Feather Sticks and a Sharp Knife

[Emdiesse]

So, feather sticks are something I felt I always needed practice to. I just could not cut thin curly shavings off the stick without slipping and chopping the darned feathers off! And they were too thick. I thought my knife was sharp, I thought I was sharpening it correctly, but then I tried something different!

I resharpened my mora following the existing scandi grind it came with and not so suprisingly, feathersticks became instantly easier to do!

So, anyone struggling with feathersticks... Sharpen your knife (and properly)! Pretty obvious really

Secondly, My mora is now sharp(er) but how on earth do you guys get it sooo sharp that you can shave the hairs off your arm! I am only using one cheap kitchencraft whetstone so I guess I need many different grit stones and a final strop before it'll be razor sharp.

I notice many people go with the cheap option of wet and dry paper stuck to a wooden board... How long do these 'stones' last. Or is it a false economy, would the extra £ on diamond/ceramic sharpener or some japanese whetstones or otherwise eventually cost less than the repeated replacement of cheap wet and dry paper.

Thanks,
Matt

 

[John Fenna]

One pack of poundshop wet and dry plus a leather strop made from off-cuts of wood and leather has kept my knife collection shaving sharp for about 2 years so far ... and there is lots of the paper left!

 

[Ogri the trog]

Stropping is the stage that will take your blade to hair-popping sharpness, but like many other skills, you need to learn to do it correctly.

A "backed" strop (one that is glued to a wooden board will be easier to use that one that is hooked over a branch and pulled tight - though you'll soon see how tight it'll need to be pulled.
Use an abrasive paste - metal polish, autosol, chrome polish, even tooth-paste will work then take your time polishing the edge as sharp as you want it to be. Take great care when turning the blade over so that you don't "roll" the very fine cutting edge and you should see results like folk talk about!

ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[Emdiesse]

One pack of poundshop wet and dry plus a leather strop made from off-cuts of wood and leather has kept my knife collection shaving sharp for about 2 years so far ... and there is lots of the paper left!

Cracking, so even the cheap stuff lasts. I just had the impression that after a couple of months use the knife would have taken all the grit of the paper and made it baby smooth. Where as for £ on a couple of stones could even out last the knife and so could be a worthy investment. However, if you're pretty certain that some cheap wet and dry lasts and does the trick as well then I think it's a no brainer!

So, getting the knife to the shaving sharp point. Is that just a case of multiple grits and following the same grind the knife came with 8 times each side for each variation of grit from coarsest to finest before following it up with a stop on the back of a belt in the opposite direction to which you sharpen (i.e push away to sharpen, pull towards to strop)?

Cheers

 

[Ogri the trog]

........
So, getting the knife to the shaving sharp point. Is that just a case of multiple grits and following the same grind the knife came with 8 times each side for each variation of grit from coarsest to finest before following it up with a stop on the back of a belt in the opposite direction to which you sharpen (i.e push away to sharpen, pull towards to strop)?

Cheers

The actual number of strokes may change as the grit changes but that's the basic idea, yes!

Ogri the trog

 

[Emdiesse]

Stropping is the stage that will take your blade to hair-popping sharpness, but like many other skills, you need to learn to do it correctly.

A "backed" strop (one that is glued to a wooden board will be easier to use that one that is hooked over a branch and pulled tight - though you'll soon see how tight it'll need to be pulled.
Use an abrasive paste - metal polish, autosol, chrome polish, even tooth-paste will work then take your time polishing the edge as sharp as you want it to be. Take great care when turning the blade over so that you don't "roll" the very fine cutting edge and you should see results like folk talk about!

ATB

Ogri the trog

cheers for the tips. I guess the razor sharp edge is very short lived when you begin to baton wood and other brutish bushcraft activities

Anyway, I suppose this is where not being very follicly endowed facially comes into it's own! My poor chin'll get colder than yours, but I won't be attacking that perfectly fine edge with a course beard.

 

[ged]

cheers for the tips. I guess the razor sharp edge is very short lived when you begin to baton wood and other brutish bushcraft activities ...

Well you wouldn't try to split logs with your razor blade and then expect to get a good shave with it, would you?

There's too much emphasis on popping hairs. I have no need to shave with my knives but I do split quite a lot of kindling with some of them -- sometimes even with the multi-tool on my belt.

So most of the time I want a durable edge, not one that will briefly impress.

 

[Elines]

Some things you might find of interest.

This video is in the BCUSA course

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hE8_HIdBZWs&feature=player_embedded


Dont' get too hung up on his references to convex etc.

Two main things (in my view) to take from it are:

• what you are aiming for is a secondary edge to give strength to the sharp edge - a picture is at 2.49 mins of one of his other videos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qlM2JDJkQY&lr=1
  In your case it will be a secondary/micro edge on the skandi grind of your Mora
• this bloke uses the same basic method for sharpening as he does for stropping ie dragging the blade backwards

I find dragging the blade backwards easier than pushing it forwards and you might do too - worth a try.

The other thing you might find easier than the normal method is, when dragging the blade, to start at the pointy end rather than on the 'flat' /handle part of the blade. I find it easier to move from the 'correct' angle of the pointy end to the 'flat' angle of the main blade, than it is to do the other way round. Can't remember where I picked this up from so can't show a video. But again worth a try (if you can understand what I am going on about).

You will see in the second video that he prefers a strop that is not fixed to a board/resting on a flat surface but I think most beginners (including me, which I still am) find it easier to use a strop on a board)

 

[Stringmaker]

The best bit of advice I got concerning feather sticks (which I am still pretty ropey at producing) was to push the blade against the stick as you cut. This gives the fine control over the speed of the cut and helps you stop short at the bottom of the stroke.

That and making it a gentle slicing cut as opposed to simply pushing made all the difference to me.

 

[Emdiesse]

A durable edge sounds good, I have heard about micro bevels before but haven't looked into them. I'll watch that video when I am not at work . I have heard reverence to microbevels before when suggested by someone that they use a single edge and then use microbevels when out on the field, before putting the single edge back on when they have more time and a bigger whetstone.

I am 100% for having a more durable edge given my knife is a general purpose, rather than shaving. But feel If I can put a razor edge on a knife it'll take me one step closer to understanding how to sharpen a knife more effectively... then I can worry about the fancy secondary edges, microbevels, concave, convex, and whatever other fancy grinds there are

 

[Elines]

As I understand it (and each time I think I do something else crops up to tell me that I don't) a micro bevel is a very small version of a secondary edge and the micro bevel is important (?essential) if you are to have a long lasting edge in a carbon steel knife, regardless of the grind (except possiblly convex, which in effect has a built in long-wearing design). They may be less important with a stainless steel knife which is harder wearing.

(sits back and waits to be corrected and so learn the next bit of knife knowledge)

 

[DavidJT]

Find it's best to lock your arm straight at the elbow, and bend from the waist. Gives more control IMHO.

 

[bushcraftmyway]

speaking from my personal experience, to put a secondary bevel on a scandi is to ruin the blade for fine work... and a microbevel has a way of unexpectedly becoming secondary bevel.

to keep your knife sharp (again: that works for me, you'll have to try out), all you need is a (one) decent stone and the determination to sharpen your knife very often (almost every time you use it). this way, you'll need to only pass the blade on the stone a couple of times and you'll have a razor edge. in other words: if you don't let it to become dull, there's not much sharpening to be done.

one more thing: be gentle! easy does it...

maybe you'll find this usefull: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukNdpDAEqAM

 

[luckylee]

Some things you might find of interest.

This video is in the BCUSA course

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hE8_HIdBZWs&feature=player_embedded


Dont' get too hung up on his references to convex etc.

Two main things (in my view) to take from it are:

• what you are aiming for is a secondary edge to give strength to the sharp edge - a picture is at 2.49 mins of one of his other videos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qlM2JDJkQY&lr=1
  In your case it will be a secondary/micro edge on the skandi grind of your Mora
• this bloke uses the same basic method for sharpening as he does for stropping ie dragging the blade backwards

I find dragging the blade backwards easier than pushing it forwards and you might do too - worth a try.

The other thing you might find easier than the normal method is, when dragging the blade, to start at the pointy end rather than on the 'flat' /handle part of the blade. I find it easier to move from the 'correct' angle of the pointy end to the 'flat' angle of the main blade, than it is to do the other way round. Can't remember where I picked this up from so can't show a video. But again worth a try (if you can understand what I am going on about).

You will see in the second video that he prefers a strop that is not fixed to a board/resting on a flat surface but I think most beginners (including me, which I still am) find it easier to use a strop on a board)

Glad you are still enjoying your sharpening Chris.
take care.
lee.

 

[Elines]

As I was saying ....!!!!

 

[hermitical]

is anything else apart from leather suitable to use as a strop ?

 

[luckylee]

is anything else apart from leather suitable to use as a strop ?

Yes mate card board is great, and denim jeans is even better, it's a 50 50 with me with leather and denim ant make up my mind which I like more, you still have to apply your favoured compound tho

 

[sargey]

autosol on the inside of a cornflake box works great for a strop.

don't confuse a sharp edge with a fragile edge. a well polished edge with fewer imperfections will last longer than a mediocre "toothy" edge. each microscopic tooth is a potential stress riser once you've got the knack of getting your edge properly sharp, you'll start wondering what all the fuss was about.

the other thing to consider is just how you use your knife, what gets it blunt? use it to cut, not to scrape for example.

i generally don't like the locked elbow technique for feather sticks. if you need to stick that much force into a feather stick, you're either being too greedy, trying to cut too much wood, or you knife's too blunt, learn to sharpen!

cheers, and.

 

[Elines]

Glad you are still enjoying your sharpening Chris.
take care.
lee.

Yes I am Lee - Your lessonette (if there is such a word!) gave me the basics and I have been experimenting with minor tweaks. Now even if I don't get my knife sharp first time, I can work out why, correct what I have done and get it sharp again

 

[John Fenna]

Cracking, so even the cheap stuff lasts. I just had the impression that after a couple of months use the knife would have taken all the grit of the paper and made it baby smooth. Where as for £ on a couple of stones could even out last the knife and so could be a worthy investment. However, if you're pretty certain that some cheap wet and dry lasts and does the trick as well then I think it's a no brainer!

So, getting the knife to the shaving sharp point. Is that just a case of multiple grits and following the same grind the knife came with 8 times each side for each variation of grit from coarsest to finest before following it up with a stop on the back of a belt in the opposite direction to which you sharpen (i.e push away to sharpen, pull towards to strop)?

Cheers

I should say that once you have the edge you want then regular stropping on the the leather means that you hardly ever need to go back to the coarser papers unless you ding the edge of your knife - the papers do wear a lot faster than a stone in hours of actual usage