There are some species that prefer fire sites because of this, also burnt wood has a different mineral value to living or dead wood. My local country park has a species of cramp balls that is only found on burnt gorse. Just curious

The breeding of fungi is like being in nightclub with straight people, gay men, lesbians, and transgenders. Only certain pairings are likely, and some don't ever happen, except it is said fungi have four polarities not four genders. Once a spore is germinated it grows the pirmary mycelium. This has one set of chromsomes in each cell (like sperm and eggs) and when this meets another piece of mycelium of the right polarity, it forms the secondary myclium which has two sets of chromsomes (like your body). Under the right chemical and heat conditions this secondary mycelium will form a fruit body (mushroom), and start the process all over again.

 

[Shewie]

Thanks Fiona


On another note, I've had a couple of cramp balls drying out for a few weeks on a shelf. I've noticed they are emitting lots of black dust/fluff, is this the spores coming out or just part of the decomposition process.

 

[Ogri the trog]

I was told that every species on the surface of the planet relies to some degree on fungi for the take up of nutrients. I think the guy mentioned six seperate fungi on certain grasses before they'll even germinate.
One of the most noticeable that was pointed out on the foray was on the stump of a felled conifer - the fungi begin life with the tree and support it throughout its life, then when the tree is brought down, stops the stump from rotting straight away and produces the orange antler like fungi that are reasonably common in managed woodlands - which, in turn, produce the spores to help the next generation of that species of tree through its life.

So it may be that the cramp ball is the frujiting body of the fungus that is necessary for ash trees to germinate and take up nutrients.

ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[xylaria]

Instresting point Ogri one the points that permaculturists make is that we breaking up the soil with conventual gardening and farming methods by plowing up the soil. Using horse, cow and sheep manure puts quite alot of germinated spores back into the soil.

From what I know fungi that appear on dead wood to help break it down are differant spieces that form around the roots that help a tree grow.

 

[Mikey P]

Ah, symbiosis......

Just been doing some work on evolution and it never ceases to amaze me that certain species will evolve from a narrow gene pool to survive only in highly specific conditions.

We could possibly trace cramp balls back to a single fungus on an Ash, and the fungus had, say, an enzyme mutation that allowed it to gain a slight advantage over other fungi from the same species on that tree.

Have been fascinated by all the Darwin stuff on TV recently and I'm constantly amazed at how life - and certainly fungi in this case - adapt to their environments.

In terms of the burnt birch issue, I would propose that the damage to the birch bark allows the spores to attach and grow. Question then is, why doesn't this happen with other trees too?